87 no spark with spout in?

[cola8d8]

I have an 87 Mustang. With a inline spark tester between the coil and distributor I get no spark with the spout connecter installed.

I get spark with the spout connector out but will not start, any ideas?

Car was running fine then died on road and has not started since. I had the ignition module from the MSD billet distrib tested ok and I have changed the ignition switch

 

[Goldcuffs]

I'm almost positive that if you gain spark with the spout removed then it's a problem with the ignition module. You probably don't have injector pulse either, and that's why it still won't start.

 

[jrichker]

No spark with the SPOUT in and spark with the SPOUT out is usually a PIP sensor failure. Dump the codes and look for code 14.

Codes may be present in the computer even if the Check Engine light isn’t on.

Here's the link to dump the computer codes with only a jumper wire or paper clip and the check engine light, or test light or voltmeter. I’ve used it for years, and it works great. You watch the flashing test lamp or Check Engine Light and count the flashes.

See http://www.troublecodes.net/Ford/

If your car is an 86-88 stang, you'll have to use the test lamp or voltmeter method. There is no functional check engine light on the 86-88's except possibly the Cali Mass Air cars.

89 through 95 cars have a working Check Engine light. Watch it instead of using a test lamp.

Codes have different answers if the engine is running from the answers that it has when the engine isn't running. It helps a lot to know if you had the engine running when you ran the test.

Trouble codes are either 2 digit or 3 digit, there are no cars that use both 2 digit codes and 3 digit codes.

For those who are intimidated by all the wires & connections, see http://www.actron.com/product_detail.php?pid=16153 for what a typical hand scanner looks like. Normal retail price is about $30 or so at AutoZone or Wal-Mart.

Or for a nicer scanner see http://www.midwayautosupply.com/pc-7208-90-equus-digital-ford-code-reader-3145.aspx – It has a 3 digit LCD display so that you don’t have to count flashes or beeps.. Cost is $30.

No code 14, then replace the TFI first.

The PIP is a Hall Effect magnetic sensor that triggers the TFI and injectors. There is a shutter wheel alternately covers and uncovers a fixed magnet as it rotates. The change in the magnetic field triggers the sensor. A failing PIP sensor will often set code 14 in the computer. They are often heat sensitive, increasing the failure rate as the temperature increases.

The PIP sensor is mounted in the bottom of the distributor under the shutter wheel. In stock Ford distributors, you have to press the gear off the distributor shaft to get access to it to replace it. Most guys just end up replacing the distributor with a reman unit for about $75 exchange

 

[cola8d8]

Thanks for the info jrichker. The "problem" car is an 87 with the cobra mass air conversion kit, MSD distributor and msd 6AL. My results have been the same with the 6AL or bypassing it. Got tired of messing with it today. I will check for codes tomorrow. I do have a all original 93 that I can swap distributors and see if my problem goes away.

 

[cola8d8]

Jrich, I am at a dead end now and want to know if you can point me in another direction. From a perfectly running 93 5.0 I removed the distributor, coil, spout connector and "computer" and put them in the problem 87 car. The 87 still had the same problems (no spark from coil with spout in, spark but no start with spout out).

I also took the problem car 93 cobra "computer" and put in the running known good 93 and it ran fine.

I tried to pull codes with the $30 tester from the parts store in the 87 problem car with its "original" 93 cobra "computer" and got nothing. This is kind of weird, I should have got something because there is on smog pump or related stuff. (still has egr).

 

[jrichker]

At this point, you have wiring problems. Has the car run OK since you did the Mass Air conversion?

 

[cola8d8]

yes it has ran fine, a little poor idle while cold. It has been about 1.5-2 years since the mass air conversion but the car has been sitting for about 8+ months. During this time I have just started it up about every 2-3 weeks and let it run for a while.

 

[jrichker]

You should get a code 11 (two single flashes in succession). This says that the computer's internal workings are OK, and that the wiring to put the computer into diagnostic mode is good.