A hint at what is to come (2006/7 Cobra)

03 SVT VERT · Sep 18, 2004

First I was told by the head Ford guy at the NY Auto show the next Cobra will be a N/A GT350, then I read this:

http://media.ford.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=18927

Which speaks of all that has happened in the past that has rehappened (with the Ford GT [44] and Cobra concept),with a lot spoken about how the 350 was Shelby's first mustang with Ford and that it was made to compete with Vettes. I don't know, but I am really having a strong feeling about the next Cobra being a GT350, with a 500 later in the works. Everything is rumor right now, but I can say that I am almost 100% certain the next Cobra will be a GT350 just with what I have heard and read.

I am wondering if the GT350 will be a N/A 400hp-440hp car, with the GT500 having the same motor, but blown. That seems like a simple thing to do and it just seems like something Ford would do with Shelby having imput. Now, I know a lot of work is going into 5L and greater motors, so I wonder if it will have the 5.4L like the lightning. Can 400-440hp be made N/A from a 5.4? Then blown that would make around 500hp like the new Lightning right? That would put it right in there in Corvette competition territory, just like said in the article about the original GT350. (With the 350 being faster then the base Corvette and the 500 being right at the Z06 level?)

one2gamble · Sep 18, 2004

they can make 440 from the 5L cammer, but to compete with a vette they need to shed some pounds. The 350R models had no backseat so if they shrink the car down a few inches and ditch the seat, add a GOOD irs and shed some pounds in other areas a 430hp cobra would be a screamer.

03 SVT VERT · Sep 18, 2004

The 5.0L cammer made a non-street legal 440hp. If your not street legal you can make quite a bit more power then street legal. The 5.4 is already a street approved motor in more then one form from Ford. The Cammer is an option, but it will cost a lot more to make that street legal then to use the 5.4 which has more potential anyway.

Anyway, the manual trans GT weighs 3,500lbs, with the new vette weighing 3,200lbs, the new Vette also has 3.42:1 gearing with the GT having 3.55:1 (with the Cobra probibly being more then 3.55). So, I think:

3,500lbs 440hp/450lb-ft tq (speculation) with 3.55:1 gears or better could pull about the same numbers as a:

3,200lbs 400hp/400lb-ft tq 3.42:1 gears on equivelent tires.

Get the Cobra down to the same weight or close to it by taking out the rear seats and clearing out the trunk and it will make better numbers no problem.

one2gamble · Sep 18, 2004

but if you want to compete with a vette you have to do it on the road course as well. The vette is a great all around car, the cobra strives to be the same with a greater bang for you buck. If they are going to go through the trouble of going after the vette it better handle like one. In my opinion it has to shed some weight in order to do this in a better more controlled way.

03 SVT VERT · Sep 18, 2004

I'm not talking on a road course, i'm just talking 0-60mph and 0-1320ft times. Getting the Cobra to handle will be a lot harder to do then just working the straight numbers. It is possible and they showed that with the concept racer, but due to the physical size and design difference it would be expensive. Not really possible for production. I figure if the Vette keeps the handeling side of things, and the Cobra Stang keeps the straight speed side of things then they will beat each other in their respective areas, so both can say they have the better car depending on what you put more emphasis on.

Basically:
Vette: More expensive and Handles slightly better, True Sports Car (Better as a weekend driver)
Cobra: Less expensive and Faster on straight, Pony Sports Car (Better for family or daily use)

I know the original 350 was made to beat the vette in road racing, but the Vette now is designed to be a road racer and does it extremely well, it isn't made to be as much of an all around car like the Cobra. Who knows though, they showed with the concept that they can use carbon fiber and other things to reduce the weight a good amount. They might just be able to pull it off, but the price between the Vette and Cobra would be very close, which wouldn't be good. The cobra needs to stay about $10,000 less then the Vette to be good competition.

STUD · Sep 18, 2004

future cobra

one2gamble said:
but if you want to compete with a vette you have to do it on the road course as well. The vette is a great all around car, the cobra strives to be the same with a greater bang for you buck. If they are going to go through the trouble of going after the vette it better handle like one. In my opinion it has to shed some weight in order to do this in a better more controlled way.

First of all, I don't care if the next mustang cobra can compete with a vette. If it does, none of us will be able to afford it, so quit pipe-dreaming. The mustang cobra is an awesome Muscle Car, not a bow-tie corporate machine like a vette. The way you guys are talking about the next cobra being 500hp is crazy. If it is, you'll never be able to afford one, and Ford will lose the whole mustang cobra market.

I want fast cheap HP, like I find in my 99 cobra. The car is modded with bolt-ons, and beats STI'S, 350z's,M3's,c-5 vett's, and those overpriced dual x-haust AMG mercedes, etc.....I'm talking raw bottom end, off the line HP. I can't handle like those cars, but I don't care. I love the rush of straight line racing and acceleration. That's why I bought this car, I want the rush of power from a dead stop, I don't care about mountain curves or figure 8's.

I talked with the gen mngr at the dealership, and he said the same thing that I figured he'd say. The next cobra is not gonna be some overpriced compete with the vette car. It's gonna be close to what they are now, but maybe a tad more, otherwise, people are just gonna say forget it and buy a 55k zo6.

It's gonna be a NA forged 5.4, or a 5.0 cammer motor, I really don't think it's gonna be s/c'd, but who the hell knows. I'm thinking maybe a 400-425hp NA and forged, so it will be s/c ready.

one2gamble · Sep 18, 2004

we are talking about the top of the line mustangs potential, even if its costs 45grand there will still be relatively high hp cars that come in the 30-40grand range.

oh FYI the gen mngr at the dealership doesnt know anymore than we do

03 SVT VERT · Sep 18, 2004

The 500hp version is completely possible. With Shelby working with Ford again we may see a few more special editions then just the standard Cobra. If it is produced it won't be a car like the Cobra, designed for the average car enthusiest, it would be a limited edition collector car with the Shelby name. Think of it as having a Cobra and a Cobra R from the same year. The GT350 would be the base cobra, with a possible GT500 being like the Cobra R limited production of like 300 or even less. Remember, the Vette will be made in 400, 500, and limited edition 600hp forms, the GTO will be in 400 and 500hp forms, the Charger will have 425hp in base form. In order to stay competitive in the Pony car class by 2006/7 Ford will need to make a 500hp version.

351CJ · Sep 18, 2004

Anyone care to guess what this is all about?

http://www.corral.net/forums/showthread.php?t=548968

Besides there orginal GT-350 white with blue stripes scheme, you may want to look at the tow hook, hood pins, racing seats and full roll cage.

CatmanJJ · Sep 18, 2004

351CJ said:
Anyone care to guess what this is all about?

http://www.corral.net/forums/showthread.php?t=548968

Besides there orginal GT-350 white with blue stripes scheme, you may want to look at the tow hook, hood pins, racing seats and full roll cage.

Holy crap, nice find dude.

Omegalock · Sep 18, 2004

Has anybody figured what that thing is yet? I saw that on Brad's site a couple days ago. I hope it's an SE and not just a modified GT but I'm not feeling too confident about that. But that is a sweet color scheme.

03 SVT VERT · Sep 18, 2004

Well, that is definately a GT350 by the color scheme. As long as it is not a photoshop then it would have to be something made by Ford, be it just for racing or for testing. It seems like we got another "hint" by FoMoCo. If it does come out in street legal form looking kinda like that I know I would buy one.

SVTdriver · Sep 18, 2004

Judging from the other pics of it. I don't think it is a photoshop. But I also don't think it is a test mule for any avriation. Another photo shows the Ford racing logo on it. My assumption would be that this is the car to develope some Ford racing parts for a possible factory sponsored SCCA race car. Though that is just 1 possible take on it.

texgt · Sep 18, 2004

Well that would just about do it.
FORD - ditch the cage,
SELL THIS CAR.

03 SVT VERT · Sep 18, 2004

They don't even have to ditch the cage, I'll take one with a cage as long as I can drive it on the road.

351CJ · Sep 18, 2004

SVTdriver said:
Another photo shows the Ford racing logo on it.

Where is that photo posted?

Omegalock · Sep 18, 2004

On Brad's Mustang site. Just saw it.
http://forums.bradbarnett.net/index.php?showtopic=5787&st=20

But yeah this thing looks great. Somebody should just photoshop a ducktail spoiler on the back of that thing and it'd be just about perfect.

SVTdriver · Sep 18, 2004

Follow the link on brad's site to a site called rice haters (I think). It has other photos.

Jpjr · Sep 19, 2004

I think a lot of you guys are pipe dreamers. One of the guys above had it right.. Ford isn't just going to give away horsepower. If the Cobra is going to compete with the Vette, its going to cost as much as a Vette. $45 grand will get you Vette horsepower, but as we can all see the new Mustang is an aerodynamic flop. The Vette will burn it in handling and probably ways 2/3 as much.

Right now the GT has 550hp and costs 150k. They aren't going to sell a 500hp Cobra for under 50k. It's not going to happen. I would max out a new Cobra at 430-450hp. Anything more would not be good business.

SVTdriver · Sep 19, 2004

Jpjr said:
I think a lot of you guys are pipe dreamers. One of the guys above had it right.. Ford isn't just going to give away horsepower. If the Cobra is going to compete with the Vette, its going to cost as much as a Vette. $45 grand will get you Vette horsepower, but as we can all see the new Mustang is an aerodynamic flop. The Vette will burn it in handling and probably ways 2/3 as much.

Right now the GT has 550hp and costs 150k. They aren't going to sell a 500hp Cobra for under 50k. It's not going to happen. I would max out a new Cobra at 430-450hp. Anything more would not be good business.

While I agree with some of what you said. Where did you find the aerodynamic #'s for the 05? Since you seem to have tehm please post them for all of us to see.

A hint at what is to come (2006/7 Cobra)

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