AFR 185s

fiveoho · Jun 15, 2006

Jason@AFR said:
Hey guys, figured I would drop in my 2 cents….
Fiveoho, it was good talking to you, call me back anytime.
The other person you spoke to was Scott, he is right and I agree that you have a good combo. Until you mentioned the fact you only wanted to turn 55-5600RPM, at which point with that cam I doubt you would have even seen peak power yet. Especially when considering the rest of that combo you certainly wouldn't be using the better part of the "Curve".
I am ok with the decision to run the 185's on a 306, there are quite a few guys that have run them on 302's after notching pistons and 306's without almost any complaint of the fabled "No power" down low. I am sure most will agree your power curve, drivability, MPH, and ET are all because of your COMBINATION, not because you bolted on 1 part. So with that said, why would someone look at only one part to effectively "Kill" the combination? I do feel that you should have gotten 165's, but does it make the difference in the world? No. Are you still going to have great power either way? Yes.
Not for nothing, but you wont know which is better until you have the opportunity to use them on the same set-up back-to-back, which is probably why we don't get complaints on the larger head small motor set-up, the owners didn't have anything to compare it to except stock.
You have a great combo, just not for what you were going for.

Give me a call or drop me an e-mail if you have any further questions, Jason Dow

didnt expect to see you post...glad you did. im going to try and give you a call back this evening if at all possible. i do appreciate you helping me. i want to talk more about cam selection and possibly doing away with the 306 idea and going 331. i was just a little confused yesterday when i called and spoke you then scott. scott was a help to, i just felt like i sort of got 2 different opinions. i guess you were just saying for what i want, that combo isnt in my best interest.

if i decided to keep the same combo in 306 form and change the camshaft...will that make a world of difference as far as getting that power in a broader curve?

if i decide to go 331 can i keep the exact setup with the TFS 2 cam included and be more suited for what i want? will those extra cubes of a 331 help put the power in a better broader place? or should i still choose another cam?

thanks again!

Jason@AFR · Jun 15, 2006

fiveoho said:
didnt expect to see you post...glad you did. im going to try and give you a call back this evening if at all possible. i do appreciate you helping me. i want to talk more about cam selection and possibly doing away with the 306 idea and going 331. i was just a little confused yesterday when i called and spoke you then scott. scott was a help to, i just felt like i sort of got 2 different opinions. i guess you were just saying for what i want, that combo isnt in my best interest.

if i decided to keep the same combo in 306 form and change the camshaft...will that make a world of difference as far as getting that power in a broader curve?

if i decide to go 331 can i keep the exact setup with the TFS 2 cam included and be more suited for what i want? will those extra cubes of a 331 help put the power in a better broader place? or should i still choose another cam?

thanks again!

No problem, I don't typically post, but since I already spoke to you I decided to step-in.

The cam change would be the biggest single improvement, just to target the rpm range where you want it. Will it make more power, NO, will it make more power and torque under 55-5600 rpm, YES. That is all I was getting at.
Being that you have our upgraded valvetrain I would go with a XE266HR (Part number 35-514-8) from Comp cams if you are looking for another shelf piece. My own personal opinion, spend the little extra cash and call Ed Curtis at Flowtech induction (401) 828-9302.
As far as the added inches....You already know the answer to that, LOL. Cubes are your friend! But why not go to a 347? One of the only THEORIES behind a 331 being better then a 347 is the ability to handle RPM, guess what you are not going to do? Turn alot of RPM. If you went with the 347 assuming similar desired RPM, you could then keep the TFS Stage 2 you already have as the inches will tame it down some.
I also don't want this to turn into 331 vs. 347....I am referring to THIS PERSONS combination, not speaking in general, 331 has other advantages, but not in this case.

Talk to you soon, Jason

Killercanary · Jun 15, 2006

Thanks Jason!

mootang · Jun 15, 2006

sounds like some good advise there! I think i would have to agree with everything jason said!

also why don't you want a higher rpm power range?

fiveoho · Jun 15, 2006

thanks jason. i do appreciate all the input. hopefully i can give u a ring here soon

fiveoho · Jun 15, 2006

mootang said:
sounds like some good advise there! I think i would have to agree with everything jason said!

also why don't you want a higher rpm power range?

its not that i dont....im just not sure i will use it. my driving habits are pretty light. im not one to be hard on my stuff. i dont think ive ever revved my factory 5.0 past 5300 or so

think it will be different with another combo?

Green 94 5.0 · Jun 15, 2006

fiveoho said:
probably a dumb question.....if i called DSS up or whoever and said i wanted a 331 shortblock, do they come balanced? if so are they 28oz or 50oz ( factory is 50, right ?) ? or does the customer specify the balance they want?

the typical is 28oz and that is what you will get unless you tell them you want it balanced differently. i bought a nearly complete engine from chp and the price was reasonable and they werent a day past their scheduled completion and ship date. i would recommend them to anyone. as far as dss goes, when i was shopping for the motor, dss said they were going to fax me my quote and never did. that made my decision final to go with chp, and as i said already, im glad i did.

fiveoho · Jun 16, 2006

Green 94 5.0 said:
the typical is 28oz and that is what you will get unless you tell them you want it balanced differently. i bought a nearly complete engine from chp and the price was reasonable and they werent a day past their scheduled completion and ship date. i would recommend them to anyone. as far as dss goes, when i was shopping for the motor, dss said they were going to fax me my quote and never did. that made my decision final to go with chp, and as i said already, im glad i did.

ive called dss. probably try and give chp a ring and do some comparing

Killercanary · Jun 16, 2006

Also call Rick at http://www.rnhperformance.net He is building my new dart based shortblock right now.

fiveoho · Jun 16, 2006

Killercanary said:
Also call Rick at http://www.rnhperformance.net He is building my new dart based shortblock right now.

might just do that

Green 94 5.0 · Jun 16, 2006

Killercanary said:
Also call Rick at http://www.rnhperformance.net He is building my new dart based shortblock right now.

the more i think about it, the more i regret not going with the dart block. i went all forged insides in a stock block. so i basically have internals that can handle double the horsepower of what the production block can handle. at the time another $1800 was out of my price range, but now i really wish i had done it 100% from the beginning.

Therian · Jun 16, 2006

Killercanary said:
Also call Rick at http://www.rnhperformance.net He is building my new dart based shortblock right now.

so you said you didn't want to reveal anything...but...let me take a guess

Dart Sportsman (maybe iron eagle?)
AFR 185s
RPM II intake
FTI Cam

only thing I can't figure out is the rotating assembly and the power adder. I'm going to guess a SCAT 347 rotating assembly and maybe a turbo setup

how far off am I paul? (this sounds like the exact setup I want to make)

Jason@AFR · Jun 16, 2006

Therian said:
so you said you didn't want to reveal anything...but...let me take a guess

Dart Sportsman (maybe iron eagle?)
AFR 185s
RPM II intake
FTI Cam

only thing I can't figure out is the rotating assembly and the power adder. I'm going to guess a SCAT 347 rotating assembly and maybe a turbo setup

how far off am I paul? (this sounds like the exact setup I want to make)

Way off, I know his combo....I will reveal, Sorry Paul.
Dart Honda block, 1.8L total displacement, Naturally aspirated, should make about 37 peak hp at 9000rpm. It would make double the power, but he is sticking with a shelf cam.

Sorry Paul, cat is out of the bag NOW!!!!! LOL

fiveoho · Jun 17, 2006

Jason@AFR said:
Way off, I know his combo....I will reveal, Sorry Paul.
Dart Honda block, 1.8L total displacement, Naturally aspirated, should make about 37 peak hp at 9000rpm. It would make double the power, but he is sticking with a shelf cam.

Sorry Paul, cat is out of the bag NOW!!!!! LOL

Green 94 5.0 · Jun 17, 2006

Jason@AFR said:
Way off, I know his combo....I will reveal, Sorry Paul.
Dart Honda block, 1.8L total displacement, Naturally aspirated, should make about 37 peak hp at 9000rpm. It would make double the power, but he is sticking with a shelf cam.

Sorry Paul, cat is out of the bag NOW!!!!! LOL

sweet.....that thing is going to rip.....

VibrantRedGT · Jun 17, 2006

That's not the combo he told me about. I believe now its a rotary. Paul wants 12,000 rpm launches. Jason@AFR just designed heads for it. The R&D took 12 minutes. Paul says Dart aluminum but that's just a decoy. The block is wrapped in Aluminum foil. It disapates the heat better. Good luck with the 81 cubes Paul! For those at his local track, bring ear protection.

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