I just dropped my Mustang by an inch and a half with H&R sports. Do I need to worry about bumpsteer ?
Haven't driven it yet cause it's not off the stands.
Haven't driven it yet cause it's not off the stands.
Any bumpsteer for an 1 1/2" drop ???
- Thread starter 4.6andSlicks
- Start date
BennyBlown2v
New Member
IMO, yes for sure. Lowering your car more than 1/2" or so without correcting for bumpsteer will have negative handling effects and make the car drive like crap. However, if you don't corner carve and/or like to turn much you won't notice a big difference with that drop. Getting a proper static alignment dialed in will also minimize the negative effects of toe change you would feel on a day to day basis.
You can buy a bump steer kit. Have the alignment shop install them when they do the alignment. Or save cash, do it yourself and drive it there. You could also save cash and try offset rack bushings instead, but I don't know how much they change the rack when lowering a car that much.
BennyBlown2v
New Member
IMO offset rack bushings shouldn't be used on a stock K-member car, there is no need. The problem with installing a bumpteer kit yourself, or at your local alignment shop, is that to correctly dial in (reduce) bumpsteer you need the proper gauge setup. 99% of alignment shops are NOT going to have the right stuff to do it. A short term fix is to just put the tie rods parallel to the leading edge of the LCA, but that isn't exactly the most accurate way to do it
IMO a proper alignment makes even a stock-ish suspension car WAY more fun to drive than a crappy toe-and go job - so spend the money and either learn to do it yourself, or take it to a shop that specializes in alignments and high performance/race suspension setups ONLY.Again, JMO but I've been through it more than once
I greatly appreciate everyone's input but if you look at just these four answers, you see the problem I'm having. With the number of Mustangs being lowered out there, you should be able to go to a website, put in the year and model of stang, how much you lowered it and they would sell you the exact parts you need (if you need any).
It's frustrating. You're offseting the front end by an exact amount that 50,000 other people have already done. There should be 1 answer to the issue.
It's frustrating. You're offseting the front end by an exact amount that 50,000 other people have already done. There should be 1 answer to the issue.
BennyBlown2v
New Member
Bumpsteer is dynamic, not static. It is different depending on how the K-member and other suspension components fit to the frame (and even the shape of the frame). There are plenty of general rules of thumb to go on to minimize the effects of bumpsteer and reduce bump (compression) travel toe change (the cause of bump steer)...many swear by rack bushings and ball joints. I don't. I had offset rack bushings and they were pathetic and fit poorly; handling was erratic and overall crappy. Tie rod end bumpsteer kits are the way to go, hands down! Ford Racing sells a kit even...that one only has a couple settings so it's not as "hard" to set - though settings will differ from side to side so simply matching up the tie rods to LCA's is not sufficient for a cornering snob like me.
Do whatever you want, but IMO offset rack bushings are a bandaid fix and should be a last resort (ESPECIALLY ****ty urethane ones).
Bumpsteer is dynamic, not static. It is different depending on how the K-member and other suspension components fit to the frame (and even the shape of the frame). There are plenty of general rules of thumb to go on to minimize the effects of bumpsteer and reduce bump (compression) travel toe change (the cause of bump steer)...many swear by rack bushings and ball joints. I don't. I had offset rack bushings and they were pathetic and fit poorly; handling was erratic and overall crappy. Tie rod end bumpsteer kits are the way to go, hands down! Ford Racing sells a kit even...that one only has a couple settings so it's not as "hard" to set - though settings will differ from side to side so simply matching up the tie rods to LCA's is not sufficient for a cornering snob like me.
Do whatever you want, but IMO offset rack bushings are a bandaid fix and should be a last resort (ESPECIALLY ****ty urethane ones).
Well Benny, you sold me on "No Rack Bushings". Plus I was under there tonight and it looked like a PITA to change.
Now I don't road race or anything like that but I'm thinking more of a deer jumping out while I'm going 75 down the interstate. Will I notice the poorer handling with an inch and a half drop? Without all the bumpsteer gauges and setup, is there a rule of thumb or part number I can buy and install that will get me close? I'd hate to add something that makes it worse only to find I should have just left it alone.
I've decided the only way to do this right is to do the bumpsteer measurements and adjust each side accordingly.
BlackDiamond, thanks for the input but this is my concern with doing what you did. You added 3 mods to get rid of bumpsteer and you state with "day-to-day driving, theres barely any bumpsteer to be felt".
With all that money and effort, there should be none. It's actually possible these made it worse from what I've been reading this week.
BlackDiamond, thanks for the input but this is my concern with doing what you did. You added 3 mods to get rid of bumpsteer and you state with "day-to-day driving, theres barely any bumpsteer to be felt".
With all that money and effort, there should be none. It's actually possible these made it worse from what I've been reading this week.
Bumpsteer is dynamic, not static. It is different depending on how the K-member and other suspension components fit to the frame (and even the shape of the frame). There are plenty of general rules of thumb to go on to minimize the effects of bumpsteer and reduce bump (compression) travel toe change (the cause of bump steer)...many swear by rack bushings and ball joints. I don't. I had offset rack bushings and they were pathetic and fit poorly; handling was erratic and overall crappy. Tie rod end bumpsteer kits are the way to go, hands down! Ford Racing sells a kit even...that one only has a couple settings so it's not as "hard" to set - though settings will differ from side to side so simply matching up the tie rods to LCA's is not sufficient for a cornering snob like me.
Do whatever you want, but IMO offset rack bushings are a bandaid fix and should be a last resort (ESPECIALLY ****ty urethane ones).
This is good solid and accurate information. Rack bushings do no more than help at best. There is no measurement, there is no calculation for how low your car is. And only the super low cars (2 inches+) may benefit from offset rack bushings in conjunction with a bumpsteer kit. And even then, I wouldn't use rubber offset bushings, only the aluminum ones. I'm not sure anyone makes springs that lower your car over 2 inches anyway. I installed rubber offset rack bushings on my 90 LX Coupe and it was actually worse. I learned from that one when I built my 04 GT. Go with the bump steer kit for sure. Road racers have been using this method for 40 years.
No you have to adjust the bumpsteer. That's why they give you an assortment of shims with the kit. I eyeballed mine and tried to follow the axis line of the lower control arm to get it close. You can then use the board and/or the gauge to check movement of the toe by jacking each side's suspension thru its travel motion. A lot of trial and error to get it right on. I installed the MM bumpsteer kit myself and got pretty damn close. Their instructions explain it in more detail for the do it yourselfer. Or you can get it close and take it to a specialist frontend shop. It will probably cost you a $150 with the alignment. DO NOT go to a Goodyear or Firestone type shop. Most of these guys can barely set the toe. Hope this helps
40th GT
New Member
Why would you say urethane rack bushings are ****ty? Don't they help reduce rack slop?Do whatever you want, but IMO offset rack bushings are a bandaid fix and should be a last resort (ESPECIALLY ****ty urethane ones).
Also, I've lowered my car 2" with the Sportlines, and I noticed some more understeer than stock. Body roll sure did decrease, but the understeering problem did not improve at all. Is this because I am missing the bumpsteer kit?
Here is some interesting info on Mustang suspension basics:
http://www.miracerros.com/mustang/t_suspension.htm
BTW this discussion is one reason why I am leery of lowering my 2003 GT Vert.
The biggest problem these days is finding a person who actually KNOWS how to do a proper alignment on this type of car where all angles can be adjusted.
Most places have lube jockeys used to FWD cars where maybe, one angle can be adjusted as everything is usually factory set and without Camber bolts etc the alignment is pretty much static.
Give them a car with Castor, Camber and Toe and they are lost.
Right now with stock springs/struts my car tracks perfectly, wears tires evenly and has no stability problems.
Yea, it still has the Outback look which I am not thrilled with, but until I can feel confident with the IQ of the person operating the $100,000 Hunter machine, I'm going to leave things as they are.
For the record, I am considering the Bullit kit from FRP or the Eibach full kit (Springs, struts, stabilizer bars etc) because they make a specific one for the Convertible which has different springs stock.
And just a drop of 1 inch or so.
Here's the answer for adding H&R sports for an 1.5" drop with no bumpsteer. There's no other bumpsteer parts accept this Steeda bumpsteer kit. This was cal'd with a bumpsteer gauge.
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