clevland intake question

[ashford]

i put an eldelbrok performer for 2v on my clevland today, used the recomended fel-pro gaskets 1240 for it. the gaskets are the conventional gaskets not the valley pan type. after torquing it down i noticed that the end seals wer'nt compressed and i can move them around. Also it has a dead miss on #7 &8 at idle, i pulled the pvc and the breather an covered the holes with my hand, it pulled a hard vacuum quickly while idling, so im sure that it didnt seal.

i was wanting to know if anyone has had a simalar problem.

would it be a poorly machined intake, or should i use my old valley pan with some silicone(agewise its not old)?

 

[nosaj122081]

The intake's instructions should mention somewhere not to use the end gaskets; a 1/4 bead of silcone is used instead. I prefer the non-valley pan gaskets, I typically get a way better seal with them (plus I use them to block off the heat riser).

 

[D.Hearne]

Use the valley pan with the end seals and composite gaskets. It's obvious here that the intake's dimensions are on the short side for filling the gap from head to head. Cut the valley pan's port sides off but leave the ends. put qa thin bead of sealer down on the block, then press the valley pan down onto it. ( I like to use Permatex ultra blue or black RTV) Then apply another thin bead down on top of the valley pan ends and press the end seals down, and allow them to sit awhile so they don't move. Lock them into place at the same time with the port side gaskets. Then put the intake back in place and torque to spec.

 

[TOM B]

I built many motors and never use the end gaskets, Its a waist of your time.
go to the drag strip and look at the pro's engines, you wont see end seals here.

 

[D.Hearne]

I've always used end seals except when the gasket set didn't include them, And NEVER had problems with them. But I guess after 30 years of using them, I'm just a novice. Besides, who has time to go around the pits at a race just to check to see who's using them and who's not I always found more entertaining things to do at the races than look for missing intake end seals

 

[Goeth27]

i had the simular problem with my 72 mach 1 351 cleveland 4barrel carb, and i found out that it was my distributor, but if you need try both vaccum's on the carb.

 

[Hack]

The end seals on 351C intakes must be a fairly common problem. I've seen several threads about this. Some people say to peen the ends of the block and use cork gaskets on the ends. Some people say to put down a small amount of RTV and let it skin over before bolting the intake down. I'm sure that there are several methods that will work. The main caution I've heard is that too much RTV is a really bad thing. I think that letting the RTV cure a little helps prevent the seals from moving.

However, if you're installing everything per the manufacturer's recommendations and the end seals aren't getting compressed - I would be inclined to call the manufacturer and complain. I know it sucks to wait to install your new part.

If you really want to do it now, I think you should try D.Hearne's suggestion.

 

[Max Power]

Most intakes tell you not to bother with the end gaskets anymore, yet most gasket sets include them. I usually use the gaskets, as there is less chance of getting a blob of rtv into the lifter valley.

Also, once while doing the bead and not using gaskets, a big bubble was in the rtv and didn't pop until torqueing, and it was on the backside so I couldn't see it. It leaked substantially, so I have been using the gaskets since. I wish they would make them out of rubber, though. I don't much like cork gaskets.

 

[nosaj122081]

http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive/general_instr/general_instr.html

Here's the link to Edelbrock's page for manifold installation instructions, has all the info you should need.

 

[D.Hearne]

One good thing that Felpro has done for the cork seals lately is to apply an adhesive to the bottom sides to stick them to the block. I'd also prefer a better rubber seal, but the cork will do now that they've fixed the "walking" problem.

 

[ashford]

well i figured out the problems. first off the intake gasket on the right side slid down on me during the installation which caused my vacuum leak. and for the no crompressing of the end seals, the gaskets are way too thick on the sides.i dont like these gaskets from fel-pro the only way to get them to set still is to "glue" them to the heads and they are way too thick. every other v8 ive been into they usually set on something like the 302's set on the head gasket and the sbc set on the deck.
well i cleaned up the old valley pan and rtved it back on. Geometry looks fine and it sealed up.

 

[D.Hearne]

To help locate the Cleveland gaskets, you can use the factory 2" long carb studs in the center four intake bolt holes. Same thing also works on the small blocks, except they can be used in any position.

 

[mustang70]

I use the end seals as well on my motors and haven't had a problem. I did really like the rubber ones on my 460.

So I guess that makes me a novice as well?