EFI Solutions or Custom Chip?

starkie · Mar 31, 2004

nickthegenius said:
Here, let me stir things up. In my quest to find out about "Pro-M" tuning software, I got this response at Modular Depot about it. So for the EFI lovers, I present:

---------

I don't want to start a pissing match here but I can give you a little info about our software and our tuning expertise.

Paul Booth and I have been working on tuning software that has striking similiarities to the other systems out there. We have both worked very hard to come up with our priliminary Ford system. We have found that the program is growing beyond our expectations in that we now have thirty dealers using our tuning software. We have recently started to go back and add a "quick calibration" utility to our software that will allow you to enter your vehicle info and the software will automatically produce a tune that should get you very close to perfect.

EFI Solutions is using information and technology that was obtained from Pro-M. We paid this company to work with us to develop our own tuning system and they are now in litigation with Pro-M. Anyone using their software has been or will be informed about our actions against EFI Solutions.We would like to provide any of these people with a free copy of our software to prevent them from being "shut down"

We have found that almost all tuners have been "lying" to the computer to get a quick and dirty "tune". They do this because they are trying to mask or compensate for other problems on the car and they are just trying to make a living like every one else in this business.

We manufacture mass air meters as well as tune and we find that if we "tell" the computer the MAF transfer functions and other precise info about auxiliary input and output devices, that the cars run perfect all year long.

We calibrate, others "tune".

I guess I can end with this.... We have several dealers that were already in posession of other tuning systems, but they chose to purchase ours as well. I believe they have done this because we try very hard to provide them with the proper tools and information to make them successful in this complicated business.

This was copied in its entirety from http://forums.modulardepot.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=22378

So can anybody from EFI say anything about this? I don't want to rush to judgement before Tim at EFI gets his say.

Starkie

DC-GT · Mar 31, 2004

Spitfire said:
your jab at Tim's customer's responses makes you seem like an elitist. Because they don't "quantify" to your specification, then by extension their responses are invalid?

These are the words I was looking for last night when I wasted my time trying to figure out what to say in response to your posts Bill... In the end I just gave up trying to say something meaningful because you will just twist it in some way... Anyone who is just "fixing the facts" would not be so persistent and one sided...

Spitfire · Mar 31, 2004

Mustang92 said:
You obviously care enoughed to "try" and step in an call me out. {What exactly did you have to add to this thread?

Bill

Spitfire said:
I'm happy with my tune from T&J using EFI solutions. I made 400/389 with just his intercooled mongoose kit and a catted x pipe.

I showed how Tim "optimized" my parts combination to make good power. It is obvious your ego wil never let you stop, so I will withdraw.

dew22 · Mar 31, 2004

I WOULD LIKE TO PERSONALLY THANK ALL THE (EXPERTS) IN THIS THREAD FOR COMPLETELY CONFUSING ME. I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THE DIFFERENCE'S IN SCT AND EFI ARE IF ANY, CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT THE DIFFERENCES ARE? !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

How am I supposed to make good decisions for my situation when I don't know who uses what and why. My car right now is lightly moded 2003gt
automatic 3.73's, spinntech x pipe w/cats borla cat back,P.S.T carbonfiber
driveshaft (autologic 3 position chip = EFI or SCT I have no idea ) I do know that Ford chips was having a dyno tuning session at a local shop here in Tampa about a year ago and I had my car tuned probably not very smart on my part because I didn't have much to gain being so lightly moded but I did and gained I think it was about 7hp & 7tq now here is where it gets confusing the guy who tuned the car (Jerry) I believe is a big name tuner guru
and the guy who drove it afterwards (getting rid of some codes) was named Chris Johnson but they were all wearing JMS shirts wich is were my chip autologic chip came from (I didn't know this at the time) getting confussed I sure am and was because at the time of the tune I was told my options were reflash or new ford chip. regular or (Flip) I said whats best they said reflash I said why they said no possibility of chip failure I said reflash it is. I drove with the reflash for about 3 months and then put the autologic chip back in I liked the shift characteristics in the 2nd and 3rd setting I don't know if they did anything to the shifts on the reflash? I don't know what any of this means other than I was confused and still am. My questions are if Chris johnson = JMS and JMS=autologic or at least JMS sells autologic why couldn't they reburn my chip?

All I want is my car to be well behaved = no bucking no detonation no bouncing of the rev limiter starts right up and hauls ass with this set up the mods I have plus a P.I Stallion lock up 2800rpm stall torque converter and a
Kenne Bell 9 psi kit What would be the best Computer solution / reflash / chip/
tune/ to accomplish this. I understand there will be people that disagree
(SO WHAT) just give me what you know and why one way is better than another or differen't than another.

StngStr · Mar 31, 2004

yes...what a mess.

nickthegenius · Mar 31, 2004

Yes, from what I have gathered in the last year or so on this board is that these tuners/programmers swap partners and change companies like I change my underwear.

Mustang92 · Mar 31, 2004

DC-GT said:
Anyone who is just "fixing the facts" would not be so persistent and one sided...

How am I being one sided? I wouldn't have had to post anything beyond my first two had I not be called out as a whiner and muddying up posts. I corrected misinformation then posed a question about tuning ability which everyone except for Tim took as an attack. Why should I back down is there an internet credo I missed somewhere that says when questioned you should cower into your corner and pretend it didn't happen. Sorry but I won't.

What exactly did you have to add to this thread?

Clearing up the fact that you can change the same parameters with a flash or the chip. Also discuss how someone with limited experience is known as a best in the industry. Apparently you don't know how to discuss such things without bashing me. Yes your first post in this thread was perfect beyond that you were just looking to start trouble.

Bill

gnat · Mar 31, 2004

why dont both of you just let it go?

Bullitt_#1346 · Mar 31, 2004

dew22 said:
I WOULD LIKE TO PERSONALLY THANK ALL THE (EXPERTS) IN THIS THREAD FOR COMPLETELY CONFUSING ME. I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THE DIFFERENCE'S IN SCT AND EFI ARE IF ANY, CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT THE DIFFERENCES ARE? !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

How am I supposed to make good decisions for my situation when I don't know who uses what and why. My car right now is lightly moded 2003gt
automatic 3.73's, spinntech x pipe w/cats borla cat back,P.S.T carbonfiber
driveshaft (autologic 3 position chip = EFI or SCT I have no idea ) I do know that Ford chips was having a dyno tuning session at a local shop here in Tampa about a year ago and I had my car tuned probably not very smart on my part because I didn't have much to gain being so lightly moded but I did and gained I think it was about 7hp & 7tq now here is where it gets confusing the guy who tuned the car (Jerry) I believe is a big name tuner guru
and the guy who drove it afterwards (getting rid of some codes) was named Chris Johnson but they were all wearing JMS shirts wich is were my chip autologic chip came from (I didn't know this at the time) getting confussed I sure am and was because at the time of the tune I was told my options were reflash or new ford chip. regular or (Flip) I said whats best they said reflash I said why they said no possibility of chip failure I said reflash it is. I drove with the reflash for about 3 months and then put the autologic chip back in I liked the shift characteristics in the 2nd and 3rd setting I don't know if they did anything to the shifts on the reflash? I don't know what any of this means other than I was confused and still am. My questions are if Chris johnson = JMS and JMS=autologic or at least JMS sells autologic why couldn't they reburn my chip?

All I want is my car to be well behaved = no bucking no detonation no bouncing of the rev limiter starts right up and hauls ass with this set up the mods I have plus a P.I Stallion lock up 2800rpm stall torque converter and a
Kenne Bell 9 psi kit What would be the best Computer solution / reflash / chip/
tune/ to accomplish this. I understand there will be people that disagree
(SO WHAT) just give me what you know and why one way is better than another or differen't than another.

Autologic is a chip company. EFI solutions is a software system that allows a tuner to reflash the computer itself. SCT is Super Chips Tuning (or Technology) and it is a software program that allows you to either burn a chip or reflash the computer, I am not sure which. The bottom line is that all of these three things are tools available to tuners which allow them to reprogram the computer in your car to take advantage and compensate for various modifications.

The important thing to remember out of all of this mess is that you should pick your tuner, not the software that he uses. All of the more well known software companies and chip makers out there offer substantially similar products. Just find a tuner that is nearby and does good work, and stick with him. That is the best way to do it. These tuning days where a tuner does a bunch of cars in one day is probably not the best idea. To really tune a car correctly for power and for driveability can take many hours. It is not something that should be done in volume at a tuning day.

Mustang92 · Mar 31, 2004

JMS chips is owned by Chris Johnson the same guy who fixed the codes in your car. He went around tuning cars along with Jerry (of Fordchips) and others at various dyno facilities around the country. They worked with Autologic software and chips. Late last year Jerry, Chris J., Dave Posea started up SCT (superchips custom tuning) based on software they wrote that fixed the way tuning was done. There were lots of issues with the way most tuning software was written and how it actually corrected items. This corrected it.

You also have EFI solutions which is a fairly new company. There is also Diablo which has new software out and there is old Superchips stuff. As to which one is best that is for the consumer to decide, you need to take the time to research them all out and decide for yourself what you feel will suit your needs and get what you want out of it. Anyone that uses any of these softwares/chips/flashers is going to say they are the best.

If you want your Autologic chip reburned you have to either deal with the same company that burned it originally or another Autologic dealer that can burn that chip. Chips from different companies (SCT, Superchips, Diablo, EFI, etc...) can not be burned using someone elses software.

Bill

dew22 · Mar 31, 2004

Not that it realy maters anymore but if they were using autologic equipment at the time they tuned my car why wasn't reburning my autologic chip an option?

Anyway are both company's tunes "adaptive" and does this only apply to flashes or can a chip tune be "adaptive"

cobra killer · Mar 31, 2004

LOL dew22..........Pick a tuner your comfortable with....Software/chip is only as good as the guy using it..

Tim

dew22 · Mar 31, 2004

cobra killer said:
LOL dew22..........Pick a tuner your comfortable with....Software/chip is only as good as the guy using it..

Tim

help me out with the LOL part i'm so confused i didn't know I was being funny
anyway Im glad your laughing it's healthy =

cobra killer · Mar 31, 2004

Sorry...

EFI/SCT/Diablo/Autologic all can do what your after.My best advise is pick a reputable shop...

We tune,Modular Depot tunes,MV performance,SCT,JMS,Kauffman...
Those are about the only places I would actually recommend getting a chip/flash from..

Is anyone better then the other?opinions vary but all the above mentioned will get you what you need...

tim

dew22 · Mar 31, 2004

Tim can a tune on a chip be "adaptive" or only flashes

cobra killer · Mar 31, 2004

SCT and Daiblo can program/edit/munipulate the adaptive strategy your car has from Ford with thier chip.

EFI/SCT can do this with a flash.

tim

dew22 · Mar 31, 2004

cobra killer said:
SCT and Daiblo can program/edit/munipulate the adaptive strategy your car has from Ford with thier chip.

EFI/SCT can do this with a flash.

tim

Ok so why do people get their chips reburned after mods I thought that the
adaptive tunes allowed you to add mods and the car would adjust / adapt.
Is one more adaptive (Chip or flash)

THANKS

OSpire55 · Mar 31, 2004

I'm waiting for EFI's response to ProM's message.

-J

Bullitt_#1346 · Mar 31, 2004

dew22 said:
Ok so why do people get their chips reburned after mods I thought that the adaptive tunes allowed you to add mods and the car would adjust / adapt.

Someone correct me if I am wrong, but I don't think that even the so called adaptive tunes can adapt to every mod, just certain mods like a powerpipe or exhaust. I think that if you change something like fuel injectors, MAF, etc. you have to get the car tuned again no matter what you are using.

RedGTvert · Mar 31, 2004

98GTVortech said:
I have talked to that company and they gave me there whole speal about how thier tuning session is the best but the cost of them was rather high. He quoted me something like 700+ for tune and chip while the guys in dillsburg quoted 400. Now this is the reason i posted this thread to find out just how much that extra 300 would be worth to get a custom chip. With that extra 300 i can almost have enough for some LT's .

Thanks for the feedback

Look at it this way. It is going to cost you somewhere in the neighborhood of $60-$80.00 to drive out there at $2.00+ per gallon, not to mention killing a whole day. Secondly, if you need a reburn for any reason, you are going to do one of two things, drive out there again and kill a whole day or you are going to use a local dyno, send the chip back (if you use a chip) and then re-dyno to make sure the chip works.

I understand what you are saying about Kauffmans. He works extrememly cheap, and he has a good reputation. Do I think you'll get a better tune with JD's, I think so, but that is my feeling based on what I have seen coming out of both shops.

Dave @ Kauffmans is a very competent tuner, so I don't want to sell him short, I just feel JD's is better. This is why when I lived in Philly, other then Larocca's, JD's was my tuner of choice.

EFI Solutions or Custom Chip?

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