electric fan upside down work? need help, non-op!!

[92lxaz]

I just put in the flex-a-lite 175 fan. I'm pretty much electrically inept but figure gotta learn sometime. It was pretty straight forward and I hooked everything up per instructions: 12v to battery + with inline fuse provided, ground to battery (-), 12v constant to coolant sensor red for ignition activation, a/c spliced in. Temp probe in radiator by upper hose. Ran car up to temp, adjusted temp control until fan kicked on to set.

Everything worked at home. Took a drive to the store (110 here at least in AZ today), a little freeway, got to store rolling around to find parking spot it starts to get hot and I here a loud short buzz sound, and a second shortly after. The a/c got warm so I quick parked. Had my wife come and get me to go get the original fan and fan clutch so I can get back home. Ran super cool and a/c worked fine on the way home.

I did mount it upside down but wouldn't think that would have anything to do with it. What could be wrong. I was so proud I got it to work only to be shot down. Do I need a relay still even though the directions never mentioned? Did the probe get too hot and shut down the controller box? Any help would be great. It's my daily drive so can't be down. Much appreciated.

 

[Rick 91GT]

The standard cutch fan arrangment in good working order will cool better then any electric fan...especially in that heat in AZ.

Mounting the fan at any angle will not matter, upside down etc.. What shorted? Most fan draw a lot of amps and require a relay, 30amp min, most need a 75amp (Mark 8 Fan, Stock 95 Mustang Fan)

Do you see melted wires?

 

[92lxaz]

No don't see any melted wires. The in-line fuse on the power wire is good still too. I do have a 130 amp alternator as well. I was wondering about the relay, even though direction don't say. Someone also told me the flex-a-lite fans are junk. I'm going to try to just power it up today with the manual connection.

My current fan clutch is bad that's why I decided to try electric. I won't waste too much time as I do need good cooling here. Autozone fan clutch are crap, any recommendations if I do go back? Thanks.

 

[2000xp8]

No don't see any melted wires. The in-line fuse on the power wire is good still too. I do have a 130 amp alternator as well. I was wondering about the relay, even though direction don't say. Someone also told me the flex-a-lite fans are junk. I'm going to try to just power it up today with the manual connection.

Autozone fan clutch are crap, any recommendations if I do go back? Thanks.

Yes, get one from ford.
I'd prefer to have a huge radiator with good fan clutch over an electric fan.
Even if you got it to work, not sure a BM fan is going to pull enough air for arizona heat.

 

[stang&2Birds]

Someone also told me the flex-a-lite fans are junk.

IMHO, they where being NICE about those POS pure crap PURE RICER fans.

Any help would be great. It's my daily drive so can't be down. Much appreciated.

IMHO, you have TWO options:

1) Keep the stock thermal clutch setup. If you need more cooling, get a PPI thermal clutch fro **PPI** (just about the only place that still sells the real ones).



2) So, how did it feel to almost have a FEW THOUSANDS of dollars of damage done toy your engine because you had CR*P stuff on in critical jobs?

** All people make mistakes, smart people learn from mistakes!

So, let's talk about option #2 for a Daily Driver that has OEM RELIABILITY!
1) Get a FORD FAN! Those fan motors are good for ~200K+ miles!


2) Having a great fan means nothing if the controller is some unreliable POS design made to SAVE COST AND INCREASE PROFIT! One of my contracts is for a high volume 100K-1M/year product. Because of how that product is used, we care a lot about reliability. But, we also do not over design the product (costs more) to get increased reliability. Our customers are interested in the product lasting "x years", not paying more for something that lasts "4x years". But that "non super robust design" also effects the SMALL number that fail sooner.

A 1 in 10K -> 100K early failure sounds low, until it effects YOU!


So...., IMHO, for controllers you have a choice of in controllers of
A) Using a simple temperature on/off controller, with a 50-70 amp relay (add it on), AND a switch over-ride.


B) Get the DCC controller!
With a good PWM controller, the fan motor will last MUCH MUCH MUCH longer! You'll almost never be running the motor at full. That results in less heat and less bearing wear - both the main killers of fan motors.

IMHO, the only aftermarket PWN controller that *I trust* is the DCC. And, I went with the biggest one. Again, I want the electronics in the controller to be running cool and at a low percentage of their ability. *I* care about reliability in my summer Daily Driver!

And, gee, REMEMBER how it felt coming close to loosing your DD and having thousands of dollars of damage because of using cheap *ss/poor-quailty stuff?
Well, I DO! I had to replace the head gasket on my Cutlass in the winter, with snow on the ground, and with no garage.

All people make mistakes, smart people learn from mistakes!

Good Luck!


Last:
[on soapbox]
Note to people: If you get your panties in a bunch about it taking 3+ months to get a DCC, I, and others will tell you to go take a midol and STFU!
It takes FOUR MONTHS+ TO GET ONE AND YOU GET ZERO EMAILS FROM BRIAN. ACCEPT THAT, OR STFU AND STOP SHOWING YOUR IGNORANCE!
[off soapbox]

 

[4rdnut]

The flexalite 175 electric fan is weak with no shrouding and the controller that comes with it is garbage, get the flexalite #188 black magic extreme fan $269 on ebay new, it comes without the wiring and cheap controller then get the flexalite vsc (variable speed controller) The black magic extreme fan only draws 18 total amps of power and pulls 3300 cfm's @ 2500 rpm. I have the flexalite #188 fan because its more efficient than the contour/taurus/sable/mark junkyard electric fan amp pigs which draw 3 times more amps and makes your alternator work harder which puts a drag on the engine which most people don't think about. A lot of people use a dcc controller from a non-company, stay away from dcc controllers like the plague they take to long to be made and delivered and if you do buy one and it craps out then you have to wait another 3 months for another one, lol. The flexalite fan motor on my black magic extreme says made in canada and still going strong after three years of abuse.

 

[MFE92]

I disagree about the standard fan being superior to the electric. I had overheating problems with a standard fan in hot weather with the A/C on in Kansas City, completely cured when I went to a used Taurus electric fan (mounted upside down) and a Flex-A-Lite VSC controller, and it's good enough to keep the car from overheating even in the hottest of AZ heat (I'm in Chandler too).

 

[92lxaz]

I thought this might bring up a few different opinions...it's good. All points well taken. The 185 is out as the 175 was a lot for me to spend (now it's crap). I just need to salvage now what I have as cost effectively as possible. Is it worth using the fan with a different controller? Is it even possible? OR if the fan is still functional put a relay in?

I'll probably get a Ford fan clutch anyway just to have. I really liked how the electric fan freed up some power though that's why I want to still try to make it happen, it was fun to drive that way for 10 min (my car is mostly stock so doesn't take much to noticed especially after driving on a bad fan clutch that's engaged most of the time). I'll just keep a fan clutch in the back with a couple tools as I'll be paranoid now moving forward with an electric

MFE92 I might PM you up for some help if needed since you're local Chandler like myself.

 

[stang&2Birds]

A lot of people use a dcc controller from a non-company, stay away from dcc controllers like the plague they take to long to be made and delivered and if you do buy one and it craps out then you have to wait another 3 months for another one, lol.

And "when it crap out". WTF????
You clearly do not have a clue about the DCC, or it's reputation.

As for it being made by a "non company". The DCC was designed by a REAL engineer with over a dozen (?20+?) years experience doing that type of design.
Brian is NOT becoming rich of of the DCC. In fact, IMHO, it wouldn't be even close to being worth it if I sold something like that, for that amount of profit, and those numbers.


The cr*p you buy at junk companies like Flex-a-lite are designed by cheap "engineers" that you're lucky if they even have a clue what they're doing, much less give a rat's *ss. They KNOW that they'll likely be at another company in ~5 years (that's the cold hard truth about working in high-tech today).

flexalite #185 black magic extreme fan and ditch the controller that comes with it and get a flexalite vsc (variable speed controller) people bad mouth this fan because it costs $325 and the vsc controller costs $100 but it only draws 18 total amps of power and pulls 3300 cfm's @ 3500 rpm.

You're not pulling 3300 cfm at 18amps.
It takes real work (power) to move air. At best a fan and motor can be 100% efficient. In reality, there are many losses.

The flex-a-lite line is junk. It's made for COST and PROFIT - NOT for reliability. IF/WHEN the fan goes and your engine pukes it's guts on the highway, flex-a-lite will say BFD!!

An OEM fan MUST WORK FOR 150K+ miles. If not, it's ~$15K++ to the company to replace the engine.


As I said, IMHO, if people want, they can use a FORD fan, and a flex-a-lite controller as long as they also have a switch to bypass the flex-a-lite controller for WHEN it dies.

 

[stang&2Birds]

I disagree about the standard fan being superior to the electric .

IMHO, a police clutch will cool very well.

Otherwise, a good electric fan and a good alternator will cool better because it allows for full air flow at idle and any engine speed.
However, that assumes that someone has an alternator that is up to the job. That means no underdrive pulley on the crank, and an alternator that has a high current output at a low-rpm - like a 3G or 4G, but not an upgraded 2G.

 

[MFE92]

FWIW, 4.5 years, 32,000 miles, and not a single malfunction out of my FAL VSC. I had it at my doorstep 3 days from ordering it, and I got an order confirmation, a shipping confirmation, and I didn't have sacrifice any goats or take peyote with a shaman in a sweatlodge trying to find out when a divinely-inspired fan controller might arrive.

Also FWIW I tried a variety of fan clutches including the Police unit before throwing in the towel and going electric. Yes, it cost me a 3G alternator upgrade in the process.

 

[VibrantRedGT]

I hate the way my 92GT sounds with the stock fan / clutch system. With the electric fan on my 94 I could hear it come on and turn off. I really like the sound and look. Can't wait to get the stock crap off and install our new double fan system. Will be using the DSS controller set up.

 

[Onefine88]

I have a Flex-A-Lite Extreme 185 S blade fan "mounted upside down" in my red '88vert.

Alot of people always say these fans are crap but I've had nothing but good results since '05.

I mounted it upside down because I didn't like the huge awful looking top mounting bracket.
Looks real clean upside down.

I have dual Ramchargers fans mounted on my SSC. Those are far superior fans but I can't recommend them because that company disappeared.

I picked up 18rwhp on the dyno when we swapped the oem clutch fan to the electrics on my SSC.

 

[2000xp8]

I picked up 18rwhp on the dyno when we swapped the oem clutch fan to the electrics on my SSC.

That number has to have some other variables involved. Supercharged cars can produce 18rwhp of difference for pretty much no reason other than temp.
I've seen it tested first hand, back to back (as in car never left the dyno), produced 4rwhp.
If you take the entire belt off it's only worth like 20hp.

 

[Onefine88]

Yours made 4. Mine made 18.

What can I say.


Mine didn't stay on the dyno. It was removed from the dyno and to a work area. It returned the next day after e fan install. Its been 5-6 years but seems it was around June and very warm. I'll always remember the number because I was proud that it made that much more at the tires for $200 bucks.

 

[2000xp8]

Yours made 4. Mine made 18.

What can I say.


Mine didn't stay on the dyno. It was removed from the dyno and to a work area. It returned the next day after e fan install. Its been 5-6 years but seems it was around June and very warm. I'll always remember the number because I was proud that it made that much more at the tires for $200 bucks.

Ever turn the waterpump and fan with the belt off? No way it takes that much power to turn.
18rwhp, would mean that it takes about 25hp to turn it.
That's as much power as an entire ride on lawnmower engine.
While i certainly believe that the dyno said those numbers, common sense suggests that it's completely inaccurate.
I'm not debating it to put you down, i just don't want any newbs here to get the idea that an E fan can get you damn near 20rwhp.

 

[jrichker]

I believe that the power required to turn the fan increases steadly as RPMS increase. If it draws 2 Hp at idle, it will draw 4 HP at 2000 RPM and 8 HP at 4000 RPM.