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  • 1979 - 1995 (Fox, SN95.0, & 2.3L) -General/Talk-
  • Fox 5.0 Mustang Tech

Fox w/ Sn95 spindle

  • Thread starter Thread starter mattmcdan
  • Start date Start date Oct 10, 2010
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mattmcdan

Member
Apr 19, 2006
176
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Okeechobee, Florida
Oct 10, 2010
#1
  • Oct 10, 2010
  • #1
Hey guys!

I am doing a 5 lug swap on my 90 coupe. I had read that you can change the fox ball joints to SN95 ball joints when doing this swap and you don't have to use the stacked washer method. Can anyone else confirm this? I have stock K-member and stock lower control arms.

Thanks,

Matt
 

Mustang5L5

That is…until I whipped out my Bissell
Mod Dude
Feb 18, 2001
43,265
17,952
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Massachusetts
Oct 10, 2010
#2
  • Oct 10, 2010
  • #2
Yes you can. Press out fox bj, press in sn95 bj. No washers needed.
 

mattmcdan

Member
Apr 19, 2006
176
0
19
Okeechobee, Florida
Oct 10, 2010
#3
  • Oct 10, 2010
  • #3
What is your recomended method for doing this? Is it easier to remove the lower control arm? Leave it on the car?
 

Mustang5L5

That is…until I whipped out my Bissell
Mod Dude
Feb 18, 2001
43,265
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Massachusetts
Oct 10, 2010
#4
  • Oct 10, 2010
  • #4
Depends on your method of pressing in and out of the ball joints.

Plenty of guys have done them in car.

Any reason why you choose to do this vs the spacers?
 

Chuckman

GTFO you fat, heavy bastard
15 Year Member
Oct 21, 2005
1,604
1,002
173
st. louis, mo
Oct 10, 2010
#5
  • Oct 10, 2010
  • #5
Mustang5L5 said:
Yes you can. Press out fox bj, press in sn95 bj. No washers needed.
Click to expand...

god that looks funny, goes perfect with the ct, lol

as for getting em out, you'll probably want the arm out and use a press (best method), though im sure a couple blocks and a bfh will "work," just far easier to take em to a shop if you dont have access to a press.
 

93project

Active Member
Apr 21, 2009
549
52
38
El Paso, tx
Oct 10, 2010
#6
  • Oct 10, 2010
  • #6
i used 02 moog ball joints from oreillys. i also used their rental ball joint remover/installer. it works great, but you will man up on getting them in and out. you have to crank on the wrench like if you're opening a port door on the titanic! i did mine with the arms on the car
 

mattmcdan

Member
Apr 19, 2006
176
0
19
Okeechobee, Florida
Oct 10, 2010
#7
  • Oct 10, 2010
  • #7
I'd rather do the sn95 ball joints for peace of mind. I just built a nasty 408, and the car is strip only. Just eases the mind a bit.
 

stang&2Birds

Founding Member
May 4, 2000
2,091
5
58
New England. :-) CT/MA
Oct 11, 2010
#8
  • Oct 11, 2010
  • #8
mattmcdan said:
I'd rather do the sn95 ball joints for peace of mind. I just built a nasty 408, and the car is strip only. Just eases the mind a bit.
Click to expand...
Gee, you don't trust ~20 year old ball joints.

Like many topics, there's the stuff you read on the web and forums, and there what is correct in real life. I tell people how to do things the correct way.

So, here's the real info:
Ford ball joints are not made to be replaced!
No argument - just read the Ford manual!


Okay. But, shops do it all the time. Yea, shops also have people that failed 3rd grade working for them, and running them, so what does that prove?



But wait, Moog to the rescue!

o Using a ball joint press so that the ball joint opening on the FCA does not distort, remove the old ORIG ball joint.

o Use a MOOG ball joint that is specially designed (slightly bigger body and has more taper to the body) to go into the Ford FCA.

o In general, you can do this ONCE, and have the ball joint snug and safe. But, note, there is no guarantee!

o If it's the 2nd+ ball joint replacement, or if the new Moog ball joint is not tight in the FCA opening after being inserted, then the bottom of the ball joint must/should be carefully MIG welded to the FCA.



BTW: Parts of the above info are based on the awesome knowledge and help from Jack from MM. I never knew that Moog had specially designed their replacement ball joints. That's also why when people use Ford OEM or Steeda X2 ball joints, they often report that the ball joints are not "tight" in the FCA opening.

BTW#2: I used new Ford FCAs since they also have the better bushings and the newer lifetime ball joints. I used the washers that came with my M2300K kit. A small company also sells similar washers. But, from what I read on the forums, some people need two per ball joint.


To the best of my knowledge, the above is correct. Every thing that I mentioned can be verified with no problem (i.e buy a Ford factory OEM and Moog ball joint and measure them, read the Ford manual, search for the thread with Jack's comments on the other Stang site, etc).

Good Luck!
 

93project

Active Member
Apr 21, 2009
549
52
38
El Paso, tx
Oct 11, 2010
#9
  • Oct 11, 2010
  • #9
My moogs were a PITA to get into the arm so I guess that counts as a tight fit! I'm telling you, go get some Moog's at Oreilly's and rent the ball joint press.
 

Mustang5L5

That is…until I whipped out my Bissell
Mod Dude
Feb 18, 2001
43,265
17,952
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Massachusetts
Oct 11, 2010
#10
  • Oct 11, 2010
  • #10
I just machined up some spacers and used those. Of course I didn't want to press out brand new ball joints out of my new ford racing a arms. Spacers are holding up fine. I check them every day but since it compression, not really much to fail if you use steel and not some soft metal.
 

2000xp8

SN Certified Technician
Aug 8, 2003
8,036
1,625
194
NJ
Oct 11, 2010
#11
  • Oct 11, 2010
  • #11
I have a ball joint tool from harbor freight that was only like $30
Worked great on my van and explorer.
So i'd assume it works fine on the mustang too.
 

Shakerhood

20+ Year Stangneter
Oct 28, 2004
3,359
209
114
Ohio
Oct 12, 2010
#12
  • Oct 12, 2010
  • #12
I bought the Ford Racing A Arms and used the Spacers, work great.
 
E

El_CUCUY

Member
May 1, 2006
95
0
6
RGV
Oct 12, 2010
#13
  • Oct 12, 2010
  • #13
where can i find these so called spacer? I'm on the same boat right now and need to either get new BJ's put in or use the spacer method. I would rather use the spacers cause i'll be changing out the front susp later and would rather go a cheaper route right now.
thanks
 

Mustang5L5

That is…until I whipped out my Bissell
Mod Dude
Feb 18, 2001
43,265
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Oct 13, 2010
#14
  • Oct 13, 2010
  • #14
I machined my own, some guys on forums do sell them. There was a vendor selling them but can't think of who it was.

Some guys used 5/8" ID washers with a stacked hieght of 0.330"

The force on the spacer is compression, so as long as you use a quality steel or washer, there should be no issue with mushrooming.

I made mine out of 316L Stainless. been 2 years...no issues. And sorry, i can't make anymore at this time.
 
E

El_CUCUY

Member
May 1, 2006
95
0
6
RGV
Oct 13, 2010
#15
  • Oct 13, 2010
  • #15
So can i use the ones from breeze auto? i think they still sell them there.
 
M

Matt@HighFlow

New Member
Oct 7, 2010
6
0
0
Oct 14, 2010
#16
  • Oct 14, 2010
  • #16
Make sure you use 94-95 spindles. The 96 and up spindles will screw the steering geometry up with a stock K member.
 

stang&2Birds

Founding Member
May 4, 2000
2,091
5
58
New England. :-) CT/MA
Oct 15, 2010
#17
  • Oct 15, 2010
  • #17
El_CUCUY said:
So can i use the ones from breeze auto? i think they still sell them there.
Click to expand...
Yup, that's what many people do.

However, from what I understand from posts in the forums, it seems that the spacer they sell is "just barely thick enough". It's hard to see/fell that the nut didn't bottom out on the threads of the ball joint. Also, considering that there's no "exact spec" on how far the threads go on the ball joint stud, IMHO, it's too close for comfort.

So, I'd suggest trying two per ball joint. Otherwise, you want to use grade eight (or better) washers. The lower grade washers will bend/distort/compress too much.

Here's a link to the washers that breeze automotive sells:
Breeze Automotive Factory Five Racing - #30014 Spacer Washer for SN-95 Spindle $3/each



Good Luck!
And, get rid of those POS death trap Fox brakes ASAP! Going to the sn95 setup for hubs and brakes will be the best mod you EVER did to the car.
 

Mustang5L5

That is…until I whipped out my Bissell
Mod Dude
Feb 18, 2001
43,265
17,952
224
Massachusetts
Oct 17, 2010
#18
  • Oct 17, 2010
  • #18
My custom machines spacer. New fox balljoints in ford racing a arms....so I didn't want to ruin anything by pressing them out.


 

stang&2Birds

Founding Member
May 4, 2000
2,091
5
58
New England. :-) CT/MA
Oct 17, 2010
#19
  • Oct 17, 2010
  • #19
Nice washers.
Yea, those are a much better width than the Breeze Auto washers. But, my guess is that it would also be $20+ each for those washers because of the time involved and the material/machining cost.

If people really really want to use single washers, they can use emachineshop, design them, and pay ~~$150->~$200 for ~2 to 10 pieces.
 
L

Luch

New Member
Mar 31, 2009
9
0
0
Illinois
Oct 18, 2010
#20
  • Oct 18, 2010
  • #20
I purchased the Napa (they offered two versions, I got the better) ball joints and they appeared to be nice pieces, grease fittings and all. The only thing that stuck out right away to me was that they do not utilize the cotter pin! Most every other brand out there I had seen has the hole drilled for the pin but these don't. I was told the fit was good to the control arm's...hope they hold up as I could imagine the damage to the car if they let go, much less safety.
 
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