Having Trouble Bleeding New Brakes

tx65coupe · Apr 4, 2009

I have upgraded from the factory drum brakes on my 65 Mustang. It now has Granada front brakes and Lincoln Versailles rear brakes. It has a dual reservior master cylinder and an SSBC adjustable proportioning valve for the rear. I have been using a vacuum pump to attempt to bleed the brakes. So far when I push the pedal it goes to the floor. Does anyone have any tips?

tx65coupe · Apr 4, 2009

Does anyone know of another way to do this short of the old fashioned 2 person method?

I am also having an issue pulling vacuum on the bleeder screw.

I rebuilt almost all of the brake system on my 95 F150 last summer and bleeding it wasn't this difficult.

72 fastback · Apr 4, 2009

Did you bench bleed the master cylinder?

tx65coupe · Apr 4, 2009

Yes, we bench bled the master cylinder but it did not work very well.

When we bench bled it not much came out of the primary bowl on a single plunger stroke. The secondary bowl worked better. Is it common for these types of master cylinders to work like this.

We bought the master cylinder from CJ Pony Parts and it was supposed to be for a 65-66 disc brake conversion and was supposed to look like this.

http://www.parts123.com/parts123/yb.dll?parta~partsort

If the link doesn't work the CJ part number is DBC2

What we got was one that looks like this.

http://www.parts123.com/parts123/yb.dll?parta~partsort

This part number is BMC23

c24sc · Apr 4, 2009

Are the bleed screws at the highest location? Seems dump to ask, but i've seen it reversed (specially on rear drums) and all the air can't be pushed out.

2nd Mustang · Apr 4, 2009

Sorry, links didn't work.

Even with air in the lines and/or MC, you should still be able to pump the pedal and build up some pressure.

2nd Mustang · Apr 4, 2009

I bought a one man brake bleeding bottle system from Harbor Freight that was really cheap. The small plastic bottle has a magnet attached to it so you can stick it on parts of the body or frame that is higher than the bleed screw. This way, after pushing the pedal down and bleeding air out of the lines, air will not go back into the line when you release the brake pedal. Cheap and effective.

The two man method is probably the quickest method though.

Bleeding the MC does take some time. It's not just a one pump deal.

Good luck.

tx65coupe · Apr 5, 2009

Well we finally got them to build up some pressure. We removed the MC and bench bled it again. This time when ran alot of fluid through it. Then we used the vacuum pump on each wheel. Later today we are going to do the 2 person method. Hopefully that will get all the air out.

Hack · Apr 6, 2009

The two person method is really the best way. It does a much better job than anything short of..(see below). I've never used them, but the guys on Corner Carvers Forums swear by them. I just use the 2 person method - for how often brakes have to be bled on street vehicles it isn't really that much of an inconvenience.

Speed Bleeder Bleeding Brakes Bleeding Motorcycle Brakes Automotive Bleeder Screw Brake Bleeder

phutch11 · Apr 6, 2009

Make sure you have the rear drums properly adjusted. They will determine the "height" of the brake pedal. Improperly adjusted rear drums can sometimes feel like you still have air in the lines.

Good luck...

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tx65coupe · Apr 6, 2009

I have seen the speed bleeders and thought about trying them.

The rear is disc as well since it is a Lincoln Versailles rear end.

We bled the brakes the 2 person way and there was no more obvious air coming out. We went around the car 3 times.

It seems like the pedal still goes down too far though. Should it go down farther than it did with the old single resivior master cylinder and 4 wheel drum setup? It goes down to only a few inches above the floor.

Since I don't have the 302 installed yet, I can't drive it to see how well the brakes work.

2nd Mustang · Apr 6, 2009

If this is a power brake setup, you'll need the engine running and pulling vacuum to feel the normal setup of the brakes as far as pedal travel.

tx65coupe · Apr 6, 2009

I guess I should have mentioned that before. They are manual brakes. My car doesn't have a booster.

CraigMBA · Apr 8, 2009

I have a couple of ideas.

1. Check the pedal to MC pushrod. When I did my conversion from drum to '68 disc a decade ago, the pedal rod needed to be lengthened about 1/2" to get enough travel. The car would stop, but the pedal was like 1/4" of an inch from the floor, plus I had a whale of a time bleeding it. I wound up using a stack of small washers until I got an adjustable push rod. If the pedal is low when it is relaxed, check the free play of the rod. It shouldn't have very much.

2. Turn the brake proportioning valve to maximum pressure (is not limiting the pressure to the rears). It seems like it was easier to bleed them once I turned the bias up to fully engage the rears.

This thread is a couple of days old. Did you get this fixed?

tx65coupe · Apr 8, 2009

I haven't gotten it to what I think is accepable yet.

I have a SSBC adjustable pushrod. The pedal sits fairly high and about the same as it did before. It just goes down several inches and is only about 2-3 inches above the floor.

The proportioning valve has been backed off all the way. At least I followed the directions that came with it for initial setup.

BarnStang · Apr 8, 2009

I was having the same problem with my Granada power conversion. THis may just be the luck of the draw and not mean a thing, but i could not get any more air out. And the calipers are on the correct sides. I put the front of the car up in the air on the hyd jack as high as I could get it. I got one little pop of air out of each side of the front calipers. But, I also found one rear wheel that I thought I had adjusted, but was a bit loose. I still think the pedel goes too far, but it is much improved, not spongy, and stops hard when I nail the brake pedel. So, I did get some air out. Don't know if putting the car up in the air actually helped or not. My thought was to rotate any trapped air around a bit in the caliper housing and get it closer to the bleeder inside the caliper...take it for what it's worth...

Bullitt · Apr 8, 2009

did you adjust the free-running clearance on the Versailles calipers?

You need to screw the piston out so you can just barely slide in a piece of paper between one pad and the rotor.

tx65coupe · Apr 9, 2009

Bullitt

Yes I did pre adjust the Versailles calipers.

Thanks for the tip BarnStang. I may try that as well.

hotcobra03 · Apr 9, 2009

low pedal= i can see 3 things that could be at fault...1 mc not big enough for calipers,,2 you still have air trapped,,3 proportioning valve....

this is what we try when in your position....clamp off front brake hoses lightly...if brake pedal gets rock hard..i would look into the proportioning valve. (internal bypass of fluid),,or mc not large enough....let me know if you try that and what it did when clamped?

Rusty67 · Apr 9, 2009

What is the bore size on the MC they sent you ?

Having Trouble Bleeding New Brakes

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