Help An Old Wrencher Out.....legacy Car Help

JETHROBOEAN · May 7, 2014

Long story short. 47yoa male. Grew up on a Ford dealership lot. Rebelled, and went mopar since teenager. Building a Vanilla Ice car for my college aged son. 88 GT convert, wht/red/blk/manual. Bought car without driving, price to good to drive car. Gonna rebuild suspension and trans. Have a lead on a NEW, never ran,rebuilt T5 from a failed race car dream. Has Hurst shifter, heavy duty fork and TOB, 3.35 first gear. NO papers. Didnt ask if it was a world class. Looks factory fresh. Question is whats the value difference between a WC and a non WC?

Gearbanger 101 · May 8, 2014

A NWC trans from a performance standpoint isn't worth the aluminum it's made out of of.

As for what they're worth in comparison to one and other......whatever someone is willing to pay really. FWIW, most guys I know who blow up their NWC don't even bother with a rebuild. They just replace it with a WC unit.

If had a picture it would be easy to identify, but something tells me that if someone actually went to the trouble of purchasing one brand new and installing a shifter on it, it's probably a World Class unit.

jrichker · May 8, 2014

Depending on the year of the transmission & tag Id, the torque ratings are the same. The WC probably shifts somewhat better,

See http://www.ttcautomotive.com/English/products/tremec.asp for more information - check out the "Light Duty" group, since TTC makes monster transmissions for big trucks as well as passenger cars.

T5 identifier information.

On the tail shaft of the transmission, there will be a stamped aluminum tag. The tag will have a number on it that you can cross reference to the chart below. There is no other way to find out what type of T5 it is without disassembling it. All the rest of the numbers on the outside of the T5 case are part numbers which are not unique to any particular T5 model.

Remember that 94 - 97 T5's have a longer input shaft (about 11/16” longer) and can only be used with a 94-95 bell housing unless you modify or replace the input shaft.

T5's used with a 4 cylinder have a 3.93 first gear, reduced torque ratings and an input shaft pilot diameter that is smaller that the T5 used for V6 & V8 engines. The pilot diameter is .59" compared to the .668" used on V6 & V8 T5's. It requires a different pilot bearing to be used with a V6 or V8. The pilot bearing you need is for a Ford Ranger diesel from AutoZone part #14672

I don't know how you feel about the DYI thing when it comes to gears, some people don't like the idea of working on transmissions. If the DYI transmission fix idea isn't something that you would rather leave to someone else, here are some resources:

See http://www.ttcautomotive.com/English/onlineorder/product.asp to download a FREE service manual for T5 or Tremec 3550/TKO
You will need the Adobe Acrobat viewer which is also a free download – http://get.adobe.com/reader/

See http://www.hanlonmotorsports.com/ or http://www.ddperformance.com for parts

A T5 rebuild kit with syncros, bearings and other small parts costs about $160. It does not include any gears or shafts.

http://www.hanlonmotorsports.com/ also has a video on how to rebuild your T5 or Tremec. It costs about $20, and is worth every penny of it.

I did a Tremec 3550 rebuild, and it wasn't that difficult. The video was an immense help, and I would recommend viewing it. At $20, it will give you an opportunity to look and decide for yourself if you think that it is something you want to try to do.

T5 Shim kits – best product I have seen in a while… http://www.5speeds.com/t5/shims.html
“The Peel ‘n Place T5 World Class shim kit makes shimming T5 counter gear and main drive gears very easy.”

Mustang5L5 · May 8, 2014

Quickest way to identify WC vs non WC is to look at the front bearing cup under the input shaft

Trans on Left has a Timkin cup for roller bearings and is WC. The right one is for a non WC

More info here

http://chris66dad.tripod.com/id38.html

http://www.garage-scene.com/t5-into-ag-body/t5_install_identifying.htm

JETHROBOEAN · May 8, 2014

Ok guys before I go and buy another trans and clutch. Maybe you guys can help sort this mess out that I bought. Has a firewall adjuster and a adjusting cable and the after market thingy on the pedal. The firewall and pedal attachment are blue (BBK?) Cable seems to be routed correctly from what I seen is correct on the net. Factory shifter. cable is adjusted so I am getting 3" travel before the clutch grabs. Having a hard time grabbing second gear, wants to POP out. grinds alittle going into 3rd and 4th. cant up shift any of the gears with out slowing down and double clutching. When I bought the car it had been sitting along time. When I got it home I started to get a TOB chirp with the clutch disengaged. Sprayed some white lithium grease on the TOB shaft and chirp subsided. Should I just pull the trans and check the shaft and install a new TOB and inspect the clutch? How hard is it to pull the trans without a lift? Two man job? or should a old man like me be able to do it?

Gearbanger 101 · May 8, 2014

Sounds like bad synchro's. It's a bit of a job to change. More than most are willing to undertake. If this new trans is truly virgin and really a World Class and the price is right, I'd just swap them out and be down with it.

The trans can be pulled out on the ground, but it can be a handful if you're on the spindly side.

JETHROBOEAN · May 8, 2014

Whats a supposedly rebuilt T5 worth? here is the description. Freshly built tranny from my race car project. Bought the Summit Racing 3.35 1st gear set and had a friend that used to work for a transmission shop do the rebuild. It comes with a Hurst adjustable short throw shifter bought for $250, Prothane mount, bell housing, Summit racing heavy duty clutch fork and throwout bearing, and a firewall adjustable clutch cable kit. All the parts are brand new 0 miles on everything because the project stalled and never made it to the street. No reciepts cuz i tossed them when i moved (never thought i wouldn't finish the project).

JETHROBOEAN · May 8, 2014

can score it for $500

Gearbanger 101 · May 8, 2014

Private sale....$500 tops. And that's assuming it really was recently rebuilt and a World Class, with all the above quoted.

The problem with used T5's, is that you rarely tell their condition until you get them into the car. Worn out blocker rings (synchro's) are common for this trans....and it's generally not something you can check while it out of the car, sitting on the ground.

You can generally buy them new for the $750-$950 range....and that comes with a warranty.

Mustang5L5 · May 9, 2014

When i used to rebuild them...i'd sell them for around $400-500 without a shifter.

$500 with a shifter would be a decent deal provided the trans was rebuilt correctly.

Keep your junk T-5 though. I always say if you can remove a T-5, you can rebuild one. They aren't fairly complex inside

89oem · May 10, 2014

i always knew the t5 was the achilles heel of power train but 265 ft/lb of torque for 86.5-89... yikes...

JETHROBOEAN · May 13, 2014

The seller wanted to meet in a parking lot for the transaction. Big red flag to run away....I am going to pull mine and do it myself.

Mustang5L5 · May 13, 2014

How is that a red flag?

I only ask because I only do CL transactions at parking lots. No way would I give someone a shopping list of mods/parts/etc and then have them come to my house and look around. I'd be paranoid about someone scouting my car/parts and then coming back some other time after hours.

JETHROBOEAN · May 13, 2014

Because I am a 47 year old professional adult with money to burn. If I buy something off CL I want to be able to come back to the seller and shake his tree if I have been screwed. If you have something to sell on CL and don't believe in how you describe it . You should be able to be found . I don't deal with dirtbags in parking lots. If you sell in parking lots and have fear of buyers, you my friend are a dirtbag

Grabbin' Asphalt · May 13, 2014

JETHROBOEAN said:
Because I am a 47 year old professional adult with money to burn. If I buy something off CL I want to be able to come back to the seller and shake his tree if I have been screwed. If you have something to sell on CL and don't believe in how you describe it . You should be able to be found . I don't deal with dirtbags in parking lots. If you sell in parking lots and have fear of buyers, you my friend are a dirtbag

Whoa, ...first off it's safety, one always meets first at a public place. One DOES NOT bring CL people to there house. If you do this my friend, you're an Idiot.

85rkyboby · May 13, 2014

Grabbin' Asphalt said:
Whoa, ...first off it's safety, one always meets first at a public place. One DOES NOT bring CL people to there house. If you do this my friend, you're an Idiot.

Agreed, especially if you hoard car parts. "People" are very observant when they are up to no good.

Mustang5L5 · May 14, 2014

JETHROBOEAN said:
I don't deal with dirtbags in parking lots. If you sell in parking lots and have fear of buyers, you my friend are a dirtbag

Guess i'm a dirtbag then. No way would I ever invite someone to my house for a CL transaction.

Gearbanger 101 · May 14, 2014

JETHROBOEAN said:
I don't deal with dirtbags in parking lots. If you sell in parking lots and have fear of buyers, you my friend are a dirtbag

And you my friend are as gullible as they come and are probably going to come home to an empty house one day.

JETHROBOEAN · May 14, 2014

Lets back up. When someone sells you something as new never used and they want to do the transaction away from their home because they don't want you to be able to track them down after the deal there is something shady about it. If you stand behind parts you sell and describe them appropriately you shouldn't have problems selling them from your driveway. Why would you give strangers a tour of your house and garage if your afraid of being robbed? I would be more concerned with your friends friends or nieghbors that get tours of your stash than a buyer at the end of your driveway.

Gearbanger 101 · May 14, 2014

JETHROBOEAN said:
Lets back up. When someone sells you something as new never used and they want to do the transaction away from their home because they don't want you to be able to track them down after the deal there is something shady about it. If you stand behind parts you sell and describe them appropriately you shouldn't have problems selling them from your driveway. Why would you give strangers a tour of your house and garage if your afraid of being robbed? I would be more concerned with your friends friends or nieghbors that get tours of your stash than a buyer at the end of your driveway.

....and if you were a savvy consumer, how would you not recognize a used item, falsely sold as "new" when the person hands it over to you? Those parking lot lights are really bright you know?

Another reason I've met people away from my home is quite frankly convenience. I'm not going to risk loosing a sale on an item because I live on the other end of town from someone who hasn't got transportation to get out to my place. If I'm at their end of town, or on my way home from work or something, I'll meet them nearby.

Not to mention, I've sold to complete idiots in the past, who are fully aware of what they're buying when they buy it, but have failed to do their research on the product before pulling the trigger. It's not my job to know if the 2000 Ford Taurus alternator I'm selling will fit your 1989 F-150. If you can't be bothered to find out before buying it, don't come back on me a week later, after I've spent your money asking for it back!

I stand behind the parts I sell to be exactly the way I described them....but what I don't stand behind is buyer stupidity. You want a warranty, or a guarantee, and a return policy, then go buy it new. There's a reason I'm selling it to you for only $50 and not the $350 they're asking for it at the dealership! Because I don't want to dick around and nickel and dime with some guy....I just want it gone!

It's like these idiots who want their deposit back after backing out on a deal to buy a vehicle. Exactly what did they think the purpose for the deposit was for in the first place? Sure, you want your money back. In the mean time, I've turned away half a dozen potential buyers because you were adamant about me holding it for you until you could come up with the rest of the money. It's now the end of the summer and you've changed your mind? Yeah, I should be able to get top dollar for a summer only car now!?!....morons!!!

Thanks for opening my eyes man. The next time I see the Snap-On guy around, I'm going to corner him in a parking lot and call him a dirt-bag because he sells items from the back of his truck!!!

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