Help - Toploader leak and rear seal ID -

[Pbum5]

I have a leak in the rear of my 4-speed toploader. I bought a new rear seal and when I went to get to it I had to remove this part. As you can see I had to tear it up to remove it.

Can you tell me what it is?

When look for rear seals at parts stores online all I get is the rear seal that I bought and a bushing kit.

This doesn’t look like any of those.

What is it and where do I get a new one?

Also any tips on how to remove the rear seal and how to install all the new stuff?

Thanks.

 

[D.Hearne]

You can buy the seal locally. Same seal works on both the small block Toploaders and the C-4 automatics

 

[Hack]

Also any tips on how to remove the rear seal and how to install all the new stuff?

Thanks.

Parts stores sell a tool to pull seals with. The tool works pretty well; better than a screwdriver or pliers, anyway. If the tool can't get into the area, a couple sheet metal screws threaded into the perimeter of the seal can help provide leverage to pull a seal out.

I usually use a clean block of wood to install seals like that. You want to try to push it in as squarely as you can. If the shaft that the seal rides on has grooves, the new seal may leak before too long. The seal can't always accomodate irregularities in the mating shaft.

 

[dennis112]

I have a leak in the rear of my 4-speed toploader. I bought a new rear seal and when I went to get to it I had to remove this part. As you can see I had to tear it up to remove it.

Can you tell me what it is?

When look for rear seals at parts stores online all I get is the rear seal that I bought and a bushing kit.

This doesn’t look like any of those.

What is it and where do I get a new one?

Also any tips on how to remove the rear seal and how to install all the new stuff?

Thanks.

What I see in the picture looks like a normal aftermarket tailshaft seal.

I have several toploaders from 64' up to 70' and all any of them have is the metal bushing and the rear seal. The seals are the same (unless you have a big output shaft.) After market seals look alot like wheel seals and the ones from Ford often include a built in dust cover for over part of the output shaft.

 

[gjz30075]

Not quite sure what you're asking. The picture looks to be the seal you already removed. Any automotive parts store ought to supply one easily. As Dennis112 said, simply drive the new one in squarely, using a block of wood.

 

[Pbum5]

The rear seal I purchased from NPD is pictured on the right.
The part I removed is on the left. They are not the same part.

It looks like the part I bought (right) is still inside the tranny. I have to go buy a seal puller to get it out.

When I look at the picture of the exploded view of the toploader. I don’t really see the part I just pulled out. See # 68 in diagram.
Do I have the wrong seal?

The part #’s look right and it looks like it matches what is still inside the tranny.

 

[D.Hearne]

There's also a brass bushing up inside the tailshaft housing, if that's what you mean. The easiest way to remove it, is to remove the tailshaft housing first, then using a flat bladed screw driver, bend it toward the center and pull it out with pliers. There was also a rubber sleeve farther up the tailshaft between the splines and the speedo gear that helps keep too much lube from working it's way between the end of the shaft and the yoke.

 

[dennis112]

The seal on the right is like the normal aftermarket one and would be the last part on the right of the exploded diagram #68. The second part from the right in the exploded diagram is the bushing #67 and it is located in the tailhousing right behind the seal. This bushing is and all steel collar and should be driven out from the inside. It is what supports your input shaft.

Most aftermarket seals will end up flush with the rear of the tailhousing. What supports the rear is the metal of the tailhousing.

What you have on your left of your picture (the mystery item) still looks like a seal, especially since it has the little collapsible spring thingy.

If you have other parts, someone has done a modification that we haven't seen.

Perhaps you should take a picture (if possible) of the rear of the tailhousing so we can see what is going on--afterall, a picture is worth a 1000 words. . . . .

The rear seal I purchased from NPD is pictured on the right.
The part I removed is on the left. They are not the same part.

It looks like the part I bought (right) is still inside the tranny. I have to go buy a seal puller to get it out.

When I look at the picture of the exploded view of the toploader. I don’t really see the part I just pulled out. See # 68 in diagram.
Do I have the wrong seal?

The part #’s look right and it looks like it matches what is still inside the tranny.

 

[Pbum5]

What you have on your left of your picture (the mystery item) still looks like a seal, especially since it has the little collapsible spring thingy.

If you have other parts, someone has done a modification that we haven't seen.

Perhaps you should take a picture (if possible) of the rear of the tailhousing so we can see what is going on--afterall, a picture is worth a 1000 words. . . . .

that is making sense. thanks.


Here is a pic.
I thought it was the rear seal but after cleaning it up it just look like what the rear seals meets.

What really confused me was the rear seal I pulled out doesn’t look like the one I bought.

What direction down the rear seal go in?

 

[dennis112]

that is making sense. thanks.

Here is a pic.
I thought it was the rear seal but after cleaning it up it just look like what the rear seals meets.

Yep, what you are looking at is where the seal bottoms out in the tailshaft. The little ring seen near the tailshaft in your picture is the bushing we have been talking about.

What really confused me was the rear seal I pulled out doesn’t look like the one I bought.

That is understandable, but it was the seal all the same.

What direction down the rear seal go in?

Yes, that is very important to know. The picture of the new seal in your post above shows the part that goes into the tranny first. That is the side with he "spring thingy". On the outside of the tranny will be the flat part of the seal.

Further clarification. if you look at it, the seal is a shallow "cup" shape. Place the "brim" into the tranny first and then tap its base.

Try to drive it in using something flat like a large piece of pipe, a large socket or a block of 2x4 with a hole in it large enough for the output shaft to go through.

Good Luck!

 

[Pbum5]

I installed seal in about 10 seconds.

The way my luck has been lately, I just wanted to make sure I wasn’t forcing the wrong part in.

Thanks Dennis112 and everyone else.

 

[dennis112]

I installed seal in about 10 seconds.

The way my luck has been lately, I just wanted to make sure I wasn’t forcing the wrong part in.

Thanks Dennis112 and everyone else.

Glad that it worked out for you!