i REALLY Really Need Help!

OrangeMustangGt · Dec 16, 2005

I got a nice big E-cookie for anyone who can help me get my car to run.

First of all, my car hasen't run correctly since i let it out in the rain with no hood about a month ago. I havent driven it because ive been doing bodywork.

Here is my issues.
The car started a mid rpm miss which, over time turned into a full no run condition.

I had replaced my TFI module, Plug wires, cap and rotor, coil, and my last try was a new alternator, since when i would disconnect the alt it would seem to run ok.

So, i got my new alternator, and decided that the car was running pretty damn good (i took it for a 10m ride, she ran ok). I figured i would take it up to my electrical night school in Lakeville last night, which is about 45mins highway both ways, and it was running great!, every once in a while tho it would have ever the slightest mid rpm miss, which i just attributed to sitting for soo long. Anyway, after driving it like it was ment to be driven, Im just crusin down a back road about 5 mins from my house at about 2,000 rpm and it just dies.....ce light comes on, but it just died, like it had before....i was barely able to make it home, seemed to be running on 1 cyl. The mystery is back......

So today i got a scan tool, and threw it on, and it wont read anything.....
I can get it to fire, but it misses and wont start, and its Dumping what seems like raw fuel out the tailpipes ( thick black gasious smoke) as i crank it.

I really need help on this one, because it was running great till then....now im all pissed off. I dont think its mechanical, because it did this same crap before and then seemed to run ok later. However i cant have a car that just randomly dies....ya kno? Also, I had put a whole new distributor in last year, so it most likely isnt that. Can anyone help?!!! please?

its dark now, but tommorow ill take an jump the connector and see if it will flash me any codes that way.

Kevin R. · Dec 16, 2005

Check the plugs? Maybe injector got stuck open or something.

Was it freezing outside?

blk9450 · Dec 16, 2005

sounds similar to the problem im having with my brothers merkur. disconnect the o2's to try to make it run in closed loop and see if it still happens.
maybe the maf

HISSIN50 · Dec 16, 2005

Blk mistyped - he meant to disco' the O2's to make it run in open loop.

In case I missed it, now that it wont start, are you missing spark? If so, grab a noid light and see if you are missing injector pulsing. If both, the PIP is likely. If only spark is missing, check the ignition side of things.

Spraying some elec contact cleaner on the PIP components might be a good idea. A light layer of corrosion really can take out sensitive electronics (both edges of the PIP need to be clean, etc).

Random thoughts. Good luck.

blk9450 · Dec 16, 2005

HISSIN50 said:
Blk mistyped - he meant to disco' the O2's to make it run in open loop.

In case I missed it, now that it wont start, are you missing spark? If so, grab a noid light and see if you are missing injector pulsing. If both, the PIP is likely. If only spark is missing, check the ignition side of things.

Spraying some elec contact cleaner on the PIP components might be a good idea. A light layer of corrosion really can take out sensitive electronics (both edges of the PIP need to be clean, etc).

Random thoughts. Good luck.

yea open loop. question on the pip though, its a hall effect with no actual contacts, the only thing i can think of that would get on there and effect performance of the sensor is steel/ iron "filings" or pieces.

HISSIN50 · Dec 16, 2005

blk9450 said:
yea open loop. question on the pip though, its a hall effect with no actual contacts, the only thing i can think of that would get on there and effect performance of the sensor is steel/ iron "filings" or pieces.

Exactly correct. Now since he had a moisture invasion, if a little corrosion got in there, it could create some issues with the signal passage (SN95 PIPs read the rising and falling edge).

BlackVert · Dec 16, 2005

i dunno why, but a loose dizzy immediately came to mind for me ...

or maybe the maf is messed up and reporting too much air coming in?

an eec tool like a tweecer r/t could come in handy for this kind of stuff ...

blk9450 · Dec 16, 2005

fuel pump. give me the cookie..
i think we just figured out my problem, bad fuel pump sock placement..., yours sounds like a dying fuel pump, bad fuel pump wires something like that

edit: probably not since you get the richness while cranking, that seems like spark, not a pip either cause your injectors would be firing to dump fuel....

blk9450 · Dec 16, 2005

try to run it with no spout, so you know the computer is not pulling/adding timing, see if that does anything,

HISSIN50 · Dec 16, 2005

There is no need to make wild guesses. Solid diagnostics in the form of code retrieval and systems troubleshooting when the car is acting up will reveal the issue. Being able to test for spark, injector pulsing and fuel pressure, at a minimum, are necessary. Intermittant issues are the toughest to track down and often the symptoms are not exactly intuitive.

Good luck.

xkuntrycowboyx · Dec 17, 2005

whats PIP???

HISSIN50 · Dec 17, 2005

Profile Ignition Pickup. AKA stator. It is in the bowl of the dizzy and is the trigger signal for base spark and injector timing.

OrangeMustangGt · Dec 17, 2005

ok, i finally pulled the codes. Other than low collant temp, etc because i couldent warm the car up, it pulled code 511:
Which is ECU rom failure, replace ecu.

Now, i pulled the computer, and unplugged my superchip, and ran the scan again, and this time that failure was gone.

However, with the chip IN or OUT the car still wont run......and it ran pretty damn good before i even got the superchip, i mean it idled and it was driveable before.

Sooo, i think i have possibly another issue....will a chip throw that code normally? the chip cost me 500.....thats alot to eat. SOO, my im going today to get a NOID test light, and yesterday i got a spark tester.

HISSIN50 · Dec 17, 2005

A chip in foxes can toss a ROM error - I would surmise it is the same on SN95's. And since the code vanished once the chip was removed, I would say that is probably taken care of and not an issue.

Good luck.

OrangeMustangGt · Dec 17, 2005

if anyone is still reading this(i hope!?) Today i used a spark tester, and it had perfect spark, as far as spark strength.

Next, i went to 3 autozones and none had a noid light. So, i ended up just buying a new pip sensor, and have my dizzy out and in the process of installing it.

Tommorow ill get it in, and see. This is really the last part of the ignition sensor system that i havent replaced, plugs, wires, cap, rotor, now pip, coil, TFI module....is there anything that im missing? i HATE throwing parts at it, but i am lost on this, and usually i can get anything to run lol.

Also, i ruled out the fuel, it was at its normal 50 psi.

thanks.

BlackVert · Dec 17, 2005

a bad stator (pip) is usually fine when cold and goes bad when hot, isn't it?

since your problem is still there even when cold, i bet the stator is not the problem.

did you double check the wires? maybe one came loose or is rubbing on something new and is now shorting ...

HISSIN50 · Dec 17, 2005

Kyle, unless you think it is still an intermittant issue, if you had spark, your PIP was fine. But since this is intermittant, who knows.

In my experience (which will vary from that of others), a PIP can be bad at any time. It generally does get funky when hot, but it is not as heat-related as a TFI. Sometimes a hot PIP will allow the car to start back up and sometimes even after it has cooled, it still wont start. TFI's often come back to life once they cool down. TFI's can also allow a high-speed misfire as they are on the outs.

Like we know, intermittant issues suck. Good luck bud.

mo_dingo · Dec 18, 2005

Intermittent problems are the worst, and the only solution is to find exactly what you need to do to make it fail, and do so.

Otherwise we are shooting randomly here.

Once you get it to fail, begin the testing. Get a noid light and verify injector firing, verify spark, verify static fuel pressure w/ and w/o vacuum, verify a static vacuum also.
Scott

OrangeMustangGt · Dec 18, 2005

whell, right now its sorta not intermittant, as the car will not run correctly......just for the hell of it, im putting a new pip in today. ill see what happins.

OrangeMustangGt · Dec 18, 2005

TODAY, i tried to install my new pip, only to find out autozone only carries fox-style ones. So with my dist all apart, i tried to find a store that had a 94/95 one, no luck everyone is closed on sunday.

Also, no luck on a noid light.

Hissin, you said that if i have spark that is prob not the problem anyhow.

SO, right now, I have good spark, Good fuel pressure.
The car will start only when i hold the throttle full open, and then sound literally like its firing on 1 cyl, and stay at about 1,000 rpm while it belches rich black smoke and the turbos spool.

Somehow, i think its the firing order somehow is changing?

Also as a side note, i was able to get it into the garage by unplugging the MAF and it ran on what sounded like 7 cylnders, and barely made it up the hill.

Do ECU's generally go bad? When i remove the chip, i really dont get any ecu codes.

Please help?!

i REALLY Really Need Help!

OrangeMustangGt

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