Yes,I hear they are one of the best out of the box heads.But do they have the low end torque that Thumpers have?90Notch said:
Yes,I hear they are one of the best out of the box heads.But do they have the low end torque that Thumpers have?90Notch said:willys1 quite few years back I ran a set of ported stock heads with larger vlvs and all the bolt ons. Car was a blast to drive but as money allowed I then upgraded just the heads to a set of out of box TWs. If you saw the look on my face after my first test drive with a good tune on the motor I guarantee you would be reconsidering your upcoming head purchase. An engine is more or less an air pump the more air you move the more power it makes, period! Unless cam is totally off the better flowing heads will almost always outperform the lesser flowing heads.
90Notch said:Unless cam is totally off the better flowing heads will almost always outperform the lesser flowing heads.
90Notch35-310-8 timing events are: IVO -2.5 BTDC IVC 37.5 ABDC EVO 48 BBDC EVC -8 ATDC[/QUOTE said:These numbers are @ .050" lift and overlap at that point is -10.5*
@.050" this cam is 215*I/220*E
Rite oncleanLX said:Agree'd.
In order for the lesser heads to keep up from a performance stand point, sacrifices will need be made with regard to manners and economy.
If manners and economy are paramount, performance will decrease.
With the more efficient heads, you can have it all.
My situation is that the car is not a daily driver, and, I'm stubron(sp?) have a fetish for "stock look" and think ornary pieces of machinery are a blast.
If you've not got those attributes stuck in your skull, you'll either give up performance, or, develope a dislike for your fuel devouring(sp?) cantankerous 5.0.
cleanLX said:Out of curiosity, what are the valve events of the B and F cams?
cleanLX said:My current project is ported stocker E7's (not Thumpers, nor do they flow as well as Thumper advertises) TMoss lower and a custom cam via Buddy Rawls.
25thmustang said:Low 12s NA with GT-40s or ported E7s? If you mean 40s there are plenty of guys out there running low 12s, with stock cams...
Ditto... 'cept for having run the B.25thmustang said:90Notch, thats my combo now, stock motor, Cobra intake and valves in untouched heads. It runs pretty hard, and Im sure a set of TFS heads would make it run a bunch harder, but for the $1000 they cost, I think the E7s can run extremely close! Its all in what you personally want though.
As far as the cam, I am no guru, I have only ever had a stocker and a B cam, and my only word of advise is to talk to a cam guy, and have one ground for what you want. Custom cams are much better than off the shelf, and although cost more, its worth it in the end.
Hmmm.tmoss said:B cam is 224* @ .050" & 110* lobe centers and valve events are
IVO - 2* BTDC, IVC - 43* ABDC
EVO - 43.5 BBDC, EVC - .5* ATDC with 4* overlap
F cam is 226* @ .050" & 114 lobe centers and valve events are
IVO - -1* BTDC, IVC - 47* ABDC
EVO - 43.5* BBDC, EVC - 2.5* ABDC with -2* overlap
shhhhh...tmoss said:You also have a tmoss upper
No. TW heads do not work well with the factory cam. I have seen out of the box Edelbrocks and AFR 165's make more.willys1 said:OK,now that class is in session,would out of the boxT.Wedge heads have the low end torque that the Thumpers do,with a factory 5.0 cam?
What type cam did he have??////////I like the stock cam!!It makes good power down low,,and it sounds nice with 410's90Notch said:"Yes,I hear they are one of the best out of the box heads.But do they have the low end torque that Thumpers have? "
Yes and more when camm'd properly. This is only SOP experience but when I switched to the TWs I picked up power everywhere even down low. Trying to get the car to launch from a stop light and dead stop was significantly more difficult than with the "high velocity" ported stockers. It took some time to learn how to feather the throttle because if I left like before it always ended up in wheel spin. It's a street car so never had any times and I never dynoed car either. But for those who say the larger head won't compare to stockers down low look at ndmp40 combos (from Corral.net), stock short block, AFR185s and heavily ported stock intake he made 305 ft-lbs of torque to the rear wheels at 2250rpm. Show me one set of ported stock heads that make comparable performance.
B303 has a 112LSA and is supposed to be installed on a 107ICL/117ECL the valve events are:
IVO 5* BTDC, IVC 39* ABDC
EVO 49 BBDC, EVC -5* ATDC with 0* overlap
F303 has a 114LSA and is supposed to be installed on a 109ICL/119ECL the valve events are:
IVO 4* BTDC, IVC 42* ABDC
EVO 52 BBDC, EVC -6* ATDC with -2* overlap
E303 has a 110LSA and is supposed to be installed on a 110ICL/110ECL the valve events are:
IVO 0* BTDC, IVC 40* ABDC
EVO 40 BBDC, EVC 0* ATDC with 0* overlap
25thmustang said:My stock heads that havent been ported, just the 1.84/1.54 vlaves and stock cam made 316 rwtq. I forget the RPM it made it at and not sure what tq it made at 2250, but I think its decent numbers!
At normal excelleration when the engine gets to this certain RPM,its sounds really good!! And the 410's get it to that RPM faster then stock gears.(never looked at the tach so I dont know the rpm)Im guessing its the power band.90Notch said:"What type cam did he have??////////I like the stock cam!!It makes good power down low,,and it sounds nice with 410's "
Stock cam, not sure what you mean by it sounds nice w/4.10s though? Stock cam does make nice power down low but there are other cams that will too.
Just for reference his large headed motor made more torque at 2250rpm than mine made at its peak (302).
cleanLX said:Now... You've competed in Factory Stock correct?
Lets discuss something...
In order to perform a proper valve job, some bowl work is required. To install larger valves, even more bowl work is required in order to blend the new larger holes.
I'm curious how critical NMRA is with respect to bowl work when larger valves are used in stock heads?
Oh, and the guys running low 12's on stock GT40's with stock cam... Nice. I don't dis-believe it at all, just, I've not seen it. Any chance you know of any on that frequent the typical boards?
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