N/A Engine Build Done Right

S

stng

New Member
Jul 27, 2005
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#1
So I have been reading all of the threads related to H/P outputs on N/A aspirated 4.6's and it has caught my interest. Let me point out a few things first; Yes I know you will get better results significantly cheaper with FI or NOS. Yes I know that the DOHC is a much better platform to go with, and YES I realize that you will never get the #'s of a 5.0 or LS1... So with all that taken care of, what would be the best route to go if you were to build a motor with the intention of always keeping it N/A? I have been looking at short blocks and it seems that the more I look, the more questions I come away with instead of answers.

With my tax return coming this seems like a fun project as I can put the motor on a stand and slowly build it as the funds allow.

So here is where I am at: I am kind of leaning towards the MPH street/strip short block $3,480.00 . I want to stay away from strokers and it is bored .20 over so that would yield a few extra ci, without sacrificing to much durability. First question, you can get it with Manley or Eagle rods, whats the diference? Which are better? Next I am thinking that you want a pretty high compression engine like maybe 11.5:1 and still be able to use pump gas, so piston selection comes into the picture? Is that too much compression, or could you even go higher?

Now comes heads/cams, For the heads I am leaning towards the Steen Racing Stage II Porting/Polishing Package $1,649 and for the cams I am thinking of Stage 1 Comp Cams $549.00. I read on another mustang forum of a guy who was unhappy with the stage II's because of the minimal HP gains over the stage I's and the subsequent loss of his low end...

As far as intake manifolds are concerned I think that oem plastic ones would probably be the best bet because I AM GOING to start doing this which means that I have to try and keep my cost's down. I figure this would be a good project and I like the idea of having another motor in the garge just in case something happens to the one I have in my car right now.

So you take that motor with all of my existing boltons eg LT's Mid Pipe, Tb/Plenum ect... and I think you could have a pretty Bad A$$ car. What do you guys think? These are all pretty rough plans, I am wanting input on what would be the best overall set up with cost being in the equation... It would be nice if you guys could not only post in your opinion what would be the best setup, but where to buy it the cheapest... The cost of this setup is about $5700 so obviouly if there would be a way of doing for less that would be ideal.

Thanks in Advance all of you here at :SNSign:
 
#2
I already thought of another quesion, Fuel Delivery... Am I going to need another fuel pump and bigger injectors? If so any thoughts on size/brands?
 
#3
Sorry I'm not knowledgeable enough to answer your questions, but I would definitely get the answers straight from the horses mouth at MPH, Tim Barth. I'm sure he can answer all of your questions and point you in the right direction.
 
#4
I am sure you are right, however, Tim is going to be biased for obvious reasons... Also I know you generally get what you pay for but they seem to be a bit on the pricey side. Also it would be nice to be fairly well informed before I talk with them directly...
 
#5
Hmm, Im thinking that eagle would be better for a N/A motor. I believe they are lighter.
Compression should be good @ around 10.5 max (but call them up and ask).

I would go with VT stg 2s. The minimal gains over stg 1s, really only apply to stock headed cars. Once you free up the head flow, the bigger cams will help more. You wont notice the lowend torque loss since your doing an entire engine build, and it will proabbly make more power just about everywhere with the new tune and slightly bigger bore, ect.

yes, it would be FAST. And should make around 320-330RWHP. Also get a tubular K with coilovers, and you would probably run high 11s @ 113-115+ on slicks and if your a GOOD driver.

Oh and throw in some 24# injectors...the fuel pump should be fine.
 
#6
With a property built stroker or big bore, I don't believe durability/reliability is an issue.

There is a big thread on MD or MPH about strokers. Good reading.

Since you are considering an MPH engine, why not just have Tim do the entire motor. Unless you are considering assembling it yourself, it may save you time and headache.
 
#7
Thanks for all the input so far keep it coming... Hotmustang331 I was hoping you would chime in as I have been watching your car in particular, and you are the reason I have decided to go this route... What about the rod selection?
 
#9
hotmustang331 said:
Hmm, Im thinking that eagle would be better for a N/A motor. I believe they are lighter.
Compression should be good @ around 10.5 max (but call them up and ask).

I would go with VT stg 2s. The minimal gains over stg 1s, really only apply to stock headed cars. Once you free up the head flow, the bigger cams will help more. You wont notice the lowend torque loss since your doing an entire engine build, and it will proabbly make more power just about everywhere with the new tune and slightly bigger bore, ect.

yes, it would be FAST. And should make around 320-330RWHP. Also get a tubular K with coilovers, and you would probably run high 11s @ 113-115+ on slicks and if your a GOOD driver.

Oh and throw in some 24# injectors...the fuel pump should be fine.
Click to expand...



i would throw in a SVT focus fuel pump and yeah about 24 or 30# injectors sound right.. like hotmustang said with the stg 2 cams you wont feel a drop in low end TQ, since you are doing a whole motor deal and with gears out back you really wont notice it
 
#12
svttech76 said:
i recomend a big bore kit over strokers if you can do it. some may disagree with me but i think the stoke is already to long for this motor. i also heard some good numbers out of the mph 2.5 heads, but i heard you have to have it installed and tuned by them.
Click to expand...

i would agree going with a big bore block cause the stroke is already big....aint it a big as the 351
 
#16
Thanks man! Glad to see that some are taking note of what the car is doing....It really helps me along when i get comments lie this :D
Rods? Like I said, eagle would be the way to go. Im pretty sure they are I beam rods....manlys are most likely the H beams. Basically the two are for different purposes.

H is STRONG, and rated for about 7000RPM...basically for BIG nitrous/turbo cars making ALOT of power. 700ish

I beams are lighter, but also a little weaker. But being lighter they allow a maximum RPM of around 8K. You could NEVER even get close to excedeing the HP rating of I beams, with a N/A 4.6.


Yea you could go with a focus pump, but with only 320-330RWHP its really not needed. But if it makes you feel better.

Would you like me to tell you what I would do, if I in your shoes?
 
#17
D'SDOUBLEOGT said:
Hello New C6's have 11.5-1 Comp on pump gas
Click to expand...

Yea, but P&Pd 4.6 heads LOVE timing...with that much compression, he wont be able to run much of it. He really needs to call Tim and see exactly what will work best (compression wise) with his heads, so he can get the needed timing out of it. You can do a few step colder plugs, but im just not sure you could put enough in it. Dont ask me why they like timing lol, Im not that versed on the effects of timing in the combustion chamber. Im not even sure if they like cam timing or spark advance...Im pretty sure its the latter though.

But yea Tim would know for sure.
 
#18
my .02.

contact vt about there sr shortblock $2495 all forged. now it may have some short comings but if you truely plan to stay n/a it may be a more economical option. to save the 1k I would research that though.

I think I would try MPH heads. they seem to be getting good number out of them. I would see what they recomend for cams as well if they say custom spend the extra $100. off the self is not alwasy the best option.

I would look for a cheap used bullit intake and parts but if you can't find it run the accufab plenum.

you will want longtubes as to which flavor I am not sure what I would run.
 
#19
hognutz said:
I think I would try MPH heads. they seem to be getting good number out of them. I would see what they recomend for cams as well if they say custom spend the extra $100. off the self is not alwasy the best option.
Click to expand...

the only thing i dont like about the mph heads is with the stage 2.5 heads, you have to have them installed at mph. not only is that far away for me, but i will not let anybody wrench on my car. I am sure they have good installers, but i rather junk my car than let somebody else work on it. thats why on any road trip if my car is out of warrenty i go and rent a car. no way in hell will i pay for somebody to fix my car.
 
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