need help with dccontrol fan

daddystang

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Aug 13, 2006

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Apr 27, 2007

#21

• Apr 27, 2007

• #21

I've got the 3018 fan that doesn't have the jumpers. I'm also using a 180* stat. My probe is basically in the exact same location as yours. Is your probe wrapped in a rubber sleeve?
Thanks.

 

GreatWhite

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Feb 24, 2006

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Fairfield, PA

Apr 27, 2007

#22

• Apr 27, 2007

• #22

Yeah, mine has the same sleeve. No problems with it at all.

 

GreatWhite

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Feb 24, 2006

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Fairfield, PA

Apr 27, 2007

#23

• Apr 27, 2007

• #23

Oh, do you have the fan and controller combined in one? I just have the controller and I hooked it up to a '90 Lincoln fan.

 

Black1987Stang

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Apr 27, 2007

#24

• Apr 27, 2007

• #24

HISSIN50 said:

If a gauge's sending unit is put in the t-stat housing, it will take awhile for the gauge to react because the stat is closed (that's why it's a bad location for an aftermarket gauge's sender). Just in case that applies......

Good luck.

Click to expand...

mhm I always seen the little plug you can take out and put in a sender in the stock thermostat housing and figured it would be a good place to put one......never actually thought about it tho, that would be a bad place to put one....

 

daddystang

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Apr 28, 2007

#25

• Apr 28, 2007

• #25

yeah, it's the dccontrol fan and controller in one. The install went great, no problems at all getting it in, though it was a tight fit. The fan looks awesome too, Brian does great work putting it together and trimming it. The thing blows some serious air with the AC on, just having some trouble with it when the AC is off. I know it's something small that I'm missing, just haven't figured it out yet. It is a very nice product with great workmanship.

Keep thinking guys, the warm weather is coming, and I want to be out there driving. Thanks for the continued help.

 

HISSIN50

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#26

• Apr 28, 2007

• #26

FWIW, the location in the rear of the lower intake isnt too great due to restricted flow. I would put the stock sender back there (an inaccurate location for an inaccurate sending unit/gauge) and put your good gauge's sender in the stock location.

For the fan, I can see why you dont want to access the controller. I'd have an email in to Brian at this point. I really cannot think of anything else to suggest.

Good luck.

 

T

TheUser

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Jul 25, 2003

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Apr 28, 2007

#27

• Apr 28, 2007

• #27

I have the unit with the jumpers, but this probably still applies. There's an Auxiliary A/C input wire on mine that if you connect it, it turns the fan on if the a/c is turned on. The wire is a blue wire on the harness (per my old instructions that I'm looking at, I didn't hook it up). Did you hook that wire up? That would probably make your fan turn on more when the a/c is turned on...I can't think of any other reason why it would do that. Where did you source your power and ground?

Where did you mount your unit or did it come pre-mounted? I mounted mine on the fender behind the stock battery location. It doesn't get wet and it's easy to get to when I need to troubleshoot or play with the settings (which really doesn't happen often, but still).

 

daddystang

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Apr 28, 2007

#28

• Apr 28, 2007

• #28

TheUser: Mine doesn't have the jumpers, and the controller came already mounted to the fan. I did connect the blue wire to one of the two wires on the plug for the ac compressor, the smaller black wire with the stripe. I connected the red power wire to the positive battery post, and the black wire to the negative battery post.

Hissin50: That's a good thought about swapping the sending unit locations on the lower intake. I'm going to give that some serious thought. The stock guage yester day was just above the 130* mark, and the new mechanical guage was up around 190*. Maybe it's a good reading on the stock guage, and maybe it's a little hotter on the back of the intake. I don't see it being a 60* difference, but maybe.

I just still don't understand why the fan speeds up with the AC on, but I don't feel it pick up speed any other time.

I'm going to email Brian Baskin and ask for his assistance also.

Thanks guys for all the input, they say two heads are better than one. Please keep any thoughts you have coming.

 

daddystang

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Apr 28, 2007

#29

• Apr 28, 2007

• #29

I emailed Brian so hopefully he'll be able to shine some light very soon. I'll keep updating untill it's right. Stay tuned, and thanks guys.

 

daddystang

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#30

• Apr 28, 2007

• #30

I took it out for another spin today, and here's the results with cool weather today in MD. I have the temp knob on the fan set all the way down to 145*, and the mechanical guage (after some driving and some sitting idle) crept slowly up to 192*. Now here's the odd thing. I know we all don't trust the stock guages, but the stock temp guage read half way between first little line, and the second which sits at about 1/4 the way up. I'm guessing the temp was reading right around 150*. The temp sensor to the stock guage is only about 9 months old. So..... do you guys think it's possible I have a bad mechanical guage. It's not an Autometer guage, so it's probably not "the best" guage. Hissin, you made a good point earlier about the placement of the mech. guages sending unit at the back of the lower intake. Maybe that's part of the problem too. I think I'm going to get a candy thermometer and push it into the radiator where the fan probe is to see what the temp is right there.

Is it possible to have spots on the engine that are hotter than others. That may seem like a dumb question, but if anyone has a temperature gun, and has checked the temp at the front of the engine and the back of the engine, please tell me the results. thanks.....

Any more input on the bad guage theory, or placement would be very appreciated.

Thanks..

 

HISSIN50

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#31

• Apr 28, 2007

• #31

I definitely think you're onto something with the gauge concerns (not at all for this issue, but you will want to change it around so the aftermarket gauge is as accurate as it can be). Right now, you simply don't know what's going on for sure. If you hadnt posted about the t-stat appearing to open, I'd have had a cow about trying to determine anything else. But your keen observation about the stat made me think the fan should not be far behind, especially since you've run the rheostat down so far (I have mine set on the lower range of adjustability, and it most definitely makes a difference with even a tiny twist of the knob. I set it differently for summer and winter).

It sounds like you do not have an IR thermometer - that would have been my next suggestion. If you can get a candy/turkey thermo' to work, that might be telling. I've only used one inside the radiator neck (not externally) but my method is dangerous if coolant splashes out. This is one way that I've checked my gauge's rough calibration however.

The issue with the rear coolant port is that it's essentially a deadhead. There's very little flow back there, so temp changes are radiant and the gauge is even more hysteretic than normal. I can only offer how my stock gauge is, and it reads 35*F too cool at 190*F. That aint nice. You noted your temp gauge is not an AM. It's still a mech gauge and I put decent trust in a non-AM mechanical temp gauge over almost any electric gauge when there's an issue. The candy thermometer should be tellilng but still, you should be at 145*F or whenever the fan should be coming on. I really think we're going to need Brian's expertise on this one.

Good luck bud.

 

Nutty 5.o

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Apr 28, 2007

#32

• Apr 28, 2007

• #32

Don't know if this will help, but I have my stock gauge in the back near the firewall and it reads really low back there. I have an autometer gauge in the thermostat housing and reads 180 most of the time with the same thermostat. The stock gauge reads 150-160 when the autometer gauge is reading 180, although we all know that the stock gauge isn't very accurate, but def. reads cooler. So you may want to put the aftermarket sending unit in the front port or in the thermostat housing and see. I am wondering if you really are seeing the lower temps, but not where you have the gauges.

BTW, where are you guys mounting your DCC controller box? I just picked one up and a taurus fan I plan to install...

 

daddystang

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Apr 28, 2007

#33

• Apr 28, 2007

• #33

Hissin. Brian emailed me back and said that he thinks the real issue is probe placement i.e. it may be pushed in too far thus spreading the fins apart so they aren't in good contact with the probe. So I just went out there, and repositioned it and started it up again. I "snuck" my wifes turkey thermometer out to the garage "I'll have to buy her a new one". I heald the tip of it on the fins by the probe, and didn't really get a reading, so I touched to the header, and the temp started really moving up fast. I let the reading go back down, and slid it down to touch the intake right up against the stock sending unit. (that's on the front drivers side of the intake I hope). The temp on the thermometer went up to about 135-140. Then I let it cool again, and slid it down onto the mechanical guage sending unit location on the back drivers side of the intake. Just like we were thinking ( well mostly you ), was right, the temp went up above 160, and was very slowly climbing from there. I went ahead and shut it down after that.

I think now it's very important that I take you lead and swap locations with the sending units. Please correct me if I'm wrong about the stock sender. It is on the drivers side at the front of the intake, a gold colored piece that has a screw if you will on the top that a barrel type connector slide over.

Did you say that you swapped yours? Did you have to cut the stock connector wire and lengthen it to reach the back, or was it possible to unwrap the electrical tape and pull it to the back?

What do you think, should I still buy a temp gun, and check it to be certain, or do you think the turkey thermometer is good enough?

Thanks again guy for your continued help.

 

T

TheUser

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Jul 25, 2003

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Apr 28, 2007

#34

• Apr 28, 2007

• #34

Nutty: I mounted my DCC unit on the fender beside where the stock battery sits. I have posted pics in threads before, so maybe you could find them by searching dcc and my user name.

With your coolant temp sender in the thermo housing, what are you gonna do if your thermostat isn't opening properly or gets stuck and your gauge isn't getting the coolant from the engine? You'll think it's fine and really you're overheating because of a stuck thermostat or issue. I'd put your aftermarket gauge in the stock location as HISSIN recommends and move the stock gauge to the rear.

---------------------------------------
back on topic:

daddystang: You can also obtain the engine voltage by measuring voltage at the ECT (engine coolant temp) sensor on the heater pipe.

Here are a few examples:

Temp 212 = voltage .47
Temp 194 = voltage .61
Temp 176 = voltage .80
(Source: How to Understand, Service and Modify Ford Fuel Injection & Electronic Engine Control by Charles O Probst, SAE; ISBN: 0-8376-0301-3)


By the way, my stock gauge on my LX seems to work fine and mine on my GT does also when compared to my autometer mechanical guage. Not all stock gauges are bad, but some definitely have issues.

 

daddystang

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Apr 28, 2007

#35

• Apr 28, 2007

• #35

Nutty5.0. My controller is built into the fan that I got from dccontrol.com.

So you agree that I should move the mechanical fan sending unit up front too.

Thanks for your input.

 

HISSIN50

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#36

• Apr 28, 2007

• #36

You have the OEM sending unit location correct.

When I swapped the stock sending units to the rear, I simply chose to use a machine screw and little nut and lock washer to attach a new wire to the OEM connector. This way I could go back to stock and not have a cut wire (I hate cutting OEM wires). Then I obviously insualted the entire connection. I ran the new wire along the OEM harness in a new sheath and that was about it.

I had a feeling about the probe possibly not touching the fins well enough. I piddled around with my placement quite a bit to try and find something that worked well and was out of the way and hopefully would not fall out. I did my best to get the fins to touch the probe (I wrapped the tip of a jewelers screwdriver in duct tape and used that to push the fins towards the probe).

I'd have no worries trusting the turkey thermometer. Remember that heat and temp are different, and you're inductively seeing temps via touching metal. I think your current method is every bit as accurate (if not more-so) than using a temp gun. I've done the latter before and had to be careful of the color of the object I was shooting, etc. I like to keep it simple and those little turkey thermo's are simple.

Good luck.

 

Nutty 5.o

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Apr 28, 2007

#37

• Apr 28, 2007

• #37

With the sensor in the rad. neck, it sees what the engine is. If its not opening, the gaues rises and shows the motor getting hot. Not sure the logic you guys have with that: no matter where you put a sensor on the engine the gauge will show increased temps. Granted, if a stat is stuck open, no matter where you have the sensor won't matter either but you'll see that the car takes longer to rise in temp. I like to have a reading as close to the thermostat as possible so I can see what the stat is doing.

It used to be in the front driver side corner but moved it to the neck anticipating a sensor for a fan control that senses coolant temp, but now with a DCC controller, that's not necessary so the stock gauge sending unit will head back to its stock location. The back of the engine as mentioned doesn't see the temps as high and is stagnant so it will be nice to see the gauge read a somewhat more realistic engine temp.

Thanks User for the info; about to check you out, well not like that lol!

Daddystang: yes I agree switch the sending units and just pull that wire out of the loom and separate it so it reaches back there. Then just tuck the excess back in the loom. I had my sending unit back there for years and the aftermarket gauge at the front. You don't have to have it at the neck, but the stock location will be just as good.

 

HISSIN50

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#38

• Apr 28, 2007

• #38

Nutty 5.o said:

With the sensor in the rad. neck, it sees what the engine is. If its not opening, the gaues rises and shows the motor getting hot. Not sure the logic you guys have with that: no matter where you put a sensor on the engine the gauge will show increased temps.

Click to expand...

If the stat sticks closed, your gauge (with the sender in the stat housing) will not reflect the increased temps the engine is seeing. You have an unusual set-up if your gauge reflects engine-side temps with a stuck t-stat.

 

Nutty 5.o

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#39

• Apr 28, 2007

• #39

You're so right! Not paying any attention to what I was saying. The neck opening is after the thermostat. Sorry for the bad info! My basis is that the fitting in the neck was before the stat (engine side), which would make sense if thermostats fit between the hose and the rad. neck lol!

I am an azzhole!

 

jrichker

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#40

• Apr 28, 2007

• #40

Actually, one of the best places for a temp sensor or sender is the heater feed line that goes to the firewall and to the heater. Use a couple of Home Depot or hardware store fittings to make a tee to screw the sender into. Then sweat solder some stub pieces of copper pipe to connect to the hoses and you are done. It uses the same water circulation path as the ECT sensor, so it should be very accurate.

Edit: Added the drawing for the temp sender