Opinions on street car motors

92GreenGT · Nov 18, 2009

I prefer smaller cubic inches and a power adder as opposed to bigger CI's all motor. Honestly, if I was going to do it all over I'd get a tuner before any other mod and learn how to use it. I never understand how people can spend thousands and thousands of dollars in mods and then try to skimp on getting the car tuned after all the mods.

Buy a AEM or something if you're going the boost route or get a quarterhorse if going the N/A or Nitrous route and you shouldn't have to worry about not being reliable or driving well. It should drive better than stock with the tune right.

90lxcoupe · Nov 19, 2009

Why does everyone keep telling him to get AFR's????

He has victor Jr's on the car. Those heads with a good port job are way better than AFR's.

If i was you, this is what i would do.

Pull the Victor Heads, send them to fox lake, edelbrock(i think they offer porting now), or any other competetive CNC porter and get them fully ported.

Sell that GT40 and get a TFS r-series or a Victor 5.0.

And upgrade the valvetrain and get a custom cam. If it was me i'd put a solid roller in, but alot of people are scurred of them, a hydraulic with the proper valvetrain will make plenty of power.

Also port match whatever intake you buy.

With all this you should have a well matched street engine and i dont see why it wouldnt make an easy 400RWHP on a bady day

rbonella · Nov 19, 2009

I was thinking the same thing, did a lot of research lastnight and I'm considering getting the heads worked on a bit. Probably going with a TFS-R intake, see what the heads flow and find an ots cam or custom that mates perfectly to what I need. The motor is sound, I just need the freshin up the top end with newer tech. I have never ran a solid cam, but if I could set it once/year...Im cool with that. I was always under the impression that solid cams are for higher reving motors, but this is a street car so I'm not very concerned about making power past 6000. IS that true about solid cams?

90lxcoupe · Nov 19, 2009

rbonella said:
I was thinking the same thing, did a lot of research lastnight and I'm considering getting the heads worked on a bit. Probably going with a TFS-R intake, see what the heads flow and find an ots cam or custom that mates perfectly to what I need. The motor is sound, I just need the freshin up the top end with newer tech. I have never ran a solid cam, but if I could set it once/year...Im cool with that. I was always under the impression that solid cams are for higher reving motors, but this is a street car so I'm not very concerned about making power past 6000. IS that true about solid cams?

If your not worried about revving it past 6000 then stick with a hydraulic roller. Victors are badass heads, i think when you port those, and actually get a well matched combo going for yourself this motor is going to shock you compared to what it is now

rbonella · Nov 19, 2009

Do you know the typical turn around time for heads being ported by fox lake or other reputable head porters. Is there a busy "off season" where it would take longer?

90lxcoupe · Nov 19, 2009

Fox Lake FAQ section said:
How long does it take for you to do my heads?

Normally, it usually takes between 2-4 weeks to completely port your heads and get them ready to ship. The time of the year plays a big role in this also. This is a seasonal hobby for many, so it is good to try and plan ahead if you can.

Fox Lake Power Products, intake manifolds, assembled shortblocks, modular shortblocks, CNC modular heads, P-51 installation, comp cams, crower, ferrea components 1999
1000 bucks, they can get your victors flowing big numbers.

89stang1 · Nov 19, 2009

90lxcoupe said:
Why does everyone keep telling him to get AFR's????

He has victor Jr's on the car. Those heads with a good port job are way better than AFR's.

If i was you, this is what i would do.

Pull the Victor Heads, send them to fox lake, edelbrock(i think they offer porting now), or any other competetive CNC porter and get them fully ported.

Sell that GT40 and get a TFS r-series or a Victor 5.0.

And upgrade the valvetrain and get a custom cam. If it was me i'd put a solid roller in, but alot of people are scurred of them, a hydraulic with the proper valvetrain will make plenty of power.

Also port match whatever intake you buy.

With all this you should have a well matched street engine and i dont see why it wouldnt make an easy 400RWHP on a bady day

Thread states street car motor sounds like u want to build him a nice track engine and spend a ton of money with all that porting from fox lake and not have great street manners?, im not saying your plans not gonna make more HP in the end. Im saying if hes looking for a great street motor then selling his vic jr getting some afr 205s with a good custom grind cam and a SCT II tune will be more streetable then the setup ur talking about. Yeah GT 40 upper and lower is questionable sizewise but so was my cobra, i had more than a few on forums telling me my engine wasn't gonna put down 300RWHP on the dyno in the end my untouched chinese cobra intake made 382RWHP and 404RWT before weather correction on a mustang dyno way more than alot guessed and all of my power comes on before 5500RPMs car idles and drives great with tons of street power amazing torque. Your idea would probably make more HP and do a better ET, my idea would cost a lot less and be better on the street.......... people are saying AFRs from seeing how many people run them at track and on the street with great results

stykthyn · Nov 19, 2009

i would get a custom cam grind from jay at camshaft innovations and trade that intake in for a tfs unit. at tbhe very least if you havent already get the lower intake hogged out.

90lxcoupe · Nov 19, 2009

89stang1 said:
Thread states street car motor sounds like u want to build him a nice track engine and spend a ton of money with all that porting from fox lake and not have great street manners?, im not saying your plans not gonna make more HP in the end. Im saying if hes looking for a great street motor then selling his vic jr getting some afr 205s with a good custom grind cam and a SCT II tune will be more streetable then the setup ur talking about. Yeah GT 40 upper and lower is questionable sizewise but so was my cobra, i had more than a few on forums telling me my engine wasn't gonna put down 300RWHP on the dyno in the end my untouched chinese cobra intake made 382RWHP and 404RWT before weather correction on a mustang dyno way more than alot guessed and all of my power comes on before 5500RPMs car idles and drives great with tons of street power amazing torque. Your idea would probably make more HP and do a better ET, my idea would cost a lot less and be better on the street.......... people are saying AFRs from seeing how many people run them at track and on the street with great results

Ive got big heads and a big intake on my car, the tq curve is nice and flat and it makes peak power at under 6k. Still plenty of fun on the street, all the tq i need down low, so that argument holds no water.

Are you serious about saying he is gonna save money by buying AFR's?? HE HAS A GOOD SET OF HEADS. What i layed out would make an awesome street motor, no offense man, but your statements make no sense at all. Improving the airflow of the heads has nothing to do with drivability. The tune and the cam is gonna be what affects the drivability.

Explain to me how having AFR 205's(which are CNC ported BTW) is gonna give you any different drivability then a ported victor JR? They are both a CNC ported head, and they both have big valves. AFR 205's are around 2000 bones and his victors will cost him 1300 MAX by the time he ports them, and mills them flat.

89stang1 · Nov 19, 2009

90lxcoupe said:
Ive got big heads and a big intake on my car, the tq curve is nice and flat and it makes peak power at under 6k. Still plenty of fun on the street, all the tq i need down low, so that argument holds no water.

Are you serious about saying he is gonna save money by buying AFR's?? HE HAS A GOOD SET OF HEADS. What i layed out would make an awesome street motor, no offense man, but your statements make no sense at all. Improving the airflow of the heads has nothing to do with drivability. The tune and the cam is gonna be what affects the drivability.

Explain to me how having AFR 205's(which are CNC ported BTW) is gonna give you any different drivability then a ported victor JR? They are both a CNC ported head, and they both have big valves. AFR 205's are around 2000 bones and his victors will cost him 1300 MAX by the time he ports them, and mills them flat.

your not reading everything i never said the heads were gonna change driveability. here i copied it right from your post (Sell that GT40 and get a TFS r-series or a Victor 5.0.) thats what i was talking about both intakes are in the 700 dollar range plus throttle body etc. i said keep GT40 both intakes u named make peak power 6000 to 6500 rpms and ive seen first hand are not as good around town as a GT40 or cobra intake u know u cant have the best of both worlds if ur using a big intake like the victor its gonna hurt down low. My motor made 404 RWT on a mustang dyno un corrected what did your TFS R intake make, and im saying i would rather go with AFR 205s then take those victor jrs off and spend 800 at fox lake for porting not to mention other parts they will want to change i not sold on them i am sold on AFRs. So really the only cost i added was the cam the heads which he will get some cash for his victors and a dynotune. Your motor will cost alot more..... common man if your gonna say crap that im not making sense read everything first

90lxcoupe · Nov 19, 2009

89stang1 said:
your not reading everything i never said the heads were gonna change driveability. here i copied it right from your post (Sell that GT40 and get a TFS r-series or a Victor 5.0.) thats what i was talking about both intakes are in the 700 dollar range plus throttle body etc. i said keep GT40 both intakes u named make peak power 6000 to 6500 rpms and ive seen first hand are not as good around town as a GT40 or cobra intake u know u cant have the best of both worlds if ur using a big intake like the victor its gonna hurt down low. My motor made 404 RWT on a mustang dyno un corrected what did your TFS R intake make, and im saying i would rather go with AFR 205s then take those victor jrs off and spend 800 at fox lake for porting not to mention other parts they will want to change i not sold on them i am sold on AFRs. So really the only cost i added was the cam the heads which he will get some cash for his victors and a dynotune. Your motor will cost alot more..... common man if your gonna say crap that im not making sense read everything first

you contradicted youself bigtime between the two posts, im not gonna get in a pissing match here, he could sell a GT40 for good money too. If its an OEM one, its worth most of what a new R intake would cost, and if he bought one used he would break even.

Here's my dyno sheet, no loss in low end tq

Ive also changed stuff since the dyno, added full 3" mufflers, and electric fans, but i dont race dynos. We all know what your car makes, and yes we know that dnyojets rob more power, but a dyno is a dyno, HP numbers mean nothing, HP on a dyno can vary by 30 hp just by the humidity in the air, tire pressure, and the way they are strapped can affect the HP number.

Comparing dyno numbers is like comparing apples to dicks, it just dosent work like that, dynos, at the end of the day are a tool to safely tune a vehicle without worrying about killing someone or being stopped by the cops, the same car on 2 different days will make different power. :Track:

If you use a RWHP to 1/4mile calculator it will tell you that my race weight of 3155lbs and my trap speed of 120mph equals 425.496rwhp. but i say who cares, my car performs, and has track numbers that exceed what the dyno says it should be capable of

Shaolin Crane · Nov 20, 2009

90lxcoupe said:
you contradicted youself bigtime between the two posts, im not gonna get in a pissing match here, he could sell a GT40 for good money too. If its an OEM one, its worth most of what a new R intake would cost, and if he bought one used he would break even.

Here's my dyno sheet, no loss in low end tq

Ive also changed stuff since the dyno, added full 3" mufflers, and electric fans, but i dont race dynos. We all know what your car makes, and yes we know that dnyojets rob more power, but a dyno is a dyno, HP numbers mean nothing, HP on a dyno can vary by 30 hp just by the humidity in the air, tire pressure, and the way they are strapped can affect the HP number.

Comparing dyno numbers is like comparing apples to dicks, it just dosent work like that, dynos, at the end of the day are a tool to safely tune a vehicle without worrying about killing someone or being stopped by the cops, the same car on 2 different days will make different power. :Track:

If you use a RWHP to 1/4mile calculator it will tell you that my race weight of 3155lbs and my trap speed of 120mph equals 425.496rwhp. but i say who cares, my car performs, and has track numbers that exceed what the dyno says it should be capable of

according to those "track" calculators my truck with the times it runs should have around 750hp, but we all know a 750hp truck is gonna run much faster than 13's, to rbonella, listen to 90lxcoupe, porting your current heads and tossing something like a TFS or Edelbrock performer rpm II on there will yield excellent street power, combined that with a custom grind from isky, jay allen, clay smith and you're lookin at 450rwhp easy

95Vert383AOD · Nov 20, 2009

rbonella said:
current combo
69' 357
venolia 10.5:1 pistons
victor jr heads un ported 2.02/160 w/1.6rr
b cam (not a fan of)
gt40 upper/lower unported (the bottleneck of my combo)
30lb jectors
77 Pro-am mas
75 tb
Long tubes
h-pipe no cats
flowmasters dumped, exhaust is all 2.5"
Tremec 3550
3:73

So you have a 357? Vic Jr's...GT-40 intake.....Best bang for buck....IMHO I say bolt a Kenne Bell to that GT-40 with a 80-90mm TB & MAF.

Sure you could get bigger heads....But thats the expensive route for not much gain at this point. Best bang for buck is a Kenne bell....Full boost at 2000RPM Sounds like some fun street driving to me. BTW the torque/ HP come in so hard after 2000RPM with their blowers that you can spot a Kenne bell dyno sheet a mile away.

Chris

90lxcoupe · Nov 20, 2009

95Vert383AOD said:
So you have a 357? Vic Jr's...GT-40 intake.....Best bang for buck....IMHO I say bolt a Kenne Bell to that GT-40 with a 80-90mm TB & MAF.

Sure you could get bigger heads....But thats the expensive route for not much gain at this point. Best bang for buck is a Kenne bell....Full boost at 2000RPM Sounds like some fun street driving to me. BTW the torque/ HP come in so hard after 2000RPM with their blowers that you can spot a Kenne bell dyno sheet a mile away.

Chris

KB kits are over $3000 dollars, hows that cost effective? Not to mention the fact that they are extremely efficient

95Vert383AOD · Nov 20, 2009

90lxcoupe said:
KB kits are over $3000 dollars, hows that cost effective? Not to mention the fact that they are extremely efficient

Well people are recommending he get better heads. thats around $1800-2000 with alot of effort to get a few more CFM over his already decent Vic Jr's. Going fast when you get into 351 Territory isn't cheap.

To stay N/A and make more power he will need a Victor or Trickflow R intake and a cam swap. Bigger TB and MAF. 36lb injectors.

Didn't know he was going tight budget on this.

Chris

stykthyn · Nov 20, 2009

Shaolin Crane said:
combined that with a custom grind from isky, jay allen, clay smith and you're lookin at 450rwhp easy

that's my name, dont wear it out.

Shaolin Crane · Nov 20, 2009

stykthyn said:
that's my name, dont wear it out.

yeah yeah i know, but clay smith has ground me a few cams in my day and they always do great ****

Shaolin Crane · Nov 20, 2009

90lxcoupe said:
KB kits are over $3000 dollars, hows that cost effective? Not to mention the fact that they are extremely in-efficient

fixed

stykthyn · Nov 20, 2009

I get asked if I am him all the time. I looked him up out of curiosity and he seems to do really good work. I have always had good dealings with Jay Allen, and everyone speaks very highly of Buddy Rawls.

rbonella · Nov 20, 2009

10.5:1 cr, I've taken myself out of the boost option. Would be fun, but $3000 is ALOT for minimal boost pressures....remember street car=pump gas.
100% sure on needing a new intake...leaning towards TFS R intake, custom cam
I have some decisions to make regarding heads. If I left the heads alone (lot less work + $) do you think there is alot of power to be made with better intake and custom cam? Maybe bigger 80mm MAF + 36lb injectors?

Opinions on street car motors

92GreenGT

PEAT

90lxcoupe

rbonella

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90lxcoupe

rbonella

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90lxcoupe

89stang1

Stroked and Juiced

stykthyn

I want to measure mine. It doesn't look that tall.

90lxcoupe

89stang1

Stroked and Juiced

90lxcoupe

Shaolin Crane

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95Vert383AOD

90lxcoupe

95Vert383AOD

stykthyn

I want to measure mine. It doesn't look that tall.

Shaolin Crane

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Shaolin Crane

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stykthyn

I want to measure mine. It doesn't look that tall.

rbonella

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Opinions on street car motors

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I want to measure mine. It doesn't look that tall.

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