PATS...I think

[COramprat]

I was headed to a car show yesterday when my car started bucking during acceleration a few times. After about another mile or so it shut down altogether. I tried to restart but it wouldn't fire up. I noticed the fuel pump wasn't cycling and then saw the theft light flashing after about my 3rd try to start. I'm not sure if it startd flashing right after it shut down of if it was after I tried to restart. When I got home I got my spare key just to see if it would work but nothing.

Does it sound like a PATS fault? Would an inop fuel pump cause the theft light to flash?

What should I test to see if I have a PATS transciever problem or what can I do to rule out other problems?

 

[cjones]

if you have a code P1260 stored in the comp then the PATS system disabled it.

i'll do some more reading about how it disables the system

when there is a PATS problem the "theft" indicator will either flash rapidly or glow steadily (for more than 3 seconds) when the key is turned to RUN or START

 

[COramprat]

It flashes once the ignition is on. I really haven't had a chance to really look at it since I'm working but I'm off tomorrow. I'll check to see if there is a code stored.

 

[ToplessStang]

Sounds similar to this

http://forums.stangnet.com/showthread.php?t=697056

 

[68stang351]

Check this out, here's something you can do right now to determine a PATS fault.

Hold the trip reset button with your key off, then insert the key, turn one position forward, until your odometer says "test", then let go. Keep pushing the trip button until you find dtc codes.

9202 Fuel sender open circuit
9204 Fuel sender short to ground
9213 Anti-theft number of programmed keys is below minimum
A103 or 9232 Antenna not connected-defective transceiver
9317 Battery Voltage high
9318 Battery voltage low
9342 ECU is defective
9356 Ignition run circuit open
9364 Ignition Start circuit open
9600 PATS Ignition Key Transponder Signal is Not Received - Damaged Key or non-PATSKey
9601 PATSReceived Incorrect Key-Code from Ignition Key Transponder (unprogrammed Encoded Ignition Key)
9602 PATS Received Invalid Format of Key - Code From Ignition Key Transponder (Partial Key Code)
9681 PATSTranceiver Signal is Not Received (Not Connected, Damaged, or Wiring)
A139 PCM ID does not match between Instrument Cluster and PCM
A141 NVM Configuration Failure (No PCM ID exchange between Instrument Cluster and PCM)
A143 NVM memory failure
5284 Oil Pressure Switch Failure
D027 SCP Invalid or Missing Data for Engine RPM
D041 SCP Invalid or missing data for Vehicle Speed
D043 SCP Invalid or missing data for Traction Control
D073 SCP Invalid or missing data for engine coolant
D123 SCP Invalid or missing data for Odometer
D147 SCP Invalid or missing data for vehicle security
D262 Missing SCP message.


This came from here.
http://www.mustangworld.com/ourpics/fcar/dtcodes.htm

P.S. I do not frequent that site often, but that is some helpful info.





Edit: Oops. I just noticed in your sig that you have a 96, I think this only works for 99+ but I will leave it here anyway for informational purposes.

 

[68stang351]

Sounds similar to this

http://forums.stangnet.com/showthread.php?t=697056

Yeah it does, check your PCM fuse.

 

[COramprat]

Sounds similar to this

http://forums.stangnet.com/showthread.php?t=697056

Yea...i found that one along with a few others. I'll work on it tomorrow. I'm just gathering info on the next steps if the fuse turns out to be good.

I'm not sure it is a fuse since it acted up a few times as I was driving along. It keep stalling/bucking then it would be fine. After it shut down we checked to see if there was fuel pressure but there was none.

 

[COramprat]

Fuse is good but now I have this.

I turned on the key and the theft light flashed like it has been. The it went into a pattern. One flash, pause, then six flashes and starts over. I tried to pull a code with my code reader but I keep getting a link error. So I'm not getting contact to the PCM?

 

[cjones]

the only thing i can find with a flash code 1-6 is in the diag. of code U-1147 (vehicle security status message missing). here's an excerpt.

The fault code is logged when the PATS control module is not receiving the correct SCP messages from the Powertrain Control Module (PCM). In addition to receiving this fault code, a technician may determine this fault code by observing the theft LED located in the instrument panel when the key is in the RUN/START position. In this condition, the theft LED will glow for 2 seconds, turn off for 1 second, flash for 1 minute, then flash a fault code 1-6 (10 times).

If the vehicle exhibits this condition and the vehicle does not start, there is no communication occurring between the PATS control module and the PCM. Check if a diagnostic tester can communicate with the PCM. If not, then check SCP (Circuits 914 and 915) link and module (power, grd...).

the SCP Circuits 914 (pin#06 Tan/Orange at PATS, pin#16 T/O at PCM), 915 (pin#05 Pink/LightBlue at PATS, pin#15 Pk/LB at PCM), At DLC circuit 914 is pin#02 and circuit 915 is pin#10

there should be continuity on circuit 914 from PCM to PATS and DLC

there should be continuity on circuit 915 from PCM to PATS and DLC

 

[COramprat]

So if my code reader is not communicating with the PCM it could be the issue described so I should check circuits mentioned I guess?

What are some of the acronyms there? DLC, SCP?

 

[cjones]

DLC = Data Link Connector

not sure what SCP is but the circuits 194 &195 go between the PCM and PATS module with the DLC inbetween

 

[COramprat]

DLC = Data Link Connector

not sure what SCP is but the circuits 194 &195 go between the PCM and PATS module with the DLC inbetween

OK...

What if there isn't continuity? Doesn't sound like fun to trace that out.

If there is continuity then I'm guessing bad PCM?

 

[COramprat]

I found the fuse blown yesterday and replaced it. But that was too easy. It started up and I thought it was OK but today the fuse is blown again. Some I've got a problem somewhere...just need to find out where. Could something in the PCM be causing the fuse to blow?

 

[COramprat]

...or maybe the fuel pump? The EEC and fuel pump are the same fuse. I was getting that bucking like it was losing fuel pressure before so could the fuel pump just dumped and shorted out causing the fuse to blow?

 

[Mike97gt]

Sorry I would have posted to this earlier but I can't be online much for the next few weeks.

Most of the time this problem is caused by the transceiver. BUT check all the wiring up the column and check for chaffed wires.

 

[cjones]

...or maybe the fuel pump? The EEC and fuel pump are the same fuse. I was getting that bucking like it was losing fuel pressure before so could the fuel pump just dumped and shorted out causing the fuse to blow?

a pump that's going out could draw more amps because of higher resistance therefore, blowing a fuse.

check fuel pump resistance. it should be under 10 ohms at the pump, if you check it from a different location such as the IFS(inertia fuel shutoff) and chassis ground you would need to add upto 10 more ohms.

you may want to check it just after you ran the car(if it will run after putting in another fuse) or just after it blows the fuse since that will be when it's the hottest( hence most resistance).

edit: too bad the fuse doesn't blow as soon as you turn on the key. that would be easy to find.

 

[01Steeda]

thats good advice and makes alot of sense to me


call me rick I'll be at Terry's working on my heads tomrrow, I can get ya that sidekick tester I have

 

[COramprat]

a pump that's going out could draw more amps because of higher resistance therefore, blowing a fuse.

check fuel pump resistance. it should be under 10 ohms at the pump, if you check it from a different location such as the IFS(inertia fuel shutoff) and chassis ground you would need to add upto 10 more ohms.

you may want to check it just after you ran the car(if it will run after putting in another fuse) or just after it blows the fuse since that will be when it's the hottest( hence most resistance).

edit: too bad the fuse doesn't blow as soon as you turn on the key. that would be easy to find.

It does blow as soon as the key is turned now. I'm going to disconnect everything in the circuit and go back to hook them up one by one as another suggested to me.

 

[COramprat]

I disconnected the CCRM which contains the relay for the fuel pump. The fuse held then when I reconnected the module the fuse blew so it isn't in the computer. SO my next step is to disconnect the fuel pump and see if that is where the problem lies. If the fuse blows it is in the wiring...if not then the fule pump has to come out.

 

[cjones]

the ccrm also contains the PCM relay.

i would reconnect the CCRM and disconnect the PCM and the IFS(Ineria Fuel Shutoff) switch. if the fuse doesnt blow then turn key off. reconnect the PCM and turn key on. if it doesn't blow then connect the IFS if it blows then disconnnect pump.