Procharger vs Vortech

scrming · Aug 22, 2005

Ok... so the Procharger is out... Just got off the phone with Vortech. They say they are probably 3 to 4 months out... With out touching off a religious war... Is the ProCharger worth picking up now or should I wait to see what Vortech offers. My tuner said he stopped dealing with ProCharger back in the mid-90s due to poor quality of some components and lack of tech support... I'll do some more reading but wanted to throw this question out here...

thanks!

kevins05v-6 · Aug 22, 2005

the mid 90s were a long time ago though. we are in the mid 00s now so hopefully ProCharger has cleaned up their flaws....

deepinsleep · Aug 22, 2005

Considering it being a pretty big investment, I would wait to see how the Vortech is. You dont want to get something now and regret it later. Just a thought.

MSP · Aug 22, 2005

deepinsleep said:
Considering it being a pretty big investment, I would wait to see how the Vortech is. You dont want to get something now and regret it later. Just a thought.

Alot of GT guys have the Procharger, and they seem to like it.. One of our problems is we need to replace the pistons to better suit a SC environment.. So if the Procharger gives alittle less, it could only help the lifetime of the motor.. But since the rods we have are forgerd, I guess it really shouldn't be much trouble droping the pan, then the crank to replace the pistons..

Of course this is all based on the article we all read, and is still subject to intense testing which would include blowing a piston.. I also remember the article stated lowering the compression ratio as well..

At this point, dont you guys think we should look into the pistons, or just go for broke and install it..

Of course Procharger never makes a mention of the need to swap pistons before installing their kit..

I am curious how Jimp, Fazm83, and Powerhouse feel about this at this point.. ???

Thus far we know the Nitro kit works well with the motor.. But its unknown how it will react to being supercharged.. We are still in the dark I guess.. However, maybe this could be the project which sheds light on the subject... So if it was up to me, I would say install it, slowly increasing the boost.. LOL!! But at some point you will find out our limits.. In Powerhouses case, it was just a rearend, which he already had plans to replace... But to blow the engine would hurt, and most likley lead you to replacing with a built V6, or V8..

scrming · Aug 23, 2005

MSP said:
Alot of GT guys have the Procharger, and they seem to like it.. One of our problems is we need to replace the pistons to better suit a SC environment.. So if the Procharger gives alittle less, it could only help the lifetime of the motor.. But since the rods we have are forgerd, I guess it really shouldn't be much trouble droping the pan, then the crank to replace the pistons..

Of course this is all based on the article we all read, and is still subject to intense testing which would include blowing a piston.. I also remember the article stated lowering the compression ratio as well..

At this point, dont you guys think we should look into the pistons, or just go for broke and install it..

Of course Procharger never makes a mention of the need to swap pistons before installing their kit..

I am curious how Jimp, Fazm83, and Powerhouse feel about this at this point.. ???

Thus far we know the Nitro kit works well with the motor.. But its unknown how it will react to being supercharged.. We are still in the dark I guess.. However, maybe this could be the project which sheds light on the subject... So if it was up to me, I would say install it, slowly increasing the boost.. LOL!! But at some point you will find out our limits.. In Powerhouses case, it was just a rearend, which he already had plans to replace... But to blow the engine would hurt, and most likley lead you to replacing with a built V6, or V8..

I had my tuner, (who I trust) read that supersixer article. He is very familar with the supersixer guys... In regards to pistons and compression ratio and not being suited for S/C... His comment was "That is the old way of thinking.... we simply adjust for all of that when we're tuning... No need to replace the pistons".

MSP · Aug 23, 2005

scrming said:
I had my tuner, (who I trust) read that supersixer article. He is very familar with the supersixer guys... In regards to pistons and compression ratio and not being suited for S/C... His comment was "That is the old way of thinking.... we simply adjust for all of that when we're tuning... No need to replace the pistons".

Well thats a relief.. Thanks for the update scrming!

Aipaloovik · Aug 23, 2005

The folks at Explorer Express told me in an email response that they would have a CA legal supercharger out in 2 to 3 months as well. Their setup is based of the Eaton charger and would be similar to the model offered for the Ranger. I have every intention of putting this in my Mustang as soon as it is available. Now that MSP is talking about going the turbo route, I guess this makes me the SC guanine pig, unless someone gets something installed sooner. I'll let you know how it works out.

echo7 · Aug 23, 2005

MSP, your gonna be the first around here to do a forced indunction right? I myself have pondered the thought of dual turbos after a friend of mine was going to do it to is 5.0 89 GT.

scrming · Aug 23, 2005

Aipaloovik said:
The folks at Explorer Express told me in an email response that they would have a CA legal supercharger out in 2 to 3 months as well. Their setup is based of the Eaton charger and would be similar to the model offered for the Ranger. I have every intention of putting this in my Mustang as soon as it is available. Now that MSP is talking about going the turbo route, I guess this makes me the SC guanine pig, unless someone gets something installed sooner. I'll let you know how it works out.

Can you enlighten me? (I'm really a complete newbie... LOL!)

Eaton is a "roots'" type? Which mean power comes on earlier then say the Vortech or ProCharger or even a Turbo? And is typically more expensive?

Guess it's time to start Googling! LOL!

vb101 · Aug 23, 2005

As for lowering the compression ratio, from what I understand that has to do with increased risk of premature detonation, which is directly related to increased heat. Both the higher compression ratio and forcing more air into the cylinder will increase the heat inside the cylinder. Since the Procharger SC is inter-cooled I would imagine there is less risk with because of the lower initial air temperature hence lower temperature in the cylinder. I'm not an expert and what little I know I get from reading online articles so if I'm wrong on any point I squarely put the blame on the internet.

I read the SuperSix article as well and the main thing they mentioned about SCing the engine is the risk of blowing a head gasket. That I'm afraid I know nothing about. I was rather surprised to read that the rods are forged but not the pistons. I guess the rods are more likely to be a problem with breaking than the pistons. It doesn't make any sense to me for it to be anything else. Basically, besides either getting better heads and/ or head gaskets the engine seems to be very well constructed and should be able to handle a good bit power.

Aipaloovik · Aug 23, 2005

Well, according to the email I received, the EE X-Charger kit for the Mustang 4.0 will include a Eaton MP90 supercharger. As you said, this is a "roots" type of supercharger. As to what that means in comparison to a centrifugal or screw supercharger, well you have to ask someone with more knowledge than I. My main concern is that the kit will have CARB certification as I live in CA and my Mustang is my daily driver.

They didn't seem to have a finalized price in the email they sent me but estimated it would be around the same price as the Ranger kit. The email response was quick and friendly. I'm sure if you have any specific quesitons, they would answer them. They can be contacted through their website .

shooterm1 · Aug 23, 2005

vb101 said:
I read the SuperSix article as well and the main thing they mentioned about SCing the engine is the risk of blowing a head gasket. That I'm afraid I know nothing about.

FYI: Reinforced head gaskets are already available for the 4.0L V6.

MSP · Aug 23, 2005

vb101 said:
As for lowering the compression ratio, from what I understand that has to do with increased risk of premature detonation, which is directly related to increased heat. Both the higher compression ratio and forcing more air into the cylinder will increase the heat inside the cylinder. Since the Procharger SC is inter-cooled I would imagine there is less risk with because of the lower initial air temperature hence lower temperature in the cylinder. I'm not an expert and what little I know I get from reading online articles so if I'm wrong on any point I squarely put the blame on the internet.

I read the SuperSix article as well and the main thing they mentioned about SCing the engine is the risk of blowing a head gasket. That I'm afraid I know nothing about. I was rather surprised to read that the rods are forged but not the pistons. I guess the rods are more likely to be a problem with breaking than the pistons. It doesn't make any sense to me for it to be anything else. Basically, besides either getting better heads and/ or head gaskets the engine seems to be very well constructed and should be able to handle a good bit power.

Dude I loved the first paragraph.. LOL!! Especially the part about the internet.. LOL!! Thats classic, and a beautiful piece of work..

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