QuarterHorse vs. AMS PMS

Lifted94XLT · Dec 30, 2010

Hey Guys. I have a 92 Mustang that I just finished up. Engine specs are in my sig. and I'm planning on goin turbo in a year or so, but anyway, I'm trying to decide what tuning software I should go with. there's a HUGE price difference between the two and major features like tuning on the fly with the PMS and not needing a laptop, but I wanna do it right the first time. is everybody happy with their Quarter horse setup? I know a lot of guys using the PMS that absolutely love it, but have not heard a lot of feedback on the 1/4Horse. How is it, is it easy to tune? any other input? Thanks guys. I just wanna make sure I can still use whatever I get as my car changes and "grows"

--Ryan

2002BLGT · Jan 1, 2011

QH will allow more adjustment for idle and part throttle conditions , the key is to get a good quality MAF and make sure there are no bends just before the MAF sensor , the PMS is ok if you have a track only car and are only worried about WOT , otherwise get a QH and get it dialed in then you can leave it alone .....

Lifted94XLT · Jan 2, 2011

Thanks for the info. my question next would be, what's a good MAF to go with? I have a C&L now and have heard differing opinions on them.

Kdubslugga · Jan 13, 2011

I wont tell you dont get quarterhorse, cause ive never heard of them. I have the PMS and its easily the best thing ive ever done. Love it! As far as mass air meters, PMAS is good, i also like my Abaco DBX. The DBX is a bit pricey, but you bever have to have it calibrated and it grows with your setup!

87coupe50 · Jan 13, 2011

+1 on the QH and DBX

RacEoHolic330 · Jan 15, 2011

QuarterHorse has a MUCH steeper learning curve than the PMS does. It's not impossible to learn, but it is definitely more difficult than the PMS. I've been researching different engine management systems, because I'm not sure if I should hold onto my PMS when I build my turbo setup. Megasquirt has caught my interest, but I'm still not too sure if I feel like re-learning a completely different system.

DonMaximo · Jan 18, 2011

#1 - I have no experience with the AMS PMS, so I have no comment. I do understand it has a hefty price tag though.

I have a Moates QH with my setup. I've also purchased the software license for the Binary Editor and Engine Analyzer. In the least, you'll need the Binary editor for making changes.

You should definitely acquire the Engine Analyzer for capturing datalogs of your runs. This will help you identify areas for improvement.

Before you consider an DIY computer/ECU tuning solution, you really should educate yourself on all that is required and involved.
Go Here: EECTuning.org • Index page
Read the FAQ --- Search for the article:
Things to know BEFORE buying a TwEECer or Quarterhorse

It's been a long time since I've read that article, but you're going to spend quite a bit of money to even get to a point of capturing data logs. Wideband O2 sensors are not cheap, Moates QH card, additional 5 position switch, Binary Editor Software, Engine Analyzer software, weld-in bung for WB-O2 sensor....yada yada yada. There's a fair expense and a little time required just for reaching a point to begin using your DIY solution.

The next step is to "KNOW" what to change... and to what value. There is no quick support line to call...share your datalogs with...or receive recommendations. The forums are good for seeking help, but you cannot count on them.

The long & short of this is that there is a learning curve when performing this work on these older computers. It takes a lot of reading and understanding before you should initiate change.

I would offer a 3rd option to you... and that is to get your car into a chassis dyno where a qualified technician can burn you a chip. A good shop will also go out for a drive around the neighborhood to ensure that your engine maintains some sense of civility for street driving...and after flogging the engine, she returns to her street manners properly.

Yes...you'll need to do this for each "substantial" change you make to the engine. My local guy charges ~$300 for a tune. You're going to spend much more than this for all the DIY equipment you're going to need...hell, I spent more than $600 on all my stuff.

In short...you mileage may vary. But unless you're prepared to get into understanding the Ford ECU in your car, then you should probably consider having a Pro burn you a chip on the Dyno.
((Do Not order a custom burned chip online --- penny wise, but pound foolish).

Just my thoughts... which are subject to errors.

Lifted94XLT · Jan 18, 2011

DonMaximo said:
#1 - I have no experience with the AMS PMS, so I have no comment. I do understand it has a hefty price tag though.

I have a Moates QH with my setup. I've also purchased the software license for the Binary Editor and Engine Analyzer. In the least, you'll need the Binary editor for making changes.

You should definitely acquire the Engine Analyzer for capturing datalogs of your runs. This will help you identify areas for improvement.

Before you consider an DIY computer/ECU tuning solution, you really should educate yourself on all that is required and involved.
Go Here: EECTuning.org • Index page
Read the FAQ --- Search for the article:
Things to know BEFORE buying a TwEECer or Quarterhorse

It's been a long time since I've read that article, but you're going to spend quite a bit of money to even get to a point of capturing data logs. Wideband O2 sensors are not cheap, Moates QH card, additional 5 position switch, Binary Editor Software, Engine Analyzer software, weld-in bung for WB-O2 sensor....yada yada yada. There's a fair expense and a little time required just for reaching a point to begin using your DIY solution.

The next step is to "KNOW" what to change... and to what value. There is no quick support line to call...share your datalogs with...or receive recommendations. The forums are good for seeking help, but you cannot count on them.

The long & short of this is that there is a learning curve when performing this work on these older computers. It takes a lot of reading and understanding before you should initiate change.

I would offer a 3rd option to you... and that is to get your car into a chassis dyno where a qualified technician can burn you a chip. A good shop will also go out for a drive around the neighborhood to ensure that your engine maintains some sense of civility for street driving...and after flogging the engine, she returns to her street manners properly.

Yes...you'll need to do this for each "substantial" change you make to the engine. My local guy charges ~$300 for a tune. You're going to spend much more than this for all the DIY equipment you're going to need...hell, I spent more than $600 on all my stuff.

In short...you mileage may vary. But unless you're prepared to get into understanding the Ford ECU in your car, then you should probably consider having a Pro burn you a chip on the Dyno.
((Do Not order a custom burned chip online --- penny wise, but pound foolish).

Just my thoughts... which are subject to errors.

Thanks for the info and I agree, but the reason I'm considering this is because I've got a buddy that owns a shop with a dyno and is experienced in GM tuning (OBDI and OBDII). He has offered me all the help and time to learn if I go this route, as he wants to get into tuning fox mustang and fords in general.

mhinchley · Feb 7, 2011

I just bought a car with the PMS in it already. http://www.stangnet.com/mustang-for...stang-gt-convertible-over-40-pics-inside.html
I am going to give it a go, since the car is already tuned with it. I have used more complex tuners, namely Digital Horsepower Powertuner for a 400whp Grand Prix I built a couple of years ago, but that system took me a year to somewhat master. The learning curve on this PMS looks to be not nearly as sharp, nor the scope so broad (may be a good or bad thing). I inquired with a reputable Mustang tuner nearby ( http://www.brenspeed.com/ ) about dyno tuning, but they want me to change to SCT chip, $300 and Dyno/tuning fee of $500. Only problem is they are an hour away and any problems or changes......and I have to get the car, or at minimum, the chip to them. Therefore I am leaning on keeping this and doing a quick learn. After all, my car is supposed to be tuned already............but I want it on a dyno and logged to be certain. Anderson is 4 hours from me in IL, so I may just trailer the car there and have them check it on the dyno, since it is their PMS. Interesting article I found on the PMS though several years old: Mustang PMS Programmer - Piggyback Stride - 5.0 Mustang & Super Fords Magazine

bmo37 · Feb 7, 2011

DonMaximo said:
#1 - I have no experience with the AMS PMS, so I have no comment. I do understand it has a hefty price tag though.

I have a Moates QH with my setup. I've also purchased the software license for the Binary Editor and Engine Analyzer. In the least, you'll need the Binary editor for making changes.

You should definitely acquire the Engine Analyzer for capturing datalogs of your runs. This will help you identify areas for improvement.

Before you consider an DIY computer/ECU tuning solution, you really should educate yourself on all that is required and involved.
Go Here: EECTuning.org • Index page
Read the FAQ --- Search for the article:
Things to know BEFORE buying a TwEECer or Quarterhorse

It's been a long time since I've read that article, but you're going to spend quite a bit of money to even get to a point of capturing data logs. Wideband O2 sensors are not cheap, Moates QH card, additional 5 position switch, Binary Editor Software, Engine Analyzer software, weld-in bung for WB-O2 sensor....yada yada yada. There's a fair expense and a little time required just for reaching a point to begin using your DIY solution.

The next step is to "KNOW" what to change... and to what value. There is no quick support line to call...share your datalogs with...or receive recommendations. The forums are good for seeking help, but you cannot count on them.

The long & short of this is that there is a learning curve when performing this work on these older computers. It takes a lot of reading and understanding before you should initiate change.

I would offer a 3rd option to you... and that is to get your car into a chassis dyno where a qualified technician can burn you a chip. A good shop will also go out for a drive around the neighborhood to ensure that your engine maintains some sense of civility for street driving...and after flogging the engine, she returns to her street manners properly.

Yes...you'll need to do this for each "substantial" change you make to the engine. My local guy charges ~$300 for a tune. You're going to spend much more than this for all the DIY equipment you're going to need...hell, I spent more than $600 on all my stuff.

In short...you mileage may vary. But unless you're prepared to get into understanding the Ford ECU in your car, then you should probably consider having a Pro burn you a chip on the Dyno.
((Do Not order a custom burned chip online --- penny wise, but pound foolish).

Just my thoughts... which are subject to errors.

This guy is 100% right in his accessment. I've been playing around with tuning for a couple of years now and you really need to be deticated to learning it. I've read the ford eec epc manual about 20 times, the aem tuning guide, both tweecer and eec analyzer/be manuals and follow all the forums with regards to tunining. And at this point I still don't know all there is to know but with that being said theres nothing like feeling that you tuned your own car and make big power. I enjoy learning so it's a fun process.

09secondGT · Jun 28, 2011

love my pms, starts great, idles great, drives great and smooth at part throttle, and wot is great too.

f8tlfiveo · Jun 28, 2011

I love my quarterhorse.. Don't really know a whole lot about tuning so I paid decipha on eectuning.org to tune my car via datalogs...he has been great and the car runs and drives great.. It only cost me 100$ for him to tune it until I was happy.. So altogether with all of the software wideband and quarterhorse I ended up spending about 700 bucks with the tune..and the drivability is great..

90lxcoupe · Jun 28, 2011

None of the above. Read about megasquirt.

I just installed mine and had it tuned, the car runs mint, there is a ton of adjustability, it uses a plug and play harness, only costs 600 dollars, has a built in MAP sensor, ELIMINATES the MAF(that saves you hundreds alone).

All in all, you could have the car running within about 2 hours from the time USPS drops off the megasquirt, and it took my tuner about 20 minutes of using it before he was making power pulls, and about 30-45 minutes of street tuning, and it was running mint. Hook a wideband to it, and it also eliminates the need for the factory narrowband o2 sensors.

I dont know about the quarter horse, but megasquirt VS. PMS is a no brainer. PMS is more expensive, and much more limited on what can be done.

QuarterHorse vs. AMS PMS

Lifted94XLT

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2002BLGT

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Kdubslugga

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bmo37

09secondGT

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My wife likes my spool and blow-off valve.

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