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Rack & Pinion questions

  • Thread starter Thread starter sparx
  • Start date Start date Dec 10, 2009
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sparx

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Sep 2, 2009
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#21
  • Dec 12, 2009
  • #21
I have no idea what the weight will be. Engine (being built) is a 302 roller with edelbrock heads and intake, aluminum. Also aluminum water pump.

I have not made a decision on tires yet, thinking the max will be 15".

sparx
 
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5280/4

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May 21, 2009
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Dec 12, 2009
#22
  • Dec 12, 2009
  • #22
sparx said:
I have no idea what the weight will be. Engine (being built) is a 302 roller with edelbrock heads and intake, aluminum. Also aluminum water pump.

I have not made a decision on tires yet, thinking the max will be 15".

sparx
Click to expand...


what width tire do you plan on running?

I bet your weight and tire selection wont require power steering. It will be a little hard to parralel park but doable.




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sparx

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Dec 12, 2009
#23
  • Dec 12, 2009
  • #23
At this point, as you can tell from my posts, I have not given tires a lot of thought. The only element I have held to was to go to 15" rims, but have not done any searching on what guys are running as far as the exact sizes.

There is little to no parallel parking here in Tucson, but I did learn how to drive in a 62 Belair, 6 cylinder, 3 on the column, manual brakes and steering. Hey it had a radio and a heater!

I don't need a super wide tire, I am lowing the front 1" as per coils and have the Shelby drop. Going with 4.5 mid eyes in the rear. Also there will be KONI shocks on this one. Using roller perches and have as mentioned rebuilt the upper and have new lower control arms.

Probalby use the same width in rims used back in the day, 6 or 7" not sure what they had.

I like road feel I don't want to lose that.

Also my car was dead when I got it, engine not working so I never had a chance to drive it all all. So I have no idea on how OEM steering felt.
sparx
 

Bullitt

Packin' Heat
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Dec 12, 2009
#24
  • Dec 12, 2009
  • #24
sparx said:
I was considering getting a manual TCP rack to save money, can it be upgraded to power in the future?

How rough is having manual steering on the Mustang with the TCP system?
Click to expand...

No you cannot convert to power from the manual rack. You can't put any sort of "in-line" booster which would operate on the input shaft since there's not space to work.

The manual rack is fun on the street, but on the track or autocross course it's a bear.

5280/4 - I don't believe the Steeroids rack is a J-car rack. For one thing, it's got a much faster ratio than the other j-car setups (2.5 turns vs 3 for most other systems). This link has some info / comparisons to other brands: SpeedDirect.com - Steeroids - Compared To The Competition
 
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5280/4

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#25
  • Dec 12, 2009
  • #25
Bullitt said:
No you cannot convert to power from the manual rack. You can't put any sort of "in-line" booster which would operate on the input shaft since there's not space to work.

The manual rack is fun on the street, but on the track or autocross course it's a bear.

5280/4 - I don't believe the Steeroids rack is a J-car rack. For one thing, it's got a much faster ratio than the other j-car setups (2.5 turns vs 3 for most other systems). This link has some info / comparisons to other brands: SpeedDirect.com - Steeroids - Compared To The Competition
Click to expand...


the steeroids rack looks like a power steering version of the j-car rack. I know at rock auto you can search for the j-car rack. They have a quick ratio version. But anyway the steeroids rack is just an oem style rack and i dont want to run something like that. But you get what you pay for. Its a little cheaper than TCP but much less quality. When i mount my TCP rack in my falcon i will be using a lower cross member.














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Bullitt

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#26
  • Dec 13, 2009
  • #26
5280/4 said:
the steeroids rack looks like a power steering version of the j-car rack. I know at rock auto you can search for the j-car rack. They have a quick ratio version. But anyway the steeroids rack is just an oem style rack and i dont want to run something like that. But you get what you pay for. Its a little cheaper than TCP but much less quality. When i mount my TCP rack in my falcon i will be using a lower cross member.
Click to expand...

Understand on the build quality, but the faster ratio is highly desirable in my opinion. 3 turns lock-to-lock is really slow (especially when you've got a manual rack). Any sort of high-performance, track, or autocross use I'd really consider trying to get a rack with a faster ratio than TCP offers. That said, perhaps disassembling the TCP rack and getting some custom parts made would also alleviate the issue...
 
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5280/4

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May 21, 2009
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Dec 13, 2009
#27
  • Dec 13, 2009
  • #27
Bullitt said:
Understand on the build quality, but the faster ratio is highly desirable in my opinion. 3 turns lock-to-lock is really slow (especially when you've got a manual rack). Any sort of high-performance, track, or autocross use I'd really consider trying to get a rack with a faster ratio than TCP offers. That said, perhaps disassembling the TCP rack and getting some custom parts made would also alleviate the issue...
Click to expand...
as i stated earlier, the pinion in the TCP rack is a 2.09 ratio from woodward. From my understanding any standard woodward pinion will fit and work. So you can easily change the ratio.
For me, i would prefer the limited steering deflection in the TCP rack than the quicker ratio of the steeroids. But in a perfect world i would get a TCP rack with my custom mounting and a inline steering quickener that is easily installed for tighter tracks. I would put it in the intermediate shaft location.




















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j69302

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Jan 31, 2006
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Dec 13, 2009
#28
  • Dec 13, 2009
  • #28
Bullitt said:
Understand on the build quality, but the faster ratio is highly desirable in my opinion. 3 turns lock-to-lock is really slow (especially when you've got a manual rack). Any sort of high-performance, track, or autocross use I'd really consider trying to get a rack with a faster ratio than TCP offers. That said, perhaps disassembling the TCP rack and getting some custom parts made would also alleviate the issue...
Click to expand...


the TCP rack is much quicker ratio than stock. You barely move the wheel and your car will go that direction. Took me a little while to get used to it to be able to drive straight. Going through windy roads I only gotta turn the wheel half of a turn. this is on a 69 with the power rack, stock front suspension.
 

Psydwaze

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Oct 10, 2001
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Sacramento, CA
Dec 15, 2009
#29
  • Dec 15, 2009
  • #29
sparx said:
I read the TCP data and I wanted to understand if the TCP rack changes the steering ratio. I am not sure now.

I have had people tell me that some racks reduce the ratio and the steering become too precise, and the car is hard to keep tracking straight down the highway.
Click to expand...


It's a little difficult to offer a direct comparison between rack and pinion and steering box systems. The speed of a rack is described in its rate of travel, whereas a steering box uses a ratio of degrees. The overall system steering ratio (degrees at steering wheel compared to degrees at wheels) can be used but this will vary between vehicle models. So in short, the TCP rack does quicken the overall steering ratio.

I have heard the "too precise" comment before and it is normally attributed to a combination of the pinion gear adjustment being too tight and the rack not being completely broke-in, preventing it from returning to center freely. After the initial break-in period the rack is as comfortable to drive as any vehicle.
 

Psydwaze

Founding Member
Oct 10, 2001
661
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Sacramento, CA
Dec 15, 2009
#30
  • Dec 15, 2009
  • #30
Sparx said:
I was considering getting a manual TCP rack to save money, can it be upgraded to power in the future?
Click to expand...

We do not offer upgrades from manual racks to power anymore. With the additional shipping cost, parts, and labor, you're better off selling the manual rack on Ebay and purchasing a completely new rack. All the installation components are the same so you don't have to remove the mounting brackets from your car. Just undo the clamps, inner tie rods, and lower U-joint to remove the manual rack. The intermediate steering shaft will have to be shortened a bit for the power rack. But, other than that all the brackets are the same, so the new ones can be sold with the manual rack.
 
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