ran my new combo @ Track, results:

jetuomi · Apr 24, 2004

Well, the beast has been tuned, with the conservative J4J1 program on my tweecer as a base start.. did all the driveability tweecs, and now it was time to goto the track..

my times were pretty much around the 13.7 @ 104mph range, so, that's not bad considering I didn't have sub 2.1 60's on any of those runs (no burnouts, I just wanted to test the top end of the motor for pinging, etc)..

but one thing I noticed is the car pretty much starts to feel like its out of steam @ 5000rpm.. it pulls so hard to 5k then it starts to flatten out.. the cam specs are 2600-5600 power range so I would assume it would pull to 6000 pretty much no?

the combo is very well matched, rpm2 intake, ported 6037 heads, fti cam, long tubes, etc, and the power is solid to 5k..

what I have that might be hurting me are:

(1) stock ignition, haven't put the crane one in yet (man I need a spark cutoff vs. fuel cutoff rpm limited, it hurts to hit the redline now!)
(2) stock catback, with all my exhaust flow > stock mufflers flow, could this hurt me at top end?
(3) J4J1 program, is this weak above 5k? I noticed that all the entry tables only goto 5000 rpm, so, what happens after that on the tweecer?
(4) distributor, its original, could it be loosing timing at the top end?
(5) the stock TACH SUCKS and I'm really shifting close to 6800 ?? haha (tweecer confirmed 6200rpm shifts)

So, yeah, something is killing it at 5k.. hard to explain but the pull just drops.. any ideas?

tweecer log shows Open Loop, 11.5:1 LAMBSE @ wot, crazy...

I'm going to put it on the dyno soon too.

THANKS..

Stangfreak95 · Apr 24, 2004

I dont know man, maybe you're shifting too high due to a bad tach, like you said. Are you sure that intake isnt too big ? Maybe the regular RPM would do the job perfectly for you.

Just trying to help man. I dont know much. I'm sure you'll hit 12's this year.

yellow1995Cobra · Apr 24, 2004

Did you degree the cam in?

I do think the rpm2 i way too much intake for that car. The reg RPM would be ideal.

Everyones first outing to the track with a new combo is never as good as you would like. My first time to the track when i had the g40 crate, i went 13.3@104, i was very disapointed in the 104 traps, and after 3 more times up, i came away with a 109.99 MPH. This was after a tweecer and changing little things.

final5-0 · Apr 24, 2004

I don't think the stock ignition is hurting you.

I don't think the stock catback is hurting you very much, a little, but not much.

Did you datalog during the runs?

I'm curious about spark (total amount & how soon it is all in), maf kg's used (from say 4500 on up), and do you have a wide band?

I think things look pretty good for just a few shake down runs!

Later
Grady

jetuomi · Apr 24, 2004

well, the rpm2 intake choice was from Ed Curtis, and, I've seen other combo's that really swell up the mid-upper torque curve when using this intake, down low is suffering a tad (But honestly, its probably still stronger than before). but once 2600 rpm hits this thing moves, MUCH harder than my friends normal edelbrock intake.. (can't compare to an rpm only)..

cam degreed according to FTI, retarded 2* I believe

yeah, in terms of total timing, that's one thing I changed AFTER my last run, was to change the J4J1 timing curve from a 8-26 (500-5000rpm) graph to a 21-28 graph (500-5000rpm) (I'm assuming that's total timing including base right?) and added 1psi fuel... my midrange punch became IMMEDIATELY noticeable.. the sound the long tubes make @ WOT when starting from 2500 is just sick.. I wasn't datalogging the maf KG's, just the voltage.. so I'll have to convert that based on my flow sheet.

but the top end is what is killin' me, and, if I'm shifting too late, then, yeah, this combo does REV fast.. and I'm likely shifting @ 6500 instead of a more accurate 6000 !! I think what I need is a solid lifter 8000 rpm 5.0 now HAHAHA

I'm going to view my data logs for each run, and post some more accurate data..

but thanks for the insight guys, yeah, I'm happy that even my worst run of the day was a 14.0 @ 103.7 with a 2.4 60 !!! (my previous best was 14.4 @ 97)

jetuomi · Apr 24, 2004

yellow1995Cobra said:
Did you degree the cam in?

I do think the rpm2 i way too much intake for that car. The reg RPM would be ideal.

Everyones first outing to the track with a new combo is never as good as you would like. My first time to the track when i had the g40 crate, i went 13.3@104, i was very disapointed in the 104 traps, and after 3 more times up, i came away with a 109.99 MPH. This was after a tweecer and changing little things.

hey, do you mind me asking what specifically you changed with the "little things" and the tweecing??

do you run ET streets/drags ? 12.74 @ 109.99 is pretty awesome, that's what I'm looking for this year (or close to !)

final5-0 · Apr 24, 2004

As for the spark I would have it all in by 2500 and the total at 36 give or take a few depending upon what your combo likes.

In case you did not know, the numbers in the spark tables are the true numbers with nothing added or subtracted with the dizzy set at 10.

The top two load rows of the base spark table will work great for wot but you prob already knew that anyway.

Later
Grady

Stangfreak95 · Apr 24, 2004

jetuomi said:
cam degreed according to FTI, retarded 2* I believe

You might have a problem here. Did you use a dial indicator and all the stuff to degree the cam, or did you just listen to Ed which said to retard it 2* ?

Cause Ed told me to install mine at 0* (if I remember correctly) and work from there, cause it already had a 4*retard in it. IF I WOULD OF JUST INSTALLED IT AT 0*( from what Ed told me), WITHOUT DEGREEING, I'D BE 4*OFF, that we discovered when degreeing it. But I had a 9way adjustable timing chain to correct my problem. He just gave you an indication.

You need to really degree it man. Hopefully, if you did degree it, you did it with this method of degreeing.http://www.ridgenet.net/~biesiade/camdegree.htm

yellow1995Cobra · Apr 24, 2004

jetuomi said:
hey, do you mind me asking what specifically you changed with the "little things" and the tweecing??

do you run ET streets/drags ? 12.74 @ 109.99 is pretty awesome, that's what I'm looking for this year (or close to !)

I went 12.74@107.1 - 1.70x 60ft, on a HOT day. Then on a cooler day i went 12.93x @109.99 - 2.1xx 60ft. Had skinnies on the 109.99 run.

From the 13.3 to 12.7 i went from 3.55's to 3.90 gears, did a homeade CAI versus the bbk one i had, and launched the car HARD. I ran nitto DR's. Was able to drop the clutch at 4500-5k rpms.

This was all with the gt40crate motor(gt40x heads, b cam), the race weight was 3250, so pretty light.

jetuomi · Apr 25, 2004

hey, I was reading my datalogs, and one thing I found funny, @ WOT, my LAMBSE was 11.54 (so does that mean its actually trying to dump a lot of fuel?).. and my O2's were .02 volts (deep in the RED).. or do I just ignore those values when not in closed loop??

other than that dyno is comin' up this week..
tx

Zero Signal · Apr 26, 2004

If your lambse is reading low, then you might be running lean. What you should do is make sure your car has gone through some time likea few days of driving then datalog some idle, WOT and a bunch of regular driving then take a look at everything from there.

jetuomi - I pm'd you.

mo_dingo · Apr 26, 2004

LOL John. I see you got it up and running!
Scott

jetuomi · Apr 26, 2004

Zero Signal said:
If your lambse is reading low, then you might be running lean. What you should do is make sure your car has gone through some time likea few days of driving then datalog some idle, WOT and a bunch of regular driving then take a look at everything from there.

jetuomi - I pm'd you.

you know what my problem is, the Check Engine 512 code (KAM test failed) is killing me. my KAMRF always stays @ 1.00 and I don't think it can adjust for lean/rich conditions, right? LAMBSE is commanded A/F, but KAMRF is the actual computer compensated change?? LAMBSE at all other closed loop driving is perfect, but @ WOT the HEGO's sink to .02 (DEEP RED) and the LAMBSE drops to 11.5, you'll see in the logs for sure..

I have to get that CE fixed (I think its the fuse, need to find out what fuse it is in the box) and go from there.. I sent you a pm back.. I'll see if I can host the datalogs somewhere tonite/tomorrow..

tx a lot !!

jetuomi · Jul 7, 2004

figured I'd follow up this post a few months later with a more intelligent one.. I've learned a ton since this post, and here were the issues I fixed.

(1) vacuum leak; two hoses were split at the connectors to the intake and the tree

(2) bdln spark tbl; essentially limits how much timing you can run, setting them to 55 allowed me to actually see my timing changes in the spark_base_tbl..

(3) tuned the a/f for 39psi AFPR pressure (and using the injector slopes to tune) instead of running 48psi WOT.. this really has helped a lot it seems.. (adjusting injector timing table to compensate for the longer pulse)

(4) adjusted TPS to .99 from 1.1

(5) switched to 10W30 from 20W50

NOW the car has balls.. so much so that my T5 is done, cooked.. I can't feed it anymore than half throttle or it wants to blow up on me.. haha, so, I'm saving up for a Tremec 500 and then we'll goto the track but I believe all of my performance issues are gone (haha, car related!)..

thanks for your help guys, and this is the greatest thing about mustangs and tuning, you are always learning, on your own and by help from others.. thanks !!

mstangfrk95GTS! · Jul 7, 2004

ya you should have way more in it, i ran 13.9 on street tires with just the following:

BBK Shorties
ORH
Flows
3:55's
Shifter
Ram HD Clutch
Homemade Ram Air

im gonna get a Tweecer and mess wiht it before i get my motor done and Installed, see if i can Squeeze some more power out of it...

jetuomi · Jul 7, 2004

mstangfrk95GTS! said:
ya you should have way more in it, i ran 13.9 on street tires with just the following:

BBK Shorties
ORH
Flows
3:55's
Shifter
Ram HD Clutch
Homemade Ram Air

im gonna get a Tweecer and mess wiht it before i get my motor done and Installed, see if i can Squeeze some more power out of it...

yeah, the tweecer is the bomb, on timing along you can squeeze so much more out of it, and then add fuel to keep it from pinging.. that mod alone must be worth 10hp / 10tq around torque peak..

just curious what was your mph on that 13.9 run?

How is Afghanistan? You have internet out there? pardon my ignorance.. Met any Canadians there?? Where you there from the start? Must be crazy out there no? thank you for doing your duties !!!!!!!!

Stangfreak95 · Jul 7, 2004

Hey glad you found your problems Jani
I went to the track myself but kinda screwed up with my shiftpoints(1-2nd gear and 2nd-3th). My fault..I guarantee a 12second slip on my Dr's next time I go ! No nitrous. No tune.

My tranny is holding up good. Not sure she'll like me too much once I feed her a 125-150shot though..

jetuomi · Jul 7, 2004

Stangfreak95 said:
Hey glad you found your problems Jani
I went to the track myself but kinda screwed up with my shiftpoints(1-2nd gear and 2nd-3th). My fault..I guarantee a 12second slip on my Dr's next time I go ! No nitrous. No tune.

My tranny is holding up good. Not sure she'll like me too much once I feed her a 125-150shot though..

thanks !! I love Tweecer.. dude, you're close to 12's.. I can't goto the track till I fix this tranny as I can't even launch higher than 1500rpm's or the tranny kicks out.. so, probably over the winter I'll put in a T500 tranny, spec stage 2 clutch, billet steel flywheel, and be done with it.. haha, until I blow the rear-end out.. never ends..

how's your tune coming along??

stangboy · Jul 7, 2004

I hope i can pull a 12 out of mine when I go to the track. I haven't done any tuning since I put the motor together. All i did was set my timing to 14*. I really want to get another radiator before I go to the track, though. The stock one just can't handle anymore than one or two hard runs before the temp starts getting too high for my comfort.

All this Tweecer talk was just confusing me so I think I'm gonna go the custom chip route.

VibrantRedGT · Jul 7, 2004

Fix the 5000 rpm issue but your really over reving the car. Probably the reason for you low MPH. We've all done it, keep it WOT at the track because she's pulling. Meanwhile the powerband is like 1500 rpm back.

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