Steering Shake

Marine One · Dec 20, 2006

xbone said:
Don't understand your diagnoses, are you saying they weren't mounted flat on the hub? Or that they were out of true? An out of true rim can be balanced, it just takes more weight. If these are factory rims, exactly what did the tire shop do to correct it?

Based on what he's described, I'm not sure what they did either...

stangguy94 · Dec 20, 2006

he has aftermarket wheels that are lugcentric and not hubcentric. they make a tool to go on a tire balancer that is lugcentric for these type wheels. I just put 20" Foose Nitrous wheels on my car and went thru the same thing.

Marine One · Dec 20, 2006

stangguy94 said:
he has aftermarket wheels that are lugcentric and not hubcentric. they make a tool to go on a tire balancer that is lugcentric for these type wheels. I just put 20" Foose Nitrous wheels on my car and went thru the same thing.

Okay, I'll bite. What is the difference between hubcentric and lugcentric wheels?

MBDiagMan · Dec 21, 2006

The VAST MAJORITY of vibrations, ESPECIALLY steering wheel shake are due to tire/wheel imbalance or a bad tire that exhibits excessive Road Force Variation(RFV.) RFV is a fancy technical term for stiff spots.

The fact that this shaking began when tires were rotated, makes tire/wheel problems a virtual certainty as the cause. I have no idea why they cut the rotors, if they even actually DID cut the rotors. It is possible that they did this, or indicated that they did this so that they could charge this on a warranty claim back to Ford.

denck · Dec 21, 2006

The difference between hub centric and lug centric are:

Hub centric, the rim rests on the Hub, when spin balancing, it needs to mount to the machine from the center of the rim..

Lug centric, the rim rests on the lug nuts, not the center hub. You need to balance the rim from the lugs with an adapter on the machine. Most shops do not have a lug adapter because they are expensive to add on..

All the previous tire stores balanced them on the hub, not the lug.. That had them out of balance when mounted on the car..

Marine One · Dec 21, 2006

denck said:
The difference between hub centric and lug centric are:

Hub centric, the rim rests on the Hub, when spin balancing, it needs to mount to the machine from the center of the rim..

Lug centric, the rim rests on the lug nuts, not the center hub. You need to balance the rim from the lugs with an adapter on the machine. Most shops do not have a lug adapter because they are expensive to add on..

All the previous tire stores balanced them on the hub, not the lug.. That had them out of balance when mounted on the car..

Taking this one step further, I'm guessing that the fatory wheels on our cars are hub centric?

denck · Dec 21, 2006

From what I have been told, they are hub centric from Ford.. The aftermarket rims they put on were supposed to be hub centric also, but the shop yesterday said the rims did not quite touch the hub so they were riding on the studs instead..

I guess aftermarket rims are set up for quite a few different cars so they do not fit them all as well as the maufacturers ones..

Last thing I noticed this am was that they were shaking again, but it turns out that that is the tires when cold.. it was 40 degrees this am and I only commute 7 miles.. I took it out and drive on the freeway for a while and warmed them up and they are smooth again.. The shop said that the Toyo's I have are stiff in cold weather and may vibrate until hot...

CHeers, David

duke404 · Dec 21, 2006

I have an '07 GT with 400 miles on it and am experiencing the same problem. I have 18" rims w/ BFG KDW's but no other mods. I also notice the shimmy intermittently, mostly from 50-70 mph. It's funny, because the wheel moves but if I let go of it, the car drives straight and smooth, only the wheel is vibrating slightly left and right. It doesn't really bother me, and I can't believe it's a tire or balance problem, because they're brand new. I didn't drive the car over 30 before I got the new rims/tires, so have nothing to compare it to. If it were a balance problem, wouldn't it happen all the time, at all speeds??? This is weird, but thankfully it doesn't bother me too much. However, I don't want to destroy $1000 worth of tires, so I am going to take it in to the tire shop and see what they tell me. The shop is first class, and very honest. Could it have anything to do with the WIDTH of the rims/tires? I've got 9" rims front 10" rear w/ 255/45's and 285/40's.

Marine One · Dec 22, 2006

duke404 said:
I have an '07 GT with 400 miles on it and am experiencing the same problem. I have 18" rims w/ BFG KDW's but no other mods. I also notice the shimmy intermittently, mostly from 50-70 mph. It's funny, because the wheel moves but if I let go of it, the car drives straight and smooth, only the wheel is vibrating slightly left and right. It doesn't really bother me, and I can't believe it's a tire or balance problem, because they're brand new. I didn't drive the car over 30 before I got the new rims/tires, so have nothing to compare it to. If it were a balance problem, wouldn't it happen all the time, at all speeds??? This is weird, but thankfully it doesn't bother me too much. However, I don't want to destroy $1000 worth of tires, so I am going to take it in to the tire shop and see what they tell me. The shop is first class, and very honest. Could it have anything to do with the WIDTH of the rims/tires? I've got 9" rims front 10" rear w/ 255/45's and 285/40's.

Most of the balance problems that I have experienced on Mustangs, as well as other cars, usually present themselves starting at around 50-55 MPH through about 70 MPH. As an aside to all of this, last night I rotated the tires on my 07 GT for the first time (7500 miles). When I had the wheels off the front end, I removed the brake rotor retaining clip from the wheel stud on each of the two front hubs. Before rotating the tires I had a slight trace of shimmy. It is completely gone now. I don't know if the clips were the culprits, or if one of my wheels that was previously on the front of the car was just slightly out of balance or round. I mention this because it might be worth it to remove these clips before taking the car in to see if it solves your problem.

denck · Dec 22, 2006

Hi duke404,

My problem was exactly the same as yours, and I have the exact same size rims and tires.. I am sure you have the same problem.. THe rims are just a hair off from hiting the hubs and they wobble just a little. 50 to 70 was the speeds for me too. Sometimes hardly at all, and sometimes more. Seemed the warmer it got, the metal would expand and touch the hub to the rim smoothing it out a bit..

I am sure you need to fine a tire shop who has an adapter to balance the rim from the studs. I bet you this will fix the problem.. Even better is an on car spin balance after they stud balance them.

Good luck, I thought I could live with it too, but it starts to nag at your brain that is should be smooth..

Cheers, David

denck · Dec 22, 2006

I second the clips removal part too, I have read a lot of people with that issue on diff. Mustang boards.. Unfortunatly mine already had them removed with the new rims so it did not help me, but it may be the first thing for DUke404 to try, and at least its free to check..

stang8urimport · Dec 22, 2006

You're just a whiney bitch. Get over it.

Marine One · Dec 22, 2006

PoopDawg said:
You're just a whiney bitch. Get over it.

Nice, real nice!

I guess we know what you'll be getting in YOUR stocking this Christmas...

Cobra1894 · Dec 22, 2006

I have the same issue as everyone else. I had the tires and wheels road balanced and it seemed to help for a week or so and I have the shimmy. I guess the only other thing to do is the hubcentric balancing.

stang8urimport · Dec 22, 2006

Marine One said:
Nice, real nice!

I guess we know what you'll be getting in YOUR stocking this Christmas...

I don't have much under the tree...

stangguy94 · Dec 22, 2006

My car does it intermittenly but it's not that bad. I will try removing the clips to see if it changes it any.

Marine One · Dec 23, 2006

PoopDawg said:
I don't have much under the tree...

duke404 · Jan 11, 2007

I just thought of a potential cause of this problem so I want to run it by everyone. Could the shimmy/tire & wheel imbalance be due to the banded air pressure sensors? For instance, if the sensors move around within the tire, wouldn't that throw off the balance? The tire/rim would only stay balanced if the sensor and band remained exactly where it was when the tire/rim was balanced. I am not sure, but it sounds feasible to me. I just don't know if the sensors move around on the rim when it's spinning. How tight are they supposed to be on the rim? Maybe they would rotate on the rim during a jar or something? Just a thought.

billy_tripper · Jan 11, 2007

denck said:
The difference between hub centric and lug centric are:

Hub centric, the rim rests on the Hub, when spin balancing, it needs to mount to the machine from the center of the rim..

Lug centric, the rim rests on the lug nuts, not the center hub. You need to balance the rim from the lugs with an adapter on the machine. Most shops do not have a lug adapter because they are expensive to add on..

All the previous tire stores balanced them on the hub, not the lug.. That had them out of balance when mounted on the car..

I'm glad you found your answer. I was going to mention that a lug hole balance might be the answer to your problem. Where I work, we have come to the point to where we do any "newer" car with a lug hole balance. Most wheels are not perfectly hub centric to the cars they're going on because they make them to fit so many different models. Also, hub centric rings don't always take care of it....and they're a pain to keep up with. I've taken many newer cars that have had wheels put on at other shops and have tried tire shop after tire shop without luck and have solved their problems with a lug hole balance. Cars nowadays are much more sensitive than they used to be and so everything must be perfect.

hedgehogrgc · Apr 9, 2007

same problem

Well i had the same problem...the dealership wouldnt help, so i phoned ford...they are replacing my rotors under warrenty.

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