Wheel weight touches UCA; different wheel weight or file?

70vert · Sep 9, 2005

Hey all,
Well, I thought I was in the clear but the wheel touches the UCA. With a 5/16" spacer it's OK and doesn't touch, but then my inner wheel weight touches the UCA. The first pic is before the spacer, this is on a 17x8 with 4.75bs and a Unique Performance coilover. It has a pretty hefty lip on the UCA.
Question is, what would you do - I don't know enough about wheel weighting and balancing to know if I can go ask for a different style weight from the tire guys. Or should I leave it as is and file down the UCA? It would require quite a bit of filing and I would rather find a different wheel weight - they used flat ones on the inside of the alloy wheels opposite to these, why not a flat one on this side?

1966conv · Sep 9, 2005

I have an opinion which may not be appreciated. Get new Wheels with the correct backspacing.
I'd never grind on any suspension part as that's asking for catastrophic failure which could injure or kill you and others. I'd maybe try to find a 3/8 spacer but that's about as much as I'd go and I don't know if that's enough.

I have seen internal weights but I don't know if that's an option or not either. These weights look like the chiclet style gum and are glued to the area behind the spokes. The flat (are like the ones I mentioned) ones you see might come from the factory to balance the wheel, but the addition of the tire changes the balance.

SitDown · Sep 9, 2005

the flat stick on weights can replace those, thats all ive ever used on all my wheels. in addition id look to do some slight grinding to the UCA to try to get u down to a smaller spacer. im assuming ur running standard length studs?

70vert · Sep 9, 2005

I understand the concern

Thanks for the reply 66. I hear you, but I know there are guys here who round off the edges of, say, a TCP coilover to gain a little clearance. I'm sure there's some leftover material on the edges that's due more to the way the manufacturing process has to work than to strength being needed there. But yeah, I'd rather not file anything.

I guess I'm looking for someone who knows wheel weights, then. ANYONE? Or tire weights in this case I guess, I do have the flat wheel weights on the other side. I have half a mind to just bend up the tire weight so it is sticking out above the UCA and drive it to the tire place (Costco in this case) like that w/o freeway driving and see if they can solve it. Or take it to a real tire place.

I like the 4.75bs - it was described by the wheel company (Coy's Wheel) as being more appropriate to a Mustang, (they specifically designed the BS for a Mustang) esp. early ones like '65-66 and I like the extra outer clearance for future lowering of the car. Sort of on the razor's edge because I have one of the fattest UCAs "knuckles" out there but there you go.

Any wheel weight experts out there?

reenmachine · Sep 9, 2005

Please just have the wheels/tires rebalanced with the stick-on weights! I absolutely cannot imagine why someone would grind material off of a structural suspension component for any reason whatsoever.

A single set of weights towards the inside of the wheel technically doesn't yield as good a balance as a set on the outside and a set on the inside, but it's more than good enough. You'll never notice the difference unless you routinely travel at 125 mph.

That, and it has the advantage of you not dying in a spectacular fashion.

reenmachine · Sep 9, 2005

70vert said:
I guess I'm looking for someone who knows wheel weights, then. ANYONE? Or tire weights in this case I guess, I do have the flat wheel weights on the other side. I have half a mind to just bend up the tire weight so it is sticking out above the UCA and drive it to the tire place (Costco in this case) like that w/o freeway driving and see if they can solve it. Or take it to a real tire place.

There's part of your problem -- avoid Costco. Go to a place that sells high-end blibg-bling wheels and they'll know how to properly balance the combo without it looking ugly.

What do you mean you have flat wheel weights on the other side? The other front wheel or on the outside portion of this wheel?

reenmachine · Sep 9, 2005

P.S. Is your tire also going to rub when it deflects under hard cornering or hitting a pothole?

70vert · Sep 9, 2005

reenmachine said:
What do you mean you have flat wheel weights on the other side? The other front wheel or on the outside portion of this wheel?

thanks for the comments Reen, I don't plan on dying in a spectacular fashion anytime soon. Here are some better photos not taken at midnight. They are flat wheel weights on the other side of the same wheel inside the rim, and the tire weight is on the opposite inside corner of the wheel.

Also, better photos of the UCA clearance otherwise. 2 Mustang car keys' worth at the closest. That's with the 5/16" wheel spacer - 2 shops have told me that should be OK but I can go down to 1/4" if I solve this weights issue. Yes, they are standard wheel studs.

Thought I was in the clear, literally. I never thought about those little lead weights.

70vert · Sep 9, 2005

3rd photo

only 2 photos per post . . .

70vert · Sep 9, 2005

tire is in the clear

reenmachine said:
P.S. Is your tire also going to rub when it deflects under hard cornering or hitting a pothole?

no, the tire will be fine - you can kind of see that in the "keys" photo. The only thing in the same plane as the tire is the grease fitting, and that's way in there.

Capt Dan · Sep 9, 2005

I'm sure if you go to a reputable wheel shop you can ask for any kind of weights you want. Just take it in and have it re-balanced.

bnickel · Sep 9, 2005

i'm sure i'll get flamed for this but, i would seriously consider doing some grinding on that UCA, grind it down so have enough clearance and then have a piece welded back in. the structure is just fine and it won't hurt to grind on it, it is just the design of the ball joint cup, it sucks. that's one reason i don't like the UP coilovers, everyone else uses a flat plate to mount the ball joint except UP.

check some of opentrackers posts about modiying the stock UCA and you'll get an idea of how to modify these. personally i'd feel safer modifying the UCA than using the spacer.

66Runt · Sep 9, 2005

Lot of weight

Hi, if those pictures all came from the same tire, it looks like there is 2.25 oz of "stick-on" weight and 1/2 oz of rim weight.

If that is all in the same spot, I'd break the bead and spin the tire 180 degrees on the rim and re-balance. might find you can get away with a lot less weight that way.

Good luck,

Scott

70vert · Sep 9, 2005

better wheel shop

Yes, the photos are all on the same wheel/tire. It's not in the same spot, they are diagonally opposed across the wheel - the "stick-on" is toward the outside of the rim and the rim weight is 180 degrees opposed on the inside of the rim.

It looks like the consensus is "go to a high-end rim/wheel shop and get wheel weights all around rather than rim weights and wheel weights on the same wheel" I'll just peel up the rim weights and drive slowly to a good shop.

As far as the spacers go, I can figure that out later. UP has an external ridge or wall that the A arms themselves are welded to, rather than a flat plate as bnickel points out. My concern about filing the lip is that if that ring is the main thing that supports it rather than the flat plate, I'm thinning it out at its' thinnest point. Bad photo attached.

Yeah, bad design of that cup bnickel. Oh, I see what you're recommending, an internal reinforcement/gusset to make up for what is taken off from the outside.

66Runt said:
Hi, if those pictures all came from the same tire, it looks like there is 2.25 oz of "stick-on" weight and 1/2 oz of rim weight.

If that is all in the same spot, I'd break the bead and spin the tire 180 degrees on the rim and re-balance. might find you can get away with a lot less weight that way.

Good luck,

Scott

Opentracker · Sep 10, 2005

FYI -The arm on the left in these photos is an early '65-'66 arm that I cut the nose off of to give room for a wheel with more backspacing. I added the brace on the bottom and a gusset on top. The mounting area of the ball joint is 1/4" thick. I don't thing I'll have any problems with it.

John

bnickel · Sep 10, 2005

thanks John, that's what i was talking about.

70 vert if you do something similar, to that you'll plenty of clearance for your wheels and not have to worry the structural integrity of the part. you have plenty of room to cut the wall of the cup back and then either weld a piece back in the front or weld a piece on the bottom, either way you should be fine and it would be a better fix in the long run aas opposed tousing the spacer.

race-rodz · Sep 11, 2005

might be a lil off, but when you lower the car... the clearance should change(increase)

i would also trim up the nose of the uca, and get rid of the spacers. imo spacers are unsafe, never have/never will run them on anything.

triming the nose up similar to the pics above should yeaild enough clearance without spacers, along with a good balance job from a real tire shop using stick on wieghts

70vert · Sep 13, 2005

Resolution: stick-on weights, slight grinding

Hey all,
Thanks for the suggestions. I ended up filing down the rim weights just for the drive to the wheel shop. For now, I got the stick-on weights replaced and for some reason the non-driver's side was closer, so the shop ground the UCA slightly. They said they would not recommend grinding it if it were the face that the ball joint sits on, but since it is that lip they saw no problem with a slight grind. They recommended longer wheel studs and a 1/4 instead of a 5/16" spacer, and that's what I think I'll do.

For what it's worth, my main shop that's been around for 25 years or so races with a 1/4" spacer, no problems.

Now for the fun:

http://homepage.mac.com/jbauder/PhotoAlbum76.html

krash kendall · Sep 14, 2005

70vert said:
They recommended longer wheel studs and a 1/4 instead of a 5/16" spacer, and that's what I think I'll do.

So, they suggest that you go with thinner spacers and longer wheel studs? I would think that you require thicker spacers.

70vert · Sep 14, 2005

whoops

sorry, I should clarify/correct:

1. Longer wheel studs to give the lugnuts more to hold on to

2. 5/16 spacers can stay, or

3. 1/4" spacers and a little more grinding. I have yet drive it hard to see if wheel flex will make it touch the UCA in any condition, that's the only unknown. Actually, looking at Baer's website they recommend at least .1" of clearance anywhere around the wheel, so with my 1/4" of clearance at the rim-to-UCA area I should be fine.

I might wait to do the longer studs until I install Baer front Track brakes and see if that throws anything else into the equation, which Murphy's law says it invariably will.

Wheel weight touches UCA; different wheel weight or file?

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