x pipe

[wytstang]

This comes up all the time, so the info stays pretty fresh in my memory. The last dyno test I saw was in 5.0 magazine, where the lined up about 9 intermediaries on the same mustang in one day. It was a fox body 5.0 with heads and cam, producing about 280ish hp to the wheels. The article is at least 5 years old, but most of the intermediary manufacturers have not adjusted their designs much since then anyway. I thought this to be the most pertinent article I have read on the subject, because it was done on the same car, testing only the intermediary itself, and on a car with the most common mods done to 5.0 engines. I think that if you are comparing intermediaries, it doesn't get more scientific than that. I have read a few articles on the subject, but this is the only one that tested all the major manufacturers, and many of the other articles written also tested with different headers and such creating more variables. Anyway, Dr. Gas was the first to introduce the X-pipe in large scale, and kind of got a reputation for it. I was very surprised to see that it landed dead last on the dyno test. I think the main factor in this, is that the Dr. Gas comes in pieces that can be adjusted to fit different exhaust systems. Making all the parts adjustable causes the X to fall in a less optimal location. I was absolutely amazed how far out ahead the ProChamber came. It staggered me. But there is no denying it, when you test it on the same car on the same day. The dyno doesn't lie.

Kurt

Cool, that just makes me even more pleased that I picked up a prochamber.

 

[nmcgrawj]

This comes up all the time, so the info stays pretty fresh in my memory. The last dyno test I saw was in 5.0 magazine, where the lined up about 9 intermediaries on the same mustang in one day. It was a fox body 5.0 with heads and cam, producing about 280ish hp to the wheels. The article is at least 5 years old, but most of the intermediary manufacturers have not adjusted their designs much since then anyway. I thought this to be the most pertinent article I have read on the subject, because it was done on the same car, testing only the intermediary itself, and on a car with the most common mods done to 5.0 engines. I think that if you are comparing intermediaries, it doesn't get more scientific than that. I have read a few articles on the subject, but this is the only one that tested all the major manufacturers, and many of the other articles written also tested with different headers and such creating more variables. Anyway, Dr. Gas was the first to introduce the X-pipe in large scale, and kind of got a reputation for it. I was very surprised to see that it landed dead last on the dyno test. I think the main factor in this, is that the Dr. Gas comes in pieces that can be adjusted to fit different exhaust systems. Making all the parts adjustable causes the X to fall in a less optimal location. I was absolutely amazed how far out ahead the ProChamber came. It staggered me. But there is no denying it, when you test it on the same car on the same day. The dyno doesn't lie.

Kurt

The dyno cant lie...but its operators and magazine authors can


I never trust magazines....you never know who's in their back pocket or who they have a bone to pick with or something.


This is the first time i have heard the Dr. Gas "x" being in the wrong position....i always thought their design put it in the most desirable position.



And like i said before, George Klass told me a few years back that after his testing and comparisons, just run a H-pipe(outside of the prochamber).


I say pick which sound you want....and find the best priced pipe in that category. People do say the Dr. Gas X sounds great. What i dont get though is how the bbk x-pipe is considered an x....its like a hybrid x-pipe/h-pipe. The flow runs into the pipe....there's nothing smooth about it.

Dr. Gas

VRS x pipe

 

[Venom351R]

The dyno cant lie...but its operators and magazine authors can


I never trust magazines....you never know who's in their back pocket or who they have a bone to pick with or something.

I seriously doubt that's the case. The guys who do the testing and writing for 5.0mag seem really reputable. The entire 5.0 staff and the dyno shop would all have to be in on it and I doubt anyone is willing to risk their reputation over which X pipe gives more HP

 

[revhead347]

The dyno cant lie...but its operators and magazine authors can


I never trust magazines....you never know who's in their back pocket or who they have a bone to pick with or something.


This is the first time i have heard the Dr. Gas "x" being in the wrong position....i always thought their design put it in the most desirable position.



And like i said before, George Klass told me a few years back that after his testing and comparisons, just run a H-pipe(outside of the prochamber).


I say pick which sound you want....and find the best priced pipe in that category. People do say the Dr. Gas X sounds great. What i dont get though is how the bbk x-pipe is considered an x....its like a hybrid x-pipe/h-pipe. The flow runs into the pipe....there's nothing smooth about it.

Honestly, how else are you going to compare exhaust systems? Reliable or not, these magazine tests are the only place you are going to get that kind of information. No one goes out and buys 11 different exhaust systems, and tests them on the dyno just to determine which one is going to go on their car. No private performance place can afford to do that kind of test just to show their customers what works the best.

I bought a ProChamber before I read this dyno test. I bought it because certain people said it was the best. The unfortunate downside was that the ProChamber had to be bent to fit on with BBK headers. So if I had to do it again, I'm not sure it's worth the effort. I'm working on a whole new exhaust system for a customer of mine. I told him to just buy the BBK headers, with the BBK x-pipe. Not because I thought it would yield the most hp, but simply because I don't have a tube bender in my shop, and I know this will fit first time. By the way, regardless of how the BBK X-pipe looks, it did outperform the Dr. Gas in the dyno test, although I don't remember the exact HP numbers. I think the Dr. Gas sounds the best, because it is made with thicker tubes, which resonate the sound better. You all know my principle on exhaust though. If it doesn't sound as good as you want it to, it's because you haven't put enough engine in front of it.

Kurt

 

[Black95GTS]

My only $.02 is if you are going to buy the Pro Chamber, go listen to a lot of clips with it and make sure you like it. I think it sounds like crap, although lots of others don't. This is a purely subjective opinion so don't bother flaming me. Its got a different sound to it, you can't deny that.

My BBK off road X pipe looked nothing like what Nate's picture shows. If anythihg it looked more like the VRS pipe.

Adam

 

[nmcgrawj]

Honestly, how else are you going to compare exhaust systems? Reliable or not, these magazine tests are the only place you are going to get that kind of information. No one goes out and buys 11 different exhaust systems, and tests them on the dyno just to determine which one is going to go on their car. No private performance place can afford to do that kind of test just to show their customers what works the best.

I bought a ProChamber before I read this dyno test. I bought it because certain people said it was the best. The unfortunate downside was that the ProChamber had to be bent to fit on with BBK headers. So if I had to do it again, I'm not sure it's worth the effort. I'm working on a whole new exhaust system for a customer of mine. I told him to just buy the BBK headers, with the BBK x-pipe. Not because I thought it would yield the most hp, but simply because I don't have a tube bender in my shop, and I know this will fit first time. By the way, regardless of how the BBK X-pipe looks, it did outperform the Dr. Gas in the dyno test, although I don't remember the exact HP numbers. I think the Dr. Gas sounds the best, because it is made with thicker tubes, which resonate the sound better. You all know my principle on exhaust though. If it doesn't sound as good as you want it to, it's because you haven't put enough engine in front of it.

Kurt

At the end of the day the magazines have to make money. Im sure if 5.0 magazines can do the test, a place like Livernois Motorsports can too. Anyway, thats getting off track.

Im not the first one to not take magazines as gospel when it comes to results or what is best. My whole point is yes, 256 is > 255, but it doesnt matter. Like for instance, find me a car that goes faster from swapping out flowmasters (on a n/a platform) or find me a car that goes faster with an x over an h. Are we dyno racing down to the decimal point? If thats the case today u might win, and tomorrow i might win. Each pipe has different design changes that affect the sound...so choose based off the sound you want!



And if you would have researched a little bit more you would know that bbk headers are different from mac headers and you can not interchange the midpipes. Sorry you had to learn this the hard way, but there have been quite a few posts about this in the past. You can not knock the prochamber for this fact. The 2 header designs are different, so each company made their product fit their own. Its just like someone having mac headers and getting a bbk piece....ofcourse its not gonna match.


Thats why VRS has options for mac headers and bbk headers.

My only $.02 is if you are going to buy the Pro Chamber, go listen to a lot of clips with it and make sure you like it. I think it sounds like crap, although lots of others don't. This is a purely subjective opinion so don't bother flaming me. Its got a different sound to it, you can't deny that.

My BBK off road X pipe looked nothing like what Nate's picture shows. If anythihg it looked more like the VRS pipe.

Adam

It seems like people either love or hate the prochamber.

Thats what i've always known the bbk x to be....hmmmm...obviously they have more designs floating around, this is where i got the pic from:

Mustang Off-Road X-Pipes at LRS - Same Day Shipping!





anywho, good luck choosing!

 

[revhead347]

Are we dyno racing down to the decimal point? If thats the case today u might win, and tomorrow i might win. Each pipe has different design changes that affect the sound...so choose based off the sound you want!



And if you would have researched a little bit more you would know that bbk headers are different from mac headers and you can not interchange the midpipes. Sorry you had to learn this the hard way, but there have been quite a few posts about this in the past. You can not knock the prochamber for this fact. The 2 header designs are different, so each company made their product fit their own. Its just like someone having mac headers and getting a bbk piece....ofcourse its not gonna match.



anywho, good luck choosing!

Actually, back then they had just released the ProChamber for SNs, and Mac said it would fit. There really isn't much research to do when you are one of the first ones buying one. One twist in a tube bender, and it worked just fine. And 8hp is a little bit more a decimal point. That's 8 whole integers. I'd say that's worth a trip to the exhaust shop.

If places like Livernois go out a daily basis and dyno test 9 different intermediaries in a row, show me the data. I've never heard of a local shop doing a dyno test of that scale.

And if you pick your exhaust based on sound that's cool, but not everybody thinks that way. There are still some of us who are interested in seeing how fast it will go instead of showing off in front of the Honda's at the Sonic.

Kurt

 

[wytstang]

Here was a H vs X done by Michael Plummer a while ago
X-pipe vs H- pipe dyno results - Corral Forums

 

[nmcgrawj]

Actually, back then they had just released the ProChamber for SNs, and Mac said it would fit. There really isn't much research to do when you are one of the first ones buying one. One twist in a tube bender, and it worked just fine. And 8hp is a little bit more a decimal point. That's 8 whole integers. I'd say that's worth a trip to the exhaust shop.

If places like Livernois go out a daily basis and dyno test 9 different intermediaries in a row, show me the data. I've never heard of a local shop doing a dyno test of that scale.

And if you pick your exhaust based on sound that's cool, but not everybody thinks that way. There are still some of us who are interested in seeing how fast it will go instead of showing off in front of the Honda's at the Sonic.

Kurt

hahahahaha View attachment 249471

The sound is for me genius. I buy parts to enjoy my car. lol Instead of being an ass, why dont you come with something besides magazine data to prove what you're saying. Please prove me wrong.

Now i told you that George Klass from accufab said to just run an H pipe. Didnt i? He did testing and he found no data to support the other crap making more HP. And....he only sells headers. He doesnt advertise for companies like your good ol' magazines

So how's that bassani x-pipe looking now? I thought it was #1?

Here was a H vs X done by Michael Plummer a while ago
X-pipe vs H- pipe dyno results - Corral Forums

Thanks, you beat me to it

Hi there,
Finally got a chance to test my old MAC 2 1/2" H-pipe against the Bassani 2 1/2" X-pipe on my 94 GT.

Using my recent new baseline of 507.8rwhp with the H-pipe on 09/03/03, it was time to test the Bassani piece.

rpms....... H-pipe....... X-pipe
2500....... 147.3....... 138.1
3500....... 275.8...... 260.2

4000....... 355.4....... 333.7
4500....... 423.0....... 407.7
5500....... 499.1....... 490.2
6100....... 507.8....... 503.5

Final RWTQ numbers for the H-pipe was 491.5 and for the X-pipe it was 484.5. All numbers are SAE corrected.

On my car with my setup: GT-40 intake, F-303 cam and Edelbrock 6037's and a D1 @15psi. I feel the X-pipe is not an ideal piece for my combination so my old trusty and rusty H-pipe will be going back on.

BTW, I tested the Extender vs the stk. 94 computer after the Bassani X-pipe test and the Extender made 522.6rwhp with the X-pipe. I'll be switching back to the H-pipe and my next test will be an Edelbrock Preformer intake (old version ) vs my GT-40 intake.

Parts were donated by the companies themselves but thanks go out to a few special people in the business which asked to remain nameless.

You still trust those magazines? Dont believe everything you read from those guys.....you never know who's in who's back pocket. This proves it.

 

[revhead347]

That's only two exhausts on a much faster car. But hey, I'll give credit for bringing actually dyno information. That's how you make a proper argument. Not talking in circles without facts.

Kurt

 

[wytstang]

For the record MP test was done on a blown application. I don't know if the results would be the same on a N/A application. Also note that the dyno test was not done back to back but on days with similar conditions.

 

[Dan95-5.0]

I run a catless Mac X-pipe.

i felt a loss on the bottom end but gained up top. this is probably because i had a 2 1/4 catless h-pipe and upgraded to 2 1/2 with the X

 

[99FiveOh]

Old thread but I'll agree with Nate on the fact that Mustang rags are full of stinky brown stuff.

I made the mistake and recommended a typhoon intake for a buddy of mine, and I installed it for him on his S/C'd 01 GT. We get to the dyno (a huge Mid FL shop, you figure it out) and the tech saw the Typhoon and told me the stock piece was much better. I said, "well it made more power in XX Magazine!" Then he went on to explain things just like Nate did above.

As a matter of fact, this Florida shop I'm talking about does dyno comparisons for one of the magazines all the time. And he says more times than not, he'll look in the magazine and see that all the test results are BS! Not even close to what the real numbers were. He says it's bad for business because his customers will bring their cars in with parts that HIS shop tested to be the best, only to find out it's junk!! After hearing that, every single magazine's credibility went out the window for me. While I enjoy reading about new products and build stories (except for the many many carb'd Fox big n little wearing coupes) from now on I'll call a dyno shop to ask about any new products of interest.

 

[88stang88]

funny this thread is going...im waiting for ups to deliver my pypes o/r x today,idc really imo x sounds nice and its a big step up from stock with 4 cat's so i should be happy reguardless!! next step is intakes