Cold Air Induction/Intake

[mustangrob350]

Has anyone heard of the Granatelli Cold Air Induction? They say that you can install in 2005-2007 Mustang GT's without re-flashing your computer and adds up to 25 HP to RW. Also adding a 62mm throttle-body adds an additional 11 HP. How does this compare to the C&L Cold Air Intake system and this system as I understand it needs a computer re-flash using the Diablo Predator Tuner. Any thoughts on this?

Thanks

 

[kooldawg6]

Several people on here have the GMS intake and throttle body setup. It is correct that it does not need a reflash due to the intake tube being the same physical size as the stock tube. That lets the computer read the same amount of incoming airflow. The C&L has a larger than stock intake tube which requires the computer to read more airflow. That can be done with just about any tuner, not JUST the Diablo.

 

[red05bullitgt]

Several people on here have the GMS intake and throttle body setup. It is correct that it does not need a reflash due to the intake tube being the same physical size as the stock tube. That lets the computer read the same amount of incoming airflow. The C&L has a larger than stock intake tube which requires the computer to read more airflow. That can be done with just about any tuner, not JUST the Diablo.

Kooldawg, I really hate to disagree but what you posted concerning the GMS intake is completely inaccurate..First off, the GMS intake tube is not the same physical size as the stock tube as a matter of fact, it's actually the same physical size as the C&L street intake tube and the reason why the GMS does not require a re-flash ? is because the kit includes a recalibrated MAF sensor and jumper harness that plugs directly into the stock wiring harness which are both calibrated for the larger intake tube and also re-adjusts the MAF signal going to the PCM that sort of fools it into thinking that it continues to read the stock voltage setting which in turn prevents the PCM from triggering a check engine light and from going into fail safe mode...However if you don't wish to take my word for it ? You can always contact Doug from www.bamachips.com who will be more than happy to confirm every word I've posted being that he personally did a side by side test comparison between the GMS and C&L street CAI this past September

 

[gashog]

You can always contact Doug from www.bamachips.com who will be more than happy to confirm every single word I've posted being that he personally did a side by side test comparison between the GMS and C&L street CAI this past September

What's the verdict? I searched bamachips site for the comparo but found nothing. Link?

 

[lightblade]

Demolet beat out all the cai's. and they have the best prices
http://www.demolet.com/

 

[red05bullitgt]

What's the verdict? I searched bamachips site for the comparo but found nothing. Link?

What's the verdict ? I clearly stated if there were any questions, that he could be contacted meaning directly as in e-mail or by telephone...I didn't post anything about the comparo being found on the website..Therefore you'll need to go the website and locate his phone number or contact him through e-mail...He's not permitted to publicly disclose the test results for legal concerns...

 

[gashog]

soooooooooooooooooooo-rrry!

 

[red05bullitgt]

No problem, if you want I can PM you his phone number

 

[ALLOY2007GT]

soooooooooooooooooooo-rrry!

+1




Anwer me this Red05bullitgt,

Which one would you buy? this doesnt expose the #/results, but merely tells us your preference.

 

[gashog]

After talking to Doug at Bamachips, he sent me some info about the 2 intakes.

Basically, the GMS according to Bamachips, runs a bit lean at WOT. He said that this is not healthy for the motor. He does not recommend it.

 

[ALLOY2007GT]

You better hide from the "CIA" they might come fter you for exposing such classified information.

 

[gashog]

You better hide from the "CIA" they might come fter you for exposing such classified information.

I did some calling around, I called Granatelli and told them about my concerns with the air/fuel ratios. The tech there said there was nothing to worry about and that it wouldn't have any long term effects on the motor. This is also confirmed on Bamachips website:

http://www.bamachips.com/store/inde..._id=12&zenid=e396e1495ab14c52adbb6ffa611961c5

Dyno testing the 2005 GT has shown that the computer is so sensitive to airflow changes that a computer modification is necessary in order to control the air/fuel ratio at the proper level. Installing this air intake assembly on a 2005 GT without any tuning will result in a leaner-than-ideal 14:1 air/fuel ratio. While certainly not lean enough to cause engine durability concerns, it is leaner than what is desired for optimum performance.

I also called C&L and asked one of their techs about the 'no tune' option for there street intake.

http://www.cnlperformance.com/notune.html

We tried numerous mass airflow designs, including some that maintained the SAME diameter as the stock (80mm) mass airflow body that is integrated into factory airbox assembly, only to find that the air/fuel ratio was not acceptable. Even when testing an assembly that maintained the EXACT SAME dimensions (both in diameter and sensor depth), we found that the air/fuel ratio would end up in the 14:1 range. This condition will continue to go leaner as you increase the MAF housing diameter. An air/fuel ratio in this range, although not "dangerous", will produce LESS power than an intake assembly that maintains an air/fuel ratio in the 12.9-13.3:1 range, EVEN IF it flows less air (to a certain extent). Once your air/fuel ratio goes numerically higher than 13.4:1 in the upper RPMs at wide open throttle, you will see a drop in horsepower.

He said the order was sent out earlier this week for their first major production run and to expect the option to ship with new intakes within in the next couple of weeks. If you look at their dyno results the air/fuel ratio is 13.06 vs the stock 11.80 at WOT.

After doing my own research i'll be going with the C&L, this way when I do end up with the tuner i'll just un-sleeve the intake and tune it up.

 

[ALLOY2007GT]

I did some calling around, I called Granatelli and told them about my concerns with the air/fuel ratios. The tech there said there was nothing to worry about and that it wouldn't have any long term effects on the motor. This is also confirmed on Bamachips website:

http://www.bamachips.com/store/inde..._id=12&zenid=e396e1495ab14c52adbb6ffa611961c5



I also called C&L and asked one of their techs about the 'no tune' option for there street intake.

http://www.cnlperformance.com/notune.html



He said the order was sent out earlier this week for their first major production run and to expect the option to ship with new intakes within in the next couple of weeks. If you look at their dyno results the air/fuel ratio is 13.06 vs the stock 11.80 at WOT.

After doing my own research i'll be going with the C&L, this way when I do end up with the tuner i'll just un-sleeve the intake and tune it up.

stock AF is 11.8? thats a touch rich, isnt it?

 

[kooldawg6]

Thanks for the clarification on the GMS red05 I'm no expert, so I don't mind being corrected.

 

[red05bullitgt]

+1




Anwer me this Red05bullitgt,

Which one would you buy? this doesnt expose the #/results, but merely tells us your preference.

If you want my personal opinion ? I would chose the Choose the C&L intake hands down over the GMS for several reasons, first I don't like the idea of some jumper harness trying to fool the PCM into thinking it's reading the same amount of airflow as stock when it really isn't so for that reason, I don't trust it..Second, without a re-flash ? your only gaining half the performance gains from just the CAI alone instead of enjoying the full benefits of both the CAI and tuner re-flash and most of all ? should you decide that you want to add future mods such as FRPP delete plates, improved throttle response or long tube headers ? your going to have to purchase a custom programmer anyhow so you just might as well do it right the first time instead of throwing money down the drain for a jumper harness and re-calibrated MAF that your no longer going to be able to use...As for the # results ? it's not that I don't want to disclose it.. the problem is I cannot because a certain individual took legal action against Doug preventing him from disclosing any technical details concerning his comparison publicly which was why I stated to contact him personally...Anyway, hope this provides some answers to some of your questions..

 

[red05bullitgt]

Thanks for the clarification on the GMS red05 I'm no expert, so I don't mind being corrected.

I'm no expert either Kooldawg, however after a year or so of research that was debated on another forum concerning the GMS I learned pretty much everything about that CAI from most of the other forum members as well as from Doug himself..However shortly after his comparison results were posted ? he was legally forced to remove them from the forum in which I have no clue as to why and that's all I can really say about it..And it's not that I was out to correct you ? it's just that I'd really hate to see someone purchase that product and not know what their really getting only to end up disappointed and to be perfectly honest with you, if It wasn't for those forum members who shared their technical knowledge with me ? I would have ended up purchasing it and would have made a very huge mistake and am very thankful that I didn't...

 

[red05bullitgt]

You better hide from the "CIA" they might come fter you for exposing such classified information.

First off wiseass, I provided all the technical information concerning the GMS product..However if that isn't acceptable enough for you ? I clearly stated that anyone that doesn't wish to take my word for it, can also contact Doug personally by telephone or by e-mail at [email protected] Therefore if I had anything to hide, why in the hell would I bother wasting my time providing his contact info in the first place ? and second, you've got a lot of damn nerve to come into this forum and accuse me of hiding anything newbie being that you don't know me from a hole in the wall let alone question my technical knowledge about a product in which I did extensive research on for over a year on another forum oh and btw being that you think this is some kind of joke..check your e-mail as well..

 

[gashog]

stock AF is 11.8? thats a touch rich, isnt it?

Well, there's 3 dynographs on the c&l page

http://www.cnlperformance.com/notune.html

If you look at the stock air/fuel they all hover around 12:1, so i'd say that's normal for stock. The granatelli graphs do not show the air/fuel ratio? Maybe they've got something to hide?

mustangrob350: just wait a couple of weeks, like me. Wait until C&L ships their new intakes with the no tune option. For practically the same price you'll have the option of adding a tuner later with no consequences and additional cost.

 

[ALLOY2007GT]

First off wiseass, I provided all the technical information concerning the GMS product..However if that isn't acceptable enough for you ? I clearly stated that anyone that doesn't wish to take my word for it, can also contact Doug personally by telephone or by e-mail at [email protected] Therefore if I had anything to hide, why in the hell would I bother wasting my time providing his contact info in the first place ? and second, you've got a lot of damn nerve to come into this forum and accuse me of hiding anything newbie being that you don't know me from a hole in the wall let alone question my technical knowledge about a product in which I did extensive research on for over a year on another forum oh and btw being that you think this is some kind of joke..check your e-mail as well..

I was just teasin, geez. Don't take it so personal. I realize there was legal action taken and you dont want anyon to get in trouble. neither do i want that for anyone, especially doug who has done great things for the mustang community. The e-mail was very informative, thank you.

from the e-mail:

Being that you think this is some kind of a joke, here's proof that I
wasn't bull****ting ...However if you post this any of this info.
publicly ? I'll completely deny that you got it from me...Comparison of the
GMS and C&L CAI's with detailed info...
Ok, the info you've been wanting but are too afraid to ask, hahaaa.

so i wont post the info because it will upset people and cause problems.

From what Red05bullitGT sent me, the C&L street intake is definitley a better performing product than the Granitelli unit.




Red, lighten up. we are just some enthusiasts looking for better performance from our cars. there isnt any reason to ge defensive or offensive. We just have questions and want to make the best of two choices when it comes to modification. Your info was very helpful and we all appreciate that, but dont get upset when someone cracks a joke. I meant no disrespect and i apologize. truce?

 

[red05bullitgt]

I was just teasin, geez. Don't take it so personal. I realize there was legal action taken and you dont want anyon to get in trouble. neither do i want that for anyone, especially doug who has done great things for the mustang community. The e-mail was very informative, thank you.

from the e-mail:



so i wont post the info because it will upset people and cause problems.

From what Red05bullitGT sent me, the C&L street intake is definitley a better performing product than the Granitelli unit.




Red, lighten up. we are just some enthusiasts looking for better performance from our cars. there isnt any reason to ge defensive or offensive. We just have questions and want to make the best of two choices when it comes to modification. Your info was very helpful and we all appreciate that, but dont get upset when someone cracks a joke. I meant no disrespect and i apologize. truce?

Alloy, it's really sort of difficult to know sometimes whether or not someone's cracking a joke especially when all you have to rely on is text and because of the circumstances involved concerning Doug and am pleased that you also don't want to see him get into any trouble and just wanted to be certain of that..My main purpose is to help out as many Mustang enthusiasts as I can and I really have nothing personal against the GMS product nor would I ever claim that it doesn't work as advertised.. However as for the serious enthusiast who's looking to add more than just a CAI alone ? the GMS intake is very limited because you cannot use a custom programmer with the included jumper harness and MAF sensor replacement due to the fact that all custom tune files are based upon the stock MAF calibration and sensor...Therefore if you plan on using a custom programmer you'll have to un-install the replacement MAF sensor then remove the jumper harness and re-install the factory MAF sensor before using the GMS unit...Anyway I apologize for taking everything in the wrong way but try to realize that I was very concerned about Doug so if GMS wishes to take legal action towards me for sharing my info ? their going to have to prove who I obtained it from..