2004 GT - is the PCV valve ELECTRIC HEATED???

[Sinister SN95]

So, I went to Ford a couple of weeks ago to get a PCV valve to try and fix the check engine light. I'm at 20K miles, so i figured it was due anyways. Ford looked up my VIN number and told me I had a REGULAR PCV valve, not the electric heated one.

Well, last night i finally got a chance to go put it in... Get in there, and this is what I find.

#1 - There is a plug going into this one, which obviously leads me to believe it HAS to be the electric heated one.

#2 - The opening on the hole leading into the valve cover is about double the size of this regular one that I bought.


My question, is THIS really an Electric Heated PCV valve? I looked it up online everywhere, and the only thing close i could find is that 2004 Mach1's have an Electric heated pcv.

And how do i get this sucker out? Usually the pcv valves just pull right out, but this one has some kind of clips on it i think, but it doesnt come out at all..?


(Background info, P2197 code came up... its either a bad o2 sensor, a vacuum leak, or an exhaust leak)



Thanks for ANY help guys! This has been pissing me off so bad recently, i've never had problems with changing a PCV valve on any of my cars till now.

 

[Matt's 03 GT]

It should come off with a 1/4 turn. I had the same problem... My wife lost faith in my ability to properly fix the car when she walked out on me staring at that valve for about 1/2 hour

Pm Randy Stitchcolmb (Sp?) and he can get you the part number for both the heated valve (like $44.00) and the nonheated replacement (like $9.00).

By the way, This valve should have nothing to do with the codes and problems that you are having.

 

[Sinister SN95]

Thanks for the reply Matt... Yea, i stared at it for a good 1/2 hour as well hahahaha

So was yours a regular PCV or the kind like mine??



I dont think this will solve the whole problem, but i'm hoping that doing this may fix it and it was just a vacuum leak from the PCV being soaked with oil

 

[sgarlic]

My 2004 has the heated vers.. I believe all do.

 

[Matt's 03 GT]

Mine was like yours. I have the part number to update it to a non-heated valve. I just refuse to pay $40.00 for a pcv.

I don't think this will cause the problem that you have. You should get the codes that caused the CEL and we should be able to pin point the problem. I don't think a PCV can cause a CEL directly.

Get the codes and post them.

 

[Sinister SN95]

sgarlic
My 2004 has the heated vers.. I believe all do.

Excellent!

Mine was like yours. I have the part number to update it to a non-heated valve. I just refuse to pay $40.00 for a pcv.

I don't think this will cause the problem that you have. You should get the codes that caused the CEL and we should be able to pin point the problem. I don't think a PCV can cause a CEL directly.

Get the codes and post them.

You can change the car to a non heated PCV!?!?!?! Can you tell me how you did this??

I'm not looking forward to the 40.00 bill myself haha

The only code its throwing is P2197... my SCT tuner doesnt tell me anything but that.

Apparently from searching online for a while here, it says its one of my o2 sensors stuck, could be a vacuum leak, or an exhaust leak...

I decided to start with the vacuum leak idea, if that works ill be happy, if not, guess ill have to buy some new o2 sensors and try that while checking for leaks... other than that i have no clue why this light keeps coming on and why my car idles ugly.

 

[Matt's 03 GT]

Idle issues are often due to the IAC. I don't know what that code means but hopefully someone can chime in.

Changing the PCV is as easy as buying the correct part number and swapping it. Just tie up the wire and it's over. I have the part number at home... and you may be able to search for a thread on stangnet. Look for Randy's posts as he gives this part number all of the time.

Good luck,

 

[LaserRed01GT]

My Alldata says this:

P2197 - Lack of switching, sensor indicates lean, Bank 2

The time between HO2S switches is monitored after vehicle startup and during closed loop fuel conditions. Excessive time between switches or no switches since startup indicate a malfunction. Since “lack of switching” malfunctions can be caused by HO2S sensor malfunctions or by shifts in the fuel system, DTCs are stored that provide additional information for the “lack of switching” malfunction. Different DTCs indicate whether the sensor was always indicates lean/disconnected (P1131 or P2195, P1151 or P2197), or always indicates rich (P1132 or P2196, P1152 or P2198).

In the event that the vehicle does not stall if the line between the intake manifold and PCV valve is inadvertently disconnected, the vehicle will have a large vacuum leak that will cause the vehicle to run lean at idle. This will illuminate the MIL after two consecutive driving cycles and will store one or more of the following codes: Lack of O2 sensor switches, Bank1 (P1131 or P2195), Lack of O2 sensor switches Bank 2 (P1151 or P2197), Fuel System Lean, Bank1 (P0171),, Fuel System Lean, Bank 2 (P0174).

It sounds to me like an extended lean condtion at idle on bank 2.

 

['01 Steed]

...

I'm not looking forward to the 40.00 bill myself haha

Just imagine how the 3V guys feel. Their PCV valve isn't serviceable seperately. You'd have to buy the whole cam cover!!!

 

[LaserRed01GT]

Motorcraft parts are not exclusive to stealerships. (not a typo)

The elbow and heated valve assembly are Motorcraft# EV261

Rock Auto has them for $25.79.

 

[Sinister SN95]

My Alldata says this:

P2197 - Lack of switching, sensor indicates lean, Bank 2

The time between HO2S switches is monitored after vehicle startup and during closed loop fuel conditions. Excessive time between switches or no switches since startup indicate a malfunction. Since “lack of switching” malfunctions can be caused by HO2S sensor malfunctions or by shifts in the fuel system, DTCs are stored that provide additional information for the “lack of switching” malfunction. Different DTCs indicate whether the sensor was always indicates lean/disconnected (P1131 or P2195, P1151 or P2197), or always indicates rich (P1132 or P2196, P1152 or P2198).

In the event that the vehicle does not stall if the line between the intake manifold and PCV valve is inadvertently disconnected, the vehicle will have a large vacuum leak that will cause the vehicle to run lean at idle. This will illuminate the MIL after two consecutive driving cycles and will store one or more of the following codes: Lack of O2 sensor switches, Bank1 (P1131 or P2195), Lack of O2 sensor switches Bank 2 (P1151 or P2197), Fuel System Lean, Bank1 (P0171),, Fuel System Lean, Bank 2 (P0174).

It sounds to me like an extended lean condtion at idle on bank 2.

Whoa, excellent thanks for that info...

So is bank 2 my Passenger side FRONT o2 sensor???


Is this as simple as swapping out a new o2 sensor or is there something else involved... i notice it mentions the PCV as well, i guess its good i'm changing that...

 

[LaserRed01GT]

Bank 1 is always synonymous with cylinder 1. So your Bank 2 Sensor 1 would be the front driver's side O2 sensor.

Sometimes when a PCV valve sticks shut it can create a vacuum leak around the valve/elbow, or it can just exacerbate an already pre-existing vacuum leak somewhere else. It can even set that code if the PCV valve sticks open.

Do you have a scanner or a way to datalog short term fuel trims?

If you do:

To check for a possible vacuum leak, use your scan tool to look at long-term fuel trim (LONGFT) and short-term fuel trim (SHRTFT). With the engine warm and idling, add the long-term and short-term fuel trim numbers together. If the total correction is greater than plus 20% at idle, it probably indicates a vacuum leak that is making the fuel mixture run lean. To confirm the leak, rev the engine to 2,500 rpm and hold. Again, note the LONGFT and SHRTFT numbers. Add the numbers together. If the total correction at 2,500 rpm drops 15% or more, it confirms a vacuum leak at idle.
To find the vacuum leak, try pinching off individual vacuum hoses one by one while watching the SHRTFT number on your scan tool. When the SHRTFT number drops, you’ve found the leak.

Thats the exact procedure according to my Motorcraft Service Manual. And it is exactly how I would go about it as well.

 

[BlueRuckus]

http://www.motorcraft.com/home.do

 

[Mike97gt]

Bank 1 is always synonymous with cylinder 1. So your Bank 2 Sensor 1 would be the front driver's side O2 sensor.

Sometimes when a PCV valve sticks shut it can create a vacuum leak around the valve/elbow, or it can just exacerbate an already pre-existing vacuum leak somewhere else. It can even set that code if the PCV valve sticks open.

Do you have a scanner or a way to datalog short term fuel trims?

If you do:

To check for a possible vacuum leak, use your scan tool to look at long-term fuel trim (LONGFT) and short-term fuel trim (SHRTFT). With the engine warm and idling, add the long-term and short-term fuel trim numbers together. If the total correction is greater than plus 20% at idle, it probably indicates a vacuum leak that is making the fuel mixture run lean. To confirm the leak, rev the engine to 2,500 rpm and hold. Again, note the LONGFT and SHRTFT numbers. Add the numbers together. If the total correction at 2,500 rpm drops 15% or more, it confirms a vacuum leak at idle.
To find the vacuum leak, try pinching off individual vacuum hoses one by one while watching the SHRTFT number on your scan tool. When the SHRTFT number drops, you’ve found the leak.

Thats the exact procedure according to my Motorcraft Service Manual. And it is exactly how I would go about it as well.

This post quoted above has the right way to test for a vacumm leak.

first thing you should check at idle is your longterm trims on bank 1 compared to bank 2. and then add the short terms in..

If they are close then you most likely have a vacumm leak. if they are not then it could be a 02 sensor or exhaust leak near the sensor issue.

most of the time when it's a vacumm leak you will set p0171 and or p0174 instead of the code you got so you really should watch live data and compare both banks.

 

[Sinister SN95]

Thanks for all the great replies all

Do you have a scanner or a way to datalog short term fuel trims?

I have an SCTxcal2 ... will that work? I just got the car tuned about 2 months ago and haven't played with it much yet...