347 Installed but won't start...please help!

Davin · Feb 9, 2006

thanks for clearing that up Hissin..

yeah, mine looks like that but its stock (original 135K) so the switch wire is just a little parrallel clip that slips on, not a bolt on...

this helps..when I get off work I will investigate and see if anything works. Thanks again..its killing me not to get to hear this thing run!

94GTLaserRC · Feb 9, 2006

You should still charge the battery to full before cranking, so you dont put a strain on the alternator....not just jump starting it.

Cant wait to see the results!!!

RC

Davin · Feb 10, 2006

WHAT GIVES?!

I took the starter out and cleaned it real good (contacts etc). Using jumper cables and another running vehicle's battery, I connected the negative terminal to the starter casing and the positive to the battery terminal on the starter solenoid. When I jump the "S" terminal to the power supply bolt with a screwdriver, the starter clicks on and works just fine..BUT ONLY OUTSIDE THE CAR!!! As soon as I put it back in..all I get is that solenoid single click. There is definitly power getting to the solenoid but the gear won't engage and spin once its mounted. I tried taking it off and putting it back on about 3 times. When I try to jump the power supply terminal on the solenoid (starter mounted in car) to the next terminal (that has the wire going to the starter) I sometimes get a little spark, but for the most part, nothing happends.

WHY WOULD IT WORK OUTSIDE THE CAR BUT NOT INSIDE? PLEASE STICK WITH ME ON THIS ONE, I KNOW IT MUST BE A FAIRLY SIMPLE THING I JUST HAVE NOT THOUGHT OF..

I have considered that perhaps the starter is not powerful enough to spin the engine, but with 9.3:1 compression, I wouldn't think that it would be that hard...though the starter is original to my knowledge.

final5-0 · Feb 10, 2006

Kinda sounds like something is not meshing up correct between the starter and fw.

With the starter out
try
turning the motor over by hand a bit to move the fw to a different position.

Grady

HISSIN50 · Feb 10, 2006

Another possibility is that the starter simple has pooped out. As Grady said, there could be a mesh or ring gear issues - he has a good idea of turning the motor over by hand to kinda rule a chipped tooth out.

I dont suppose you have a spare starter around? I am kinda thinking yours can handle a load anymore (on a bench there is no load). I think parts stores can bench test them under load.

One last, but perhaps the most pertinant thought. What is the imbalance/flywheel/ring gear situation? Are you sure you have the correct starter gear for your flywheel, if your flywheel is new on your stroker? If it isnt (starter teeth and ring gear teeth have to mathematically correspond), that can cause some issues.

I just woke up and am not making sense.
Good luck.

Davin · Feb 10, 2006

starter and flywheel are orignal equip. I think I will do the following:

1. Have starter tested at auto parts store.
2. If necessary buy new starter and give it a shot.

Question though, I should be okay with a stock starter right? I'd rather not have to pay extra for the hi torque version if I can avoid it.

HISSIN50 · Feb 10, 2006

Davin, I dont know how you are for time, but Chris (Cman) just got a nice new HT mini for like 60 bucks online. Sounded like a decent piece, and a good price to me.
I would opt for a HT unit for that motor myself. But it seems like enough guys do run stock geared starters on combos a bit like yours........

Good luck bud.

final5-0 · Feb 10, 2006

Davin said:
starter and flywheel are orignal equip. I think I will do the following:

1. Have starter tested at auto parts store.
2. If necessary buy new starter and give it a shot.

Question though, I should be okay with a stock starter right? I'd rather not have to pay extra for the hi torque version if I can avoid it.

If you have a 94-95 Stang ..................

Doesn't that mean you do indeed have the high torque starter

Grady

Davin · Feb 10, 2006

Okay, I don't know if the 94 starters are hi-torque starters, but I do know that it is the smaller one, like the FMS starters. I went ahead and bought a remanufactured unit from AutoZone during my 4 oclock lunch break. They tested the old one but I'm not sure that it was "load" tested. They hooked wires up to it but the gear didn't hook to anything. Nevertheless, the readout they gave me had voltage, power and torque ratings on it. According to the test, it passed but their readout said that it had Max Tourqe of 19 Nm (about 14 ft#s I think). That seem aweful low. I don't know what the stock rating is supposed to be but on the high torque starters I've seen ratings like 160 ft#'s so 14 ft# seems aweful low. I figure that after 12 year, the starters bound to go anyway so if I find out its not the starter, then oh well, one less thing to worry about. but if it is!!!!!!!! Can't wait till tomorrow morning to pop this sucker in!

VibrantRedGT · Feb 10, 2006

While my motor was out I installed the new Cardone Select high TQ starter on my 347. Since I work for the company it was a freebie. It has a lifetime warranty to boot. Hopefully the new solves this issue.

Davin · Feb 10, 2006

NICE TRY VIBE BUT NO DICE!

[

While my motor was out I installed the new Cardone Select high TQ starter on my 347

I don't know if that was an attempt to brag or rub it in or what, but I'm pretty sure you'll be quite jealous of me when you learn I purchase a full refurbished VALUCRAFT starter for $89! I know you think you got a good deal since yours was free, but I don't recall seeing any part of the word "VALUE" in the name of your starter (note: two out of three sylables of the name of my starter are from the latin root "valu" meaning VALUE!) so put that in your pipe and smoke it Vibe!!!

Oh man, I'm loosing it.....hope this works tomorrow (hope you can recognize a joke when you see it too )

VibrantRedGT · Feb 10, 2006

Dav, your stressed. I know your having sleepless nights because of this (I would after the money spent). I don't know what a Valucraft is but I hope it works out for you. When she's running it will be all worth it.

Pokageek · Feb 10, 2006

Good luck man. I am waiting to hear the diagnosis on my car by Tuesday and tired of not driving it! RRR!

Davin · Feb 10, 2006

Thanks everyone..I'll be gining another report in about 10 hours. Hopefully a good one. time for .

Davin · Feb 11, 2006

PROGRESS!!!

Okay, so I didn't really need a new starter. It didn't really suprise me that when I stuck the new one it that it did the same thing.."click". I knew it had to be the current so I once again grounded the starter mounting bolt to the neg batt and no go..I then traced the positive that goes to the starter to the inside fender where it mounts to a remote terminal in the engine bay and the cable pulled right out of its connector! So there it was. I connected it directly to the terminal and the starter engaged..I hooked up the coil wire and she started right up!!! BUT...

though everything started and ran okay, there was a lot of white smoke (it was about 50 degrees out) coming from the tail pipes and from the engine bay. I looked in the engine bay and I swear that the smoke seemed to be coming evenly from the OUTSIDE of the new headers..not at the gasket...
could this just be the new exhauts system burning something off, or maybe the assembly lube burning off the cylinder walls or is this definitly a water leak somewhere? There are no signs to leaks or drips BTW...For the moment I'm happy cause at least the project is moving forward!

mytight95 · Feb 11, 2006

yeah new stuff always smokes when exposed to high heat....... I have noticed that new gaskets smoke as well....... I would almost swear last time i put head gaskets on that they were gving off a little smoke.....lol

Make sure you remember to retorque your head bolts after it has completely cooled down...

jason

Davin · Feb 11, 2006

that's comforting..I should add that I have new cats and there is no coolant in the engine right now, just distilled water...

VibrantRedGT · Feb 11, 2006

Well if the water gets too hot it will make steam. You should really put coolant in there. Put the stat in and burp the system.

Davin · Feb 11, 2006

I though it was a good idea to start with water in case there was a leak? The smoke or stream was immediate. Unfortunatly it did not run long enough for me to see if it would "burn off". I went to set the timing and as soon as I disconnected the spout the engine stopped. Didn't start after that. I disconnected the battery and will try again in the morning (gots to work)

final5-0 · Feb 11, 2006

Davin said:
I though it was a good idea to start with water in case there was a leak? The smoke or stream was immediate. Unfortunatly it did not run long enough for me to see if it would "burn off". I went to set the timing and as soon as I disconnected the spout the engine stopped. Didn't start after that. I disconnected the battery and will try again in the morning (gots to work)

Over the years I've been in this hobby, I've heard peeps give this opinion a time or two about starting a new motor.

They point out that even though you've got everything tightened to correct torque specs, all the gaskets are new and the motor is still unfired. They say to use water only for the first two heat cycles. After the two heat cycles and all bolts are checked for the correct final torque specs, drain the water and refill with the water/antifreeze mix.

The thinking is the water/af mix is more apt to seep between the gaskets due to it being more slick. You got a chance of that happening while the motor is still unfired ... and while the new parts/gaskets are going through those two heat cycles.

I can say for a fact, I've built a motor or two and done quite a few h/c/i combos in my day. I've never found ALL the bolts to be at the correct torque specs after the two heat cycles. Some of them have always been too loose.

As for not using the water/af mix at first start up .......................

I did it that way when I built my current combo and had no probs.

however

You would not want to permanently run water only for at least two reasons I can think of

1) Water only is not as effective at cooling as a water/af mix
2) A/F provides protection to the Aluminum parts

Grady

347 Installed but won't start...please help!

Davin

94GTLaserRC

Squint as you approach, lest you be blinded by my

Davin

final5-0

Mustang Master

HISSIN50

"How long does it take to get help in here?

Davin

HISSIN50

"How long does it take to get help in here?

final5-0

Mustang Master

Davin

VibrantRedGT

"STANGNET'S PENGUIN SMACKER"

Davin

VibrantRedGT

"STANGNET'S PENGUIN SMACKER"

Pokageek

Active Member

Davin

Davin

mytight95

Active Member

Davin

VibrantRedGT

"STANGNET'S PENGUIN SMACKER"

Davin

final5-0

Mustang Master

Similar threads

347 Installed but won't start...please help!

Squint as you approach, lest you be blinded by my

Mustang Master

"How long does it take to get help in here?

"How long does it take to get help in here?

Mustang Master

"STANGNET'S PENGUIN SMACKER"

"STANGNET'S PENGUIN SMACKER"

Active Member

Active Member

"STANGNET'S PENGUIN SMACKER"

Mustang Master

Similar threads

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency