351 Engine swap Exhaust issue

Wicked65 · May 11, 2010

Tonight I went to drop my 351 into my 65. The engine went in fine, and the driverside header is REALLY tight, but tolerable. However, the passanger side, there is no effin way thats going to fit.. Pretty pissed right now. 351 with victor jr heads, Ron Morrison adjustable mounts and heddman swap hedders. What am i doing wrong here? Any help, suggestions, anything at this point..

restomoded66 · May 11, 2010

Hi! Are you using heddmen headers 88660? I had similar problem with mine but on the driver side. One side was over 1 inch closer to the trans than the other side and one side is about 1 inch lower. I don’t think they do any quality control. They must bent them, slap them on the flange and weld without a jig. The paint on it is only to protect them from rust during shipping, you need to remove that paint and repaint them with high heat paint.

To fix my problem I cut off the collector, heat bended the tube one by one and welded the collector back on. I gained over one inch.

Wicked65 · May 11, 2010

restomoded66 said:
Hi! Are you using heddmen headers 88660? I had similar problem with mine but on the driver side. One side was over 1 inch closer to the trans than the other side and one side is about 1 inch lower. I don’t think they do any quality control. They must bent them, slap them on the flange and weld without a jig. The paint on it is only to protect them from rust during shipping, you need to remove that paint and repaint them with high heat paint.

To fix my problem I cut off the collector, heat bended the tube one by one and welded the collector back on. I gained over one inch.

Collectors dont seem to be the problem. The problem is between the shock towers. I knew they would be tight, but it seems like there is no way that they will fit at all. So im not sure if the Ron morris mounts have moved the motor too high, or if the headers are not bent the right way. They are the 88660 Headers.

tim95gt · May 11, 2010

i think he means he just took the collector off to make it easier to heat and bend a single tube at a time
cuz with the collector on you would have to try and bend all 4 tubes at once to try and get additional clearance

Wicked65 · May 11, 2010

Im wondering if the engine mounts have pushed the motor up to high. Ganna check it out tonight.

mtaqua · May 11, 2010

let me know about the mounts. I am using them too, but accufab headers. I also shaved a little on the towers. Hopefully I'll get my motor soon to test fit.

dennis112 · May 11, 2010

mtaqua said:
let me know about the mounts. I am using them too, but accufab headers. I also shaved a little on the towers. Hopefully I'll get my motor soon to test fit.

351w with Accufab 1 3/4" tubes in a 65/66? There was no way in heck for me to get the driver's side mount installed without significant modifications to the mounts due to the way one of the exhaust tubes runs low. Mine were the fully adjustable drop mounts and they hit the tube, not the towers. Ended up selling them instead of trying to cob them up.

mtaqua · May 11, 2010

should have asked you 1st. I knew you used the 65 old style to get the motor lower, but I'll have no hood clearance issues (large scoop). So I opted for the Ron Morris so I could more the motor aft a bit. That sucks. I'll try it and see if it works on mine, but I doubt it. Thanks for the heads up, anyone want to buy/trade me? I might try to mod them, still awaiting the motor.

dennis112 · May 11, 2010

Yeah, I thought the Ron Morris MM's would get me away from using the early pedestal type mounts that I bend each summer at the track.

I know that Accufab changed their part # system since I bought mine 7-8 years ago, but don't know if they changed their product. If your driver's side #1 pipe sits as low as the one in the pic, you will probably have the same issues:

That tube even hits the 65' factory MM, which I modify and use a heat shield. IIRC, the passenger side would have only needed a small amount of work to make the Morris mount fit, but the driver's side needed tons of work. Still the passenger side has a similar low tube:

Old George recommends the 66' and up MM's for clearance issues. They are also stronger than the 65', but as you know I needed to get my motor as low as it would go for the Vic Jr.

Here is the fully adjustable Morris mounts that I tried:

One of the Stangnet members snagged them from me in the classifieds.

Wicked65 · May 11, 2010

Thanks for the input guys. Last night i was kicking myself for not doing the mustang II front end. Since i spent close to the same amount doing the coil over setup that i went with.. I knew i should have just bit the bullet..

Anyone want a kick ass coil over setup, full roller with all new parts?

mtaqua · May 11, 2010

knowing my luck, nothing has changed. I should have listened to George and got the 66 mounts. Oh well, nothing has been easy yet, why start now.

Wildbill3 · May 11, 2010

Doesnt the Mustang II have a bit of bump steer in the setup?
Were getting ready to install our 408 these threds are great for learning.

Wicked65 · May 11, 2010

LOL, at this point, the Mustang II front end could be the worst handling thing around, but the clearance would be a wonderful thing.. I was able to get the headers in, but now they are touching both sides.. SO.. torch and hammer are coming out. Going to move the headers slightly to where they need to be. kinda at a loss for the moment. From the info i have, it seems that between the aftermarket mounts and victor jr heads, the engine is just too high. Too late now, i need to get the car ready for pinks in a few months. ill do what it takes this year.

65coupe408w · May 12, 2010

I have a very similar setup to you. Same motor mounts, Victor Jr heads. I actually used the Hooker Super Comps with 1 3/4 primaries. They were a great fit! I only ran into issues becuase I decided to push my motor as far back as possible on the adjustable mounts. If you have any questions about the swap let me know Ill do my best to assist.

65coupe408w · May 12, 2010

I found a couple of pictures of the headers I used. Also...don't use Moroso pans! I learned the hard way, I ended up spending the extra and going with a Canton T-pan.

I had to "massage these ones a little"

Wicked65 · May 12, 2010

65coupe408w said:
I have a very similar setup to you. Same motor mounts, Victor Jr heads. I actually used the Hooker Super Comps with 1 3/4 primaries. They were a great fit! I only ran into issues becuase I decided to push my motor as far back as possible on the adjustable mounts. If you have any questions about the swap let me know Ill do my best to assist.

I looked at those headers, and will probably go to something like that due to the bigger primary. I too pushed the motor back, but for these headers and mounts, it was the only place it would really fit. Thanks a bunch for your input. Its sometimes hard to find someone that is even close to my setup, so i appreciate it.

Just curious, were you able to put the hooker headers in while attached to the motor? Or did you have to take them off?

65coupe408w · May 12, 2010

I installed the motor and then put the headers in from underneath. It was not very easy...it required moving the engine around quite a bit on the adjustable mounts to make room for them to initially get in the right spot.

Its nice to see more people putting the 351W in the early cars. I know its a lot of work, and requires some fabrication here and there, but it is totally worth it!

Wildbill3 · May 12, 2010

Hey 65coupe408w are those the RM motor mounts .I was wondering if I shouldnt just do the tower notch and save myself a bunch of headaches. 408's rock in these little cars I bet.Its going to be fun!:Track:

Wicked65 · May 12, 2010

He does have the RM mounts like me. The tower notch is more for the spark plugs then the exhaust. Ill tell you the tubes come out right at the bolts for the upper control arm. So the only way out of that is Mustang II swap or some other suspension that allows notching. But a 408 would be sweet.. This winter, if i can, im going to build a Dart based 408 with a YSI going to it.. And see just how fast this 65 can go.

mtaqua · May 12, 2010

you can notch for the header tubes too. Well at least I think I did. I looked at Dennis' pics and it looks like the headers almost touch at the front and rear of the towers (like the pics above); kind of where it "bubbles" out on the tower. I cut the bubble out and then made that area more flat. Before I did it you could fit a little more than a finger behind the UCA, now there is about 1/8" of clearance behind the UCA. Looking at it in the engine bay you really can't tell right now, but I think I'll have about 1/2-3/4" more on the outside of each header tube in that area, than had I not done it. Was it worth it, I don't know. When I get the motor I'll post pics and we can compare to see if it is different. I think I am screwed on the Ron Morris mounts.

351 Engine swap Exhaust issue

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