Im looking into a 408 stroker build and i got quite a handful of questions, i want to build it right the first time and i want it to last, i would love to get 500-600 horsepower from it, it would be a daily driver yet i would take it racing every weekend, gas mileage i dont care about, i just want it to dust everyone i race and sound killer when i drive around the town, i would like no more then 600 hp and id like it to be one torquey son of a gun to, can you guys give me some build advice? Also whats this ive been reading that 351w are non rollers or roller compatible? Hows it roller compatible if it needs all this extra fuuhoo?? And can you turn a non roller block into a roller block, would it be stronger?
Engine 351w 408 Stroker Build
- Thread starter Wonderbread750
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If you are sticking with a stock 351 block type build, look for one from the late 60's early 70's (68-73) as these have historically held up better in my experience. As far as the lifters are concerned you can use retrofit roller lifters. They are by no means inexpensive but do the trick nicely. They have tie bars that connect your intake and exhaust lifters together and can be used in a non roller block no problem. Now that we got that out of the way, are you opposed to a power adder? What type of induction are you using, fuel injection or carb? 600hp pushrod daily drivers just don't seem to ever work out. If you are looking to make 600 hp normally asperated you will be buying some radical parts. This will lend towards upgrading the trans, rear and entire suspension in the car. If you already have a sound chassis and trans/rear that's set up to go, this type of build will exceed 10,000$ very quickly. What are your et goals? What state is the car in currently? Last but not least, what is your budget?
If it takes me longer to build a tried and true motor its worth the extra cash, i wanna go fuel injection, im going to invest into a tko tranny, and as a power adder id like a true 600 hp motor, maybe down the road a supercharger, no nos though, its registered in ca, but im not worried about smog either its taken care of, and instead of pushrods what do i go with, whats a total beggining to end list of parts that will make sure the motor withstands everything and happily handles my full throttle driving
To get 600 hp out of a 408 on pump gas without a power adder is basically impossible. Low 500 range sure but that extra 75+hp is going to take more compression,a very radical cam(read not very streetable) and if fuel injected you'll need an aftermarket ecu/tuning ability. Instead of worrying about a hp "number" think about what 84ttop asked...what's your budget? How fast do you want to run (1/4 e.t.)? Bottom line -engine,trans,suspension/chassis,and a wheel/tire combo all needs to be planned together. Roughly to do it right and completely on a budget with a mix of new and used parts you are looking at a minimum of 10-15k and probably closer to 20,000$. If you use all new parts and need professional help it'll cost 25-30k at the least.(the entire project that is) an engine can be built for under 10k.
Now as far as what kind of parts you'll need in a beastly 408 I would recommend at least a 200cc alum head,a custom hyd roller cam,10:1cr,good set of rods/crank,1 3/4" long tube headers with 2 1/2-3" exhaust,aftermarket ignition and fuel injection(Holley makes some nice ecu's). To get to 600 you'd need at least 12:1cr/220+cc heads and probably a mechanical roller cam.
Now as far as what kind of parts you'll need in a beastly 408 I would recommend at least a 200cc alum head,a custom hyd roller cam,10:1cr,good set of rods/crank,1 3/4" long tube headers with 2 1/2-3" exhaust,aftermarket ignition and fuel injection(Holley makes some nice ecu's). To get to 600 you'd need at least 12:1cr/220+cc heads and probably a mechanical roller cam.
hello;
a 500 hp plus 408 will not be torquey.
big torque comes from big engines like a 460 etc..
you can build one with nitrous or a supercharger and get a bit more bottom end out of it this way and the nitrous or supercharger will take care of the higher rpm and hp.
well that might depend if i'm trying to put them behind me from a dead stop 40 mph or more.
without answers to the questions it is impossible to make suggestions that are best suited to what you want.
the engine itself will cost around the same whether you put nitrous on it or a supercharger or straight carb etc..
nitrous is around $2200.00 less than a supercharger and can be used when desired.
a supercharger is always working.
427 Dart kit. For the amount you will spend on everything and it being a DD, have you given any thought about a coyote swap? Idk the exact cost on the motor, tranny, & wire packs. I assume you will be in that price range by the time you're done building a pushrod to make 600RWHP DD.
I don't think that it would be unreasonable to see 450+ft/lb's of torque from a 408 stroker. That should be more than enough to provide a great seat of the pants feeling in a daily driven street car.
Sorry but i disagree with this . Judging by what the op is looking for a 408 will be plenty torquey for him. You dont need a big engine to make big torque.
Dead stop take off torque and horsepower to pull from a roll, why are their 351 blocks out there for 1000$ and then some for 2000-2500$? I know the $1000 is a non roller but, could you save money bu converting to a roller? And as engine internals im teetering between eagle and scat, scats lighter and holds up well enough even with their i beam rods but then eagle has a internally balanced crank, how does a crank like that work? If its internally balanced does it still need a harmonic balancer? I dont want to go with parts from both companys cause i read theres alot of unecessary work to make them work together... To the community reading what would you guys go with for internals on this build, any specific head, cam, piston, crank and rod etc?
Is a 10 sec 1/4 mi possible? I know how motors work but when how each part works and affects the other i dont completely understand, like the cam, thats really the only thing that doesnt make all much sense
yes if you have a lot of money. i just gave build specs to a guy that should get around 550 "real"hp in a 408 and that will be at around 6800 rpm.
you also need to get the hp to the ground which is a big prob. it will be a few grand in suspension and chassis upgrades.
i have done several of these so i know how they run. of course torquy" is a relative term and different people have different ideas of what that means but, in general a 550 - 600 hp 408 ci eng is in no way torquey since all the torque is high in the rpm range.
you are looking at an engine that won't hit "hard" until around 4000 rpm. well if people want to call that torquey i guess they can...
the bigger the cubes, the more tq it will have at lower rpm. its simply physics and basic 10th grade auto shop engine building knowledge.
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this is a photo of a cam that will make 550 hp or more in a 408 stroker with the proper parts. it is a 61013 hydraulic roller lunati custom ordered for the customers application. in billet steel.
http://oi59.tinypic.com/35b9z6b.jpg
it is running stock afr 205 heads, a victor jr intake and possibly a carb spacer and around 10.5 static compression if i remember right.
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this is a photo of a cam that will make 550 hp or more in a 408 stroker with the proper parts. it is a 61013 hydraulic roller lunati custom ordered for the customers application. in billet steel.
http://oi59.tinypic.com/35b9z6b.jpg
it is running stock afr 205 heads, a victor jr intake and possibly a carb spacer and around 10.5 static compression if i remember right.
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i would run je forged pistons.
i would use a 4 bolt block or a dart or ford racing block. i would not bore a stock block more than .030" for this application.
scat forged rods and crank
internal balance is nice but pricey
deck the block so the pistons are .005" - .003" below the deck.
cloyes 2 degree timing chain
3/8 rocker studs with stud girdles or 7/16 rocker studs.
windage tray
crank wipers
knife edge crank
port match intake to heads if necessary
high capacity milodon oil pan with baffles
msd 6al-2 ign box
msd antivibration coil.
performance distributor
or pertronix 3 in lieu of the msd box and distributor
ATI damper
have the cam degreed at installation
i would run je forged pistons.
i would use a 4 bolt block or a dart or ford racing block. i would not bore a stock block more than .030" for this application.
scat forged rods and crank
internal balance is nice but pricey
deck the block so the pistons are .005" - .003" below the deck.
cloyes 2 degree timing chain
3/8 rocker studs with stud girdles or 7/16 rocker studs.
windage tray
crank wipers
knife edge crank
port match intake to heads if necessary
high capacity milodon oil pan with baffles
msd 6al-2 ign box
msd antivibration coil.
performance distributor
or pertronix 3 in lieu of the msd box and distributor
ATI damper
have the cam degreed at installation
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A stock 351 block will hold 700hp easily with the factory 2 bolt mains. Any more than that and a 4 bolt aftermarket block should be considered. Forged crank, h beam rods and forged pistons are a must. I personally have had good luck with my Eagle crank, 1800+ HP at the crankshaft and no problems. I have used the eagle h beam rods in 1,000hp applications with no issues either. I beams will just not cut it in my eyes. With a good parts list you should be able to make ample HP to turn 10 second times at the track.
if you use a 2 bolt block i would use a main stud girdle.
ford used the 4 bolt main blocks on 300 hp engines for a reason. i prefer to be safe than sorry, especially when makingrecommendations to others. if its my own engine its my own problem.
scorpion "race" or "endurance" series roller rockers. the "endurance" ones are slightly lighter. these are very good and cheaper than most others.
3/8" chromoly push rods.
i would use morel lifters. yes they are pretty pricey but imo they are worth the money. you can still buy some models of cranes steel body anti pump lifters. they are cheaper than the morels.
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