Drivetrain 66 With 5.0 Engine

acinider

Member
Apr 17, 2002
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17
San Diego, CA
Hey everyone,

I have a '66 Mustang with a '93 5.0 Mustang 302, Lakewood scatter shield for a '66 Mustang, and a '65 toploader with stock z-bar mechanical clutch linkage.

I've searched the forums and I believe I have the correct combo of parts but I just wanted to see if this is what others are using. I've been running this setup for the last year but I had horrible clutch chatter due to oil seeping through the flywheel bolts (no thread sealer installed initially... *stupid, stupid, stupid!*). Due to the Lakewood, I was using a late-68 clutch fork (10.5" long) but I had serious fork-header interference with my Hooker Comps. I now believe getting the shorter '66 fork and notching the bell housing is the better solution.

I am specifically interested in which throw out bearing and clutch fork are correct for my setup.
Thanks!

Parts:
'93 roller pilot bearing
'93 mini starter
'93 King Cobra clutch kit (10.5 Flywheel (157 teeth, 50oz), 10 spline clutch disc, diaphragm pressure plate)

'65 toploader with small input shaft and 28 spline output
'66 bellhousing (Lakewood model 15200) (will check runout)
'66 clutch fork (9.25" length)
'66 throwout bearing specific to diaphragm pressure plates (National 614038)
'66 Mustang (non-hipo) mechanical clutch linkage
5.0 block to '66 z-bar adapter
 
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I am somewhat familiar with the adapter that you have for the z bar but never needed to use one. You might need to modify the Lakewood slightly for it to clear the block flange.

The 15200 is perfect for a toploader. Its the same depth as the stock bellhousing that was used in the 66'. Its larger in diameter but still fits in the tranny tunnel just fine. In most cases you may need to do some clearancing for the header tubes, particularly around the starter.

I don't think that you are limited to the TOB for the 93' which was designed for a cable clutch. I've always used the early standard SBF throw out bearing correct for the toploader when using a diaphragm clutch and z bar--lets say one for a 65-73 Mustang. Some have grease zerks. I've only used an 11" diameter clutch in the Lakewood but as long as your using the correct "inner" mounting holes for the starter I don't see any issues if you are using a 157 tooth flywheel. 11" stuff uses the outer pair of holes.

I also uses only the later "long" style forks with the standard 65/66 z bar setup with no issues (such as one from a 68'.) Not sure that the shorter fork will work with the 15200 as its made larger in diameter to handle an 11" clutch. You might not have enough fork length. In that respect a Quick Time bell would have a smaller diameter.

No matter what, make sure that your throw out bearing has some free travel after releasing from the fingers once everything is setup. 1/4" would be nice. To accomplish that I normally adjust the clutch so that it engages closer to the floor--as long as its shifting cleanly. Being close to the floor cuts down on stress to the diaphragm PP according to an clutch rebuilder that I got to know.

If only 1 header tube is interfering, you may consider having it rerouted. I added a dogleg to mine for clearance. I also removed some the length off the outer end of the fork (the pointy part.) but used the stock spring hole. A notch was ground at about the 12 o'clock position above the spring hole to act as a support for the spring.
 
Dennis,

Thanks for an awesome response!

The TOB I'm planning to use is a '66 part specified for diaphragm pressure plates (National 614038). I'm using a '93 5.0 mini-starter on the inner two bolt holes and it works perfectly. I have a late-68-70 Mustang clutch fork (C8OA-7515-A, 10.75" length) and I'd planned on replacing it with '66 (supposedly 9.25") but when I spoke with a few venders I discovered that it's dimensionally exactly the same as mine, except for the wire spring as opposed to the clasp. So I'm sticking with the '68 fork, making sure the z-bar to clutch fork rod is straight, and clearancing where needed.

I've also added an adjustable z-bar rod below so that I have adjustment up top and below in order to adjust my pedal and clear my headers.

Do I need to use the Lakewood diameter-reduction rings within the opening for the toploader? Did you check runout and have to buy any repositioning dowels? I picked up a magnetic based dial gage and plan to check my Lakewood; any tips?
 
I too prefer the later 68' style SBF fork instead of the 66' bale wire which can present issues. I too have upper and lower adjustment rods. Most of my adjustments are done at the upper one since it is the most convenient.

The 15200 doesn't need a reduction ring with a toploader. They should fit just fine without one UNLESS your toploader is an early 1964 one which, IIRC, has a different OD where it meets the bell. If your transmission housing's casting # begins with a C5 or C6 (or later) you will be fine. The potential problem child would begin with C4.

I do check round-out on my aftermarket bells and the Lakewoods are typically out of spec. I prefer to used the Lakewood positioning kit that uses studs and weld-on washers. Simply open up the 2 dowel holes of the bell a small amount so it can be moved within the recommended tolerance and then tack weld the included washers in place. What I like about this system is once you have your bell dialed in, if/when you remove the bell for clutch servicing it will not need to be redialed again.

You can also use the repositioning studs, but its not always as easy as turning the stud to dial in. There are some that can work that easily but they will cost more. You will still need to redial them during service. The weld-on ones are cheap and do a better job.

Be sure that the bell and the block mounting flange are free of any imperfections that might affect the reading. It doesn't take much to through the bell off. I typically remove the paint if its not even. Also be sure to use the included Lakewood block saver plate each time. If you use a common dial indicator, make sure that your dial indicator is as perpendicular to the register as possible. Any angling of the indicator away from the register can affect the reading so get as close as you can. I like to setup a larger mirror at the back of the motor so I can watch the rise and fall of the needle while the motor is being turned. Be sure to torque the 6 bell bolts each time before doing a check. 35lbs will be enough during the testing phase. Don't worry about the smaller bolts or the starter as they won't affect the dialing process. When needed I loosen the 6 bolts just enough so that the bell can be moved with light taps from a hard rubber hammer.

To keep track of which way you are going to need to tap the bell, draw the results on an piece of paper using clock coordinances that would match the bell. Add the actual #'s to the drawing and reason out which way it needs to go before giving it some love taps. Allow plenty of time to do the dial in as it is somewhat a hit and miss event. I've gotten them perfect the first time and I've also spent over an hour on them, especially if the washers interfere with the rounded part of the bell. IIRC, the spec is +/- .005" so try to get it closer to zero during the whole rotation (but it doesn't have to be perfect as long as it measures less than the max of +/- .005 in all directions.)
 
With the Lakewood 15200, can I use the later-68 Mustang clutch fork by simply replacing the clutch fork bracket in the bell housing?

Since I no longer have access to a welder, I'm going to use the offset dowels if the runout requires it; I found RobbMc Performance Products offers adjustable alignment dowels for about the same price as the Lakewood fixed dowels. http://www.robbmcperformance.com/products/dowels.html

Do you replace your flywheel/pressure plate bolts when redoing your clutch? I read Ford OEM flywheel bolts are torque-to-yield so they should be replaced each time?

Thanks!
Brent
 
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With the Lakewood 15200, can I use the later-68 Mustang clutch fork by simply replacing the clutch fork bracket in the bell housing to the ?

Since I no longer have access to a welder, I'm going to use the offset dowels if the runout requires it; I found RobbMc Performance Products offers adjustable alignment dowels for about the same price as the Lakewood fixed dowels. http://www.robbmcperformance.com/products/dowels.html

Do you replace your flywheel/pressure plate bolts when redoing your clutch? I read Ford OEM flywheel bolts are torque-to-yield so they should be replaced each time?

Thanks!
Brent

I use the later clutch fork pivot with my 68 fork in a 15200. Use the factory stuff right out of the old bellhousing I had for a 69' 351w.

I haven't used those dowels but they are supposed to be worlds ahead of the Lakewood type. Hopefully your bell is close to the desired alignment since they only move the bell so far.

The 5.0 bolts may be torque to yield. I don't know as I use aftermarket cranks. I use ARP fasteners (including the flywheel) over and over a few times before replacing them. ARP fasterners are pretty much the best out there and they give you piece of mind. Put some sealant on the threads and torque them like you would anything else.
 
I picked up a Ford Racing Pressure Plate Bolt and Dowel Kit and a ARP Pro Series Flywheel Bolt Kit. I found a late-68 to 73 Clutch fork repair kit (C8AZ-7562-A) in order to add the spring clasp onto the fork, since mine was missing.

Thanks again, Dennis!
 
Well I checked the runout on my Lakewood and it was out by 0.039" requiring the 0.021" offset dowels from RobbMc. I tried removing the block plate paint and bell housing paint but that didn't help.

Next question, while I have the trans out is it worthwhile to check for parallelism between the crank-end and the bellHousing? I've read sometimes shims are required between the engine.
 
I'm sure that it is worthwhile, but to tell you the truth I've disregarded it since the only way I thought it could be fixed was by having the bell remachined. Not easy to find someone who can do it correctly around here.

If you find it way off and you can fix it properly then I'd say go for it.