Roush 94 - 98 Saleen Speedster Wanted

[world.of.wheels]

Hi all,

Just a quick email to see if anyone knows where a 94 - 98 Saleen Speedster is for sale. I have checked lots of sites, etc....so if you have one, or one comes up that you know of, let me know.

My preference is black as well as white. Preferably a lower mile one. I am interested in the 97-98 S351 Speedster, the S281 Cobra Speedster, and may even consider a completely stock S281.

Any leads, let me know. Thanks

[email protected]

 

[SVT Saleen]

I suppose I might be willing to part with mine for the right price...

 

[world.of.wheels]

I PM'd you requesting specs, etc....

Please anyone, email me at [email protected] if you have anything at any time.

I should add that I am not looking so much for a supercharged car in the S281 as that would require a complete engine upgrade. The car would have to have forged internals for my intersest. I would still look at for an option, but I would be picky on Supercharged cars without forged internals and most likely would rather have a stock under-powered S281 4.6 SOHC or the more powerful 4.6 DOHC.

An S351 Speedster would be ideal though - lower mile 97-98 S351R Speedster perferred.

 

[BobV]

97 S281Cobra Vert on Ebay

Finder's fee gladly accepted!

 

[world.of.wheels]

Saw it....it is the third time it has been posted. If it wasn't superchargeded I would have considered it. The stock Mustang blocks are awesome and very reliable until you supercharge them. No matter the tune, etc....they are all ticking time bombs once they are supercharged with no internal forged pieces. Some last forever, some last 2 weeks - it just depends on the engine, its stage in life, and the aggressive driver (which I am at certain times). As well, the front two seats are very dis-tasteful. Other than those two big things (personal opionion), it looks like a beautiful car.

I run a 97 SVT Cobra Convertible, and I love the engine in it. I am simply looking for an upgrade.

Thanks for the heads up so far everyone.

 

[SVT Saleen]

97 S281Cobra Vert on Ebay

Finder's fee gladly accepted!

Yeah, that '97 would be sweet if it wasn't Rio Red. And his BIN price is a bit optimistic considering the current market.

 

[saleenster]

http://www.performanceautosport.com/detail.asp?car=5718

Non supercharged, but pretty darn nice

 

[world.of.wheels]

Been working with Bart on his nice S351 for awhile, but we cannot seem to make a deal on it yet.

I was hoping for one with around 30,000 miles on it. I know miles are not everything, but at 56,000 miles on it, I will get it and enjoy it for at least 20,000 miles and then park it and take it to the odd show and joy ride. For some reason, I am believing a Saleen with almost 80,000 miles on it for sale will get ignored if I ever wanted to sell it and upgrade to the S351R - unless I literally gave it away. I am doing it myself. I know where there are two S281 Speedsters with over 85,000 miles on them are: one for $11,000 and the other for $14,000 - loaded with most of the GOOD options, and I am completely ignoring them due to the 85,000 miles......would not even consider them......maybe it is just me. The S351 would most likely be in a different category, but it still is a monkey on my back that I have to get rid of. As well, what is an S351 going to be worth compared to an S351R in 20 years. The S351R is most likely worth the intial investment right now as the spread is going to be MUCH wider 20 years from now.


With low miles, I can enjoy the car for 3 or 4 years, and then have it in my collection after that as I would be looking for something else by then to put miles on and enjoy.

The other thing - being S351's are very difficult to get some parts for as they were modified by Saleen only, I am wondering if I should just get a Cobra most parts are available everywhere. There is only a 60some difference in Horsepower. Has anyone ever been in an S351 NA and can you compare it to a stock 4.6 Modular? Is it night and day - not even close - kind of like going from a 97 4.6 SOHC to a 4.6 DOHC or are they comparable.

Is it worth all the hassle with the special S351 headers that you cannot really find, the 13" front rotors, the computer problems they had in 1995, etc.....with the power difference from a Cobra at approx 315 to a S351 NA at 371. If it is 315HP versus 510HP - it seems alot more worth it to me.

Jason

 

[gonen20]

QUOTE=Is it worth all the hassle with the special S351 headers that you cannot really find, the 13" front rotors, the computer problems they had in 1995, etc.....with the power difference from a Cobra at approx 315 to a S351 NA at 371. If it is 315HP versus 510HP - it seems alot more worth it to me.

Jason

Jason, when I read the words you have written its sounds alot like me or my train of thinking on how hard & picky I am with choosing the right Saleen! The 3rd and most recent Saleen I purchased which is 100% Original, took me about a year and 10 months of searching and driving different Saleens before deciding on it! Saleen Cobra's are great and rare cars, more rare then most of the S351's! My first question to you would be! Have you driven or gone for a ride in an S351 R Code car??? All I have to say, Is WOW! Have you driven an O3 or 04 Cobra Mustang???? I know you mentioned body styles 94-98 and maybe your particular to those years, but an 03 or 04 Saleen Cobra, it wouldn't take much work to make it run with and beyond an S351! Nothing against S351's, that's one of my dream cars and someday I will own one but Saleen Cobra's are the best of both worlds! If I were you keep searching for the right Speedster and hold out on an unmodified Saleen Cobra! All you Saleen Cobra Owners out there, I'm jealous of your rides! Someday I might have one of those in my collections also, but the wife might kick me to the curb
1st!

 

[98 Saleen Cobra]

world.of.wheels: There are a few S-351's at www.performanceautosport.com, but as far as non-supercharged ones are concerned it might be hard to find. As far as Saleen Cobra's they are pretty hard to find not supercharged. There was a white one on ebay, a coupe with forged internals, charged, and such for i believe like 25k or 30k i don't remember what it sold for. I have never ridden in a S-351R but I have raced a few, now I did beat them, but my car is heavily modded, and alot lighter than theres. But keep looking you will find what you are looking for eventually.

Gonen20: Thanks for being jealous lol, my car is awesome and the 4.6 DOHC motors are awesome I would prefer this car over a 351 anyday.

 

[world.of.wheels]

Very tough decision - would you not say. I own a 97 SVT Ragtop right now and like that stock power very much. I love the almost 7,000 RPM redline. At the same time, the S351NA should keep up with any stock 03 - 04 Cobra. It may not beat them, but it will be very close. As well, they will feel similar in power in the drivers seat - being less than 20 HP apart. The S351NA may even have a bit more torque with the displacement.

At the same time, I am not really into "modding" a car so to speak. No that there is anything wrong with it, it is just not my cup of tea. The only mods I like are the ones that would make the vehicle run better or prevent a potential and known problem. The S351NA may be a more reliable car than an S351R code car in the long run as well.

Thanks for the opinions and input.

 

[98 Saleen Cobra]

No problem for the input. But if your not into modding cars, why not get a car that is already beefed up stock. I know you don't like the supercharged cars, but if they are stock like that they obvestly they are built for the charger right. Than why not settle for a S351 with a charger from it?

 

[marcus95]

A tough decision no?

I have been watching the thread. I have almost owned and broken every car you have listed in your posts.

The S351's and the mod motor cars are two totally different animals.

If you want a car that will be worth more and be more collectable, even though the same year Cobra/Saleens are more rare by the numbers go out, take your time and find the nicest S351R you can. If you are not capable to turn major wrenches take a pass on any S351 and get the S281 or Cobra.
A stock S351 will "feel" faster than most Cobra's, blown or not because of the equal torque they make as H.P.

As for what's faster. A heavily modded anything built to run can beat most anything stock (even the mighty S351R ) My buddy has a 99 S351 with a T-Trim, stroked 408, that walks all over whipple and KB 03/04 Cobras all day long.

Anyway, you can make a 96-01 Cobra sweep up S351's with a simple Vortech and a tune. Period. A stock S351, R -Code or not will peel a piston just the same so don't discriminate between the two unless cash is the detractor.


Good luck and let us know how you make out.

 

[footnfan]

Brakes

A tough decision no?

I have been watching the thread. I have almost owned and broken every car you have listed in your posts.

The S351's and the mod motor cars are two totally different animals.

If you want a car that will be worth more and be more collectable, even though the same year Cobra/Saleens are more rare by the numbers go out, take your time and find the nicest S351R you can. If you are not capable to turn major wrenches take a pass on any S351 and get the S281 or Cobra.
A stock S351 will "feel" faster than most Cobra's, blown or not because of the equal torque they make as H.P.

As for what's faster. A heavily modded anything built to run can beat most anything stock (even the mighty S351R ) My buddy has a 99 S351 with a T-Trim, stroked 408, that walks all over whipple and KB 03/04 Cobras all day long.

Anyway, you can make a 96-01 Cobra sweep up S351's with a simple Vortech and a tune. Period. A stock S351, R -Code or not will peel a piston just the same so don't discriminate between the two unless cash is the detractor.


Good luck and let us know how you make out.

Marcus. Can you please comment on proper replacement rotors for Alcon equipped saleens? Which rotor replaces the stock product?

Thanks.
Dan

P.S. An 03-04 Cobra is a very...very solid car, but it does not hold the mistique of the s351. Earned or not, the s351's seems to hold a special place in the hearts of saleen fans. I happen to think the 03-04 Cobra is a much better all around car.

 

[world.of.wheels]

That is great info. I was told that the S351 NA is a much more reliable car than the S351R - especially in 1994 and 1995.

On this note, please confirm that any S351 - supercharged or not is extremely unreliable and could blow a piston at ANY time. I am curious as to why a stock S351 without any boost would blow pistons unexpectedly as it is a standard 351W block that Ford has been using forever. I understand why they do not last when blown and not containing forged pistons, etc.....

I was thinking that the S351 NA would be as reliable as any stock Cobra Mustang or even 4.6 SOHC and would be part of the reason for the purchase of the S351NA????

 

[SVT Saleen]

I'm now the owner of the white Saleen Cobra Speedster that was listed on eBay last year & mentioned by 98 Saleen Cobra in his reply.

I had the same conundrum as you, world.of.wheels, when I found myself in the market for a replacement for my dearly departed, original owner 1989 Saleen Mustang. I always told myself I would never sell it but if I did, it's replacement would have to be a '94-'98 S351, preferrably a SR or R code or a Cobra-based Saleen. It also had to be a convertible, preferrably with the Speedster package.

So exactly a year ago this month I indeed sold my '89 & began a search for the aforementioned replacement Saleen. I had always wanted a S351, but the only ones available were either coupes or had been heavily modified. Having also owned a 1999 SVT Contour, I liked the idea of the dual exclusivity of owning both a Saleen & a SVT vehicle, plus the refinement of an all aluminum DOHC engine vs. a cast iron pushrod V8. So I began concentrating my search on a Cobra instead of a S351.

It really wasn't my intention to make a purchase so soon, but once the right car came along both my wife & I decided to take the plunge.

And we haven't regretted it.

 

[world.of.wheels]

I agree, having a Saleen with dual exclusivity is awesome - so that is why it would be my second choice unless I get my one biggest concern addressed that was just brought up.

The S351 is a almost as true of a car build up and future collectable as you can get. While ALL of the S281's including the Cobra's were improved by Saleen (Exterior Package, Suspension, Rims, few interior changes, exhaust), the S351 saw a complete drivetrain (engine and tranny) swap as well as a more extensive interior swap in addition to the improvements made to all the S281's. This sets the cars apart drastically from all others by QUITE a bit - literally. As far as an enthusiasts point of view as well as a collectable, this is what it is about - an almost completely re-worked car from from to back - documented and sold as brand new on the market with LOW production numbers.

Now, I have been told by lots of people that the S351 NA would be an extremely reliable car as the engine is not blown and the components around it are very modest. The only problem with the S351 NA is the computers have a problem when the air conditioning is on with stalling or erratic idling at stop lights, and if this was addressed, it should be almost bulletproof if serviced like at regular intervals like one should service any car. I am now hearing from Marcus 95 "If you are not capable to turn major wrenches take a pass on any S351 and get the S281 or Cobra" which tells me that ALL S351's wether blown or not - are not reliable at all and that one should be prepared for the worst. I need to find more about this as Marcus95 is the only one I heard this from about the S351NA, and he possibly knows the most about them from what I hear.

Anyone else KNOW FOR SURE. This could be the most important part as I am looking for 1st hand KNOWLEDGE and EXPERIENCE with explanations rather than possible opinions without experience on the S351NA.

My second choice would be a Cobra Speedster, but I really think my 1st choice would be the S351 NA rather than the S351R simply due to overall driveablilty and reliability (for me - unless I find out otherwise). After all, I am buying this car TO DRIVE and enjoy as well as to have a nice looking piece of art in the garage, not to mention enjoy showing the car due to its rarity. In fact, if I do pursue, I may have one of the only S351's in Canada - How cool is that!

If I was to own a "newer" car (rather than a 68-72) that I would just drive about 500 miles per year - the S351R it would be - simply because it would last forever.

 

[saleenster]

Your comments are very legit, however, I would ask you, if collectiblity is the key portion of your decision, I would recommand you looking a little closer at a Fox Saleen. Any of the '92 or '93 SC saleens should be mentioned along with the SSC, or any convertible with low mileage. SA10 car to me is the ulitmate Saleen, but these are just my thoughts and trying to locate one that has the owner even having a thought of selling would be a bidding war.

 

[world.of.wheels]

If you read collectability is important, but driveability is equally as important. If I had a rare 1 of car with no miles, I would have a hard time driving it and making a mark on it. Add an engine that is not very reliable - even worse. The 84 through 93 Saleens are nice, but not my cup of tea. I have to agree that there are some VERY collectable in that series:

1984 Hatch - only 3 made and first year of Saleen
1990 and 1991 SC
1993 SC
1993 SA-10
1993 RRR

...I am still more interested in some experience with naturally aspirated 351's in the S351, and why they are so unreliable and a "ticking time bomb" so to speak. I just can't seem to believe that yet.

 

[SVT Saleen]

RE: the issue of the reliability/longevity of S351 engines.

I am not exactly the right person to know all the ins & outs of this question, but from discussions I've had with Marcus, Robert & Tim (formerly of Paper Flames fame) @ the annual Saleen Performance car show over the past couple of years, the issue concerns the computer programming in the S351 models.

Since the S351 was pretty much a ground-up rebuild of a standard GT Mustang, the computer itself was a custom programmed EEC IV/V dependent upon whether it was naturally aspirated or supercharged.
Allegedly the programming of the computers was such that it increased the peak torque & horsepower of the S351 but at the cost of reliability. IOW, the tune was rather lean @ the upper end of the engine's operating range which resulted in the cylinders being starved for fuel & hence the dreaded detonation resulting in burnt pistons & other catastrophic failure. This was a particularly acute condition with the Vortech supercharged R-code cars.

I distinctly remember this info because I had mentioned to the aforementioned gentlemen my desire to replace my '89 with a S351 & they specifically told me about the issue with the computer programming as something to consider in my purchase decision.

Now that I have a completely original Saleen Cobra, I intend to forgo any engine modifications & merely have a custom computer/dyno tune to optimize its performance.