anyone out there running a procharger kit? im tryin to pull together some info on the D 1 stage II kits. also Cog belts anyone running them on any supercharger? mainly the ATI kits? how much boost and how much power are some of yalls kits putting to the rear wheels? also can someone explain the water/methanol/alky injection? i get what its sopose to do i just wanna know how it does it?
a couple supercharger questions
- Thread starter lwtchlx
- Start date
9psi 403rwhp with an afr of 10:1---dumb ass tuner. getting a pms to fix that.
i have the methanol kit in now too (another reason for the pms) anyways, the main idea between the meth injection is that it cools the boosted air down. afm says as much as 60* colder air means more dense air so more power and less detonation. plus because the methanol acts as super high octane (burns slower) you can run more boost and more timing without detonation.
since my dyno tune (and i use the term tune loosely) ive changed to a 11lbs pulley and hooked up my methanol kit from afm. plan to lean the hell out of it. go to about 11.3:1 on the afr and that will get me a few more horses. hope to get into the high 400's but dont know how much running rich was hurting my hp.
afm is boost controlled with no electric pump and sprays a stream at the sc impeller which atomizes it. the snow kit mists the meth into the intake infront of the tb. same effect, different means
i have the methanol kit in now too (another reason for the pms) anyways, the main idea between the meth injection is that it cools the boosted air down. afm says as much as 60* colder air means more dense air so more power and less detonation. plus because the methanol acts as super high octane (burns slower) you can run more boost and more timing without detonation.
since my dyno tune (and i use the term tune loosely) ive changed to a 11lbs pulley and hooked up my methanol kit from afm. plan to lean the hell out of it. go to about 11.3:1 on the afr and that will get me a few more horses. hope to get into the high 400's but dont know how much running rich was hurting my hp.
afm is boost controlled with no electric pump and sprays a stream at the sc impeller which atomizes it. the snow kit mists the meth into the intake infront of the tb. same effect, different means
those d-1's come with an intercooler i think, so i dont know how much that methanol injection would really help. probally wouldnt hurt anything but with an intercooler like the proghargers have there isnt as much need for the meth. cause thats what the inercooler's for
u can never have air to cold wel unless if its frozen?...... i didnt get how methanol kits worked i knew they allowed lets retard timing and more high boost pressures but just didnt know how it was injected. but nobody running cog belts? what are the pros and cons of cog belts. i know they allow alot less slippage so no loss in boost. luckythirteen13 what blower are u running and is it intercooled?
Black1987Stang
Active Member
My friends running cog belts on his Vortech blower. Ive never seen them or anything, but i know they do make a nice whine once u get into some rpms. Ive heard they put strain on the blower bearings but i just heard that from one person so idk
well right now im tryin to scratch the money together to find a LX coupe w/ a 5.0 and i figured buy the blower take it to the dyno guy we use around here (cuz has a 1st gen lighting w/ a STS turbo its sick) and i reckon as money allows i wanna put a 331 w/ 8:1 comp. im just real explorering all my options right now. id love to go turbo but tuning for them is pain.
Methanol injection is effective due to two reasons: 1) the mist of water acts as a cooling agent and physically cools down intake air temps and 2) Methanol itself has a very high octane rating (something in the neighborhood of 130 or so). So if you understand the difference and advantage of running 93 octane over 87, especially with regards to detonation problems, then you should know why this aspect works really well.
check out horsepowerfreaks.com they have all kinds of pulleys, i remember seeing cog kits for paxtons but i didnt look at prochargers.
i believe the d-1s come with a 12 rib setup, not sure though. thats alot of belt space and i dowbt that you would have problems with slippage there.
i believe the d-1s come with a 12 rib setup, not sure though. thats alot of belt space and i dowbt that you would have problems with slippage there.
i went to another site that listed how much the kits were along w/ the options and its gonna run me about $5500 for D1SC stage 2 w/ intercooler and cog belt. and i learned procharger will warranty the kit i wanna get at 14 PSI for a year. now im lookin at goin turbo b/c its gonna be around the same amount of money and i love the turbo sound but i also love the way a cog belt sounds. im goin to look at a 91 LX 5.0 coupe next tuesday. a friend of a friend has one.
65ShelbyClone
Founding Member
87stangdiddle said:
I've heard something similar, but it was that any blower will be hard on the front crank bearing. I've seen cog setups with a tensioner bar that goes between the blower shaft and the crank centerlines to keep them from deflecting toward each other.
I dont know why a cog belt would induce any more wear than an equal serpentine belted blower. Then again, a little fabrication and ~$1200 can get you an intercooled JY twin turbo setup.
Any centri. blower like a ATI, Vortech or Paxton that has a extend crank pulley adds a lot of stress to the snout of the crank. You are out far on the tip and everyone likes to crank the belt tension so it doesn't slip, it will pull the crank forward and up takeing out the front main bearing earlier.
Actually the reg serp betl set-up is harder on the crank then a cog drive since you have a ton of belt tension with a serp. belt, the cog belt is actually slightly loose. They sell the support to go from the upper blower pulley to the crank for serp. belt set-up's, this will prevent overtightening, belt deflection and the pulling on the crank.
The support for a lower cog pulley ususally bolts straghight back to the block or motor plate to just give the snotu some added support.
Actually the reg serp betl set-up is harder on the crank then a cog drive since you have a ton of belt tension with a serp. belt, the cog belt is actually slightly loose. They sell the support to go from the upper blower pulley to the crank for serp. belt set-up's, this will prevent overtightening, belt deflection and the pulling on the crank.
The support for a lower cog pulley ususally bolts straghight back to the block or motor plate to just give the snotu some added support.
Michael Yount
Mustang Master
13 - keep in mind -- the methanol is fuel too --- when you inject it, you richen the mixture. That means if you want to get to 11-12:1 a/f, you'll have to back even more gasoline out to allow for the methanol fuel you're gonna inject. Here's the downside -- if your methanol pump fails, or you run dry in the middle of a hard pull - you're gonna go WAY lean -- which usually means big problems under boost. So I'd recommend some sort of safeguard against running out of methanol or the pump failing.
lwtchlx - you either intercool OR run methanol/water injection - but usually not both. The goal is to cool the intake charge which gets heated when it's compressed by the charger. With water injection - you get the cooling without the potential lean issues mentioned in my first paragragh; you can still have heat/detonation issues if you run out of water mid-run -- but it won't be as bad as it would if you'd tuned with methanol in place, and then ran dry. With methanol you get even more cooling because of the heat of vaporization of the methanol itself (it cools the charge along with the water). Many high boost applications just run on methanol with no intercooler (or gasoline) at all. With the intercooler, you don't have to worry about mixture issues if you run out of water or methanol mid-run. But they're usually more expensive and complicated to install (plumbing/space issues).
lwtchlx - you either intercool OR run methanol/water injection - but usually not both. The goal is to cool the intake charge which gets heated when it's compressed by the charger. With water injection - you get the cooling without the potential lean issues mentioned in my first paragragh; you can still have heat/detonation issues if you run out of water mid-run -- but it won't be as bad as it would if you'd tuned with methanol in place, and then ran dry. With methanol you get even more cooling because of the heat of vaporization of the methanol itself (it cools the charge along with the water). Many high boost applications just run on methanol with no intercooler (or gasoline) at all. With the intercooler, you don't have to worry about mixture issues if you run out of water or methanol mid-run. But they're usually more expensive and complicated to install (plumbing/space issues).
