Anti Theft Key Questions????

s5150stang · May 15, 2006

Ok my stang has been off the road for a week nowl. I have a 96 GT with 148k miles. She has been flawless for the past six years I have ran the balls off it. Last week I filled up at the pump. When i went to take off she hesitated for a split second and then kept going fine. I turned a round at a place and got on it again with the same split second hesitation. These happened at about 4.5 grand. I shut it down got a bite to eat and returned to the car. Started fine and drove for about 5 miles. Stopped at a light for a minute. When I took off normal......she died. Has not started again since. The one thing I noticed was the anti theft light on the dash has been blinking. Only ever did that one time. That was with a unprogrammed key about 5 years ago. I do not hear the fuel pump whine like normal. So I replaced it. Still will not fire!!! Have preasure in the fuel rails!!! Theft light still blinks? All the fuses are good.....So can I overide the theft system or is there another problem??????

I noticed the theft light blinks fast for exactly one minute and then it blinks once and then six more times repeatedly for about 5mor minutes while the key is in the run position...

slow96mustang · May 15, 2006

my sister is having a problem that sounds kinda like your's, but with her taurus. she has to press her panic button, AND then shut it off by unlocking her doors, while inside of the car for some reason. then her car fires right up. give it a shot. its a reaccuring problem for her, some times she has to, other times she doesnt. this could be way off the wall, but give it a shot. if not, try jumping your trigger wire to the starter, its a black wire, right next to your battery, that connects into a single, white with a pink tracer wire, take power straight form your possitive terminal, and touch the white/pink wire, your starter should turn. you said you dont hear the fuel pump tho, so this probally wont help. just play around with it some, you might figure it out.

rob.

slow96mustang · May 15, 2006

i just re read what you wrote. it sounds exactly like my sisters problem. sorry about the rambiling about your starter, i was assuming that your starter wasnt even turning over.

DTNODYA · May 16, 2006

Did you disconnect your battery to try to reset the ECU? I don't know if that will fix your problem but it's worth a try. Do you have two keys? Like a spare key that is also 'chipped'? Because if you do, your owners manual tells you how to reprogram them which I had to do one time. Something I found while screwing around one day ... if you turn the key from the off position to the on (not cranking) like 5 times really fast, all the doors will lock and unlock. This made my airbag light go off one time. lol. Weird ass cars!

s5150stang · May 16, 2006

Reset

I did disconect the battery a few times hell I made the thing go dead twice screwing around. At any rate I have also tried to reprogram the theft system by turning the key to run and letting it sit for 15 min. The THEFT light stops flasdhing and then you are to turn it off for one second and then repeat two more times. This is allegedly out of the Ford Service book for rare cases where someone might be stranded with no garage with the proper computer repair system. It did not work. Going to try it again in the morning.

The other thing I do not have a key ring keyless entry thinga mado. I have an extra one for my truck. If there is someone who can tell me how to program it maybe I can try it.

DTNODYA · May 16, 2006

I'm about to go take a test (gotta love may-semester ) but when I get back, I will look up how to program it for you. There is a plug in the trunk that you have to take a small piece of speaker wire and jump (ground) two connections. At least that is how it is on my 98 but I'll see for you when I get back. You can program the key fob though. You may want to pop your ignition out to make sure that nothing looks out of wack with it. There is a little hole in the bottom of the steering column that you have to stick a small screwdriver/scribe/whatever up in there and the ignition just pulls right out. It may be bad. Just a thought...

DageonYar · May 16, 2006

http://www.fordf150.net/howto/reprogramremotes.php

Sounds like fun lol

s5150stang · May 17, 2006

Still not working

I have tried other keys with no luck. I got under the stearing colum todat and took the plastic off of it. Its like pealing back the skin in the terminators arm. Lot more mechanical looking than I thought. At any rate there is a little match box sized black box on the under side of the colum. It is attached to a loop which is around the tumbler. Then there is a small grey bundle of wire about 10 inches long which leads to a plug with 4 prongs. Came right out easy.

Took it to Ford. WHOA did I get a rash!! "Where did you come up with that idea......What lead you to believe thats the problem?" So I asked about the THEFT light flashing and if it was a code. I was proptly told that cars no longer are like the "older" cars which used to flash codes on the dash......(older than 10 years?) So I say to the guy so its just an odd coincidence that it flashes in a pattern.......He says YEP!. "You probably messed up more stuff taking that thing off and have more codes now. You are going to probably need to bring it in...." I said ya right!? $52 an hour labor plus about $50 more to hook it up plus maybe another hour just for grins. I am considering buying a scanner for myself. Might spend the money and get something good which can be updated from the net or something. I know enough other people who whould throw me a few bucks to barrow it in a time or need. Plus I can forsee needing it.

OBSERVATION #2: Took my part home and hooked it back up except for the plug. Turned key and same thing happened.....No Fire! THEFT flashes fast for a minute.......AND THEN NO CODE!!!??? Tried it a couple of times....Same thing! Hooked up wires......Flashes fast for a minute then the code comes back!!!!.....Tried it a couple more time each way. SO MR. FORD guy is it a code now????

Still not fixed still lost and stuck driving the truck in the nice weather.......AHHHHHHH!!!

Mike97gt · May 17, 2006

check fuse numbers 15 and 18 in the fuse junction panel that is your first step

52 bucks a hour is DIRT cheap.. we get 98 dollars a hour at my dealer and we are thinking of going over 100 per hour soon.

But my dealer is in the middle of the richest area of eastern ma. many of the zip codes around my work is in the top income zipcodes in the nation.

that part you took out is called the pats transceiver

Well anyways you have a pats fault for sure. here is some info

ford said:
Section 13-11B: Anti-Theft System, Passive 1996 Mustang Workshop Manual
DESCRIPTION AND OPERATION Procedure revision date: 05/18/2000

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Components
The vehicle protection system contains the following components:

passive anti-theft system module
THEFT indicator
transceiver electronics
powertrain control module (PCM) (12A650)
encoded ignition key
RH drive anti-theft alarm control mounting bracket (19A435)
LH drive anti-theft alarm control mounting bracket
multiplex communications network
data link connector
The passive vehicle protection system components function as follows:

Theft Indicator
The passive anti-theft vehicle protection system utilizes the same anti-theft indicator, located in the instrument cluster (10849) that the anti-theft alarm system (if equipped) uses. (Refer to Section 13-11A.)
The indicator provides system proveout and operating status to the customer or service technician.
The anti-theft alarm system uses the theft indicator when the ignition switch is turned OFF. The passive anti-theft vehicle protection system uses the theft indicator when the ignition switch is turned to RUN/START position. The passive vehicle protection system will activate the indicator signal as described under the following conditions when the ignition switch is turned to RUN/START position:
THEFT Indicator ON two seconds, then OFF
Key Code Received/Vehicle Enabled (Programmed key)
THEFT Indicator ON two seconds, then OFF one second, then ON continuously
Key Code Received/Vehicle Disabled (Assembly plant use only, less than two keys programmed)
THEFT Indicator ON two seconds, then flash for one minute, then flash diagnostic trouble code 16 ten times
Key Code Received/Vehicle Enabled or Disabled (No PCM Verification)
If vehicle starts, powertrain control module is not working with control module
If vehicle does not start, Multiplex Communications Network may need service
You will need to go to the Symptom Chart in this Section for diagnostic assistance to isolate any communication system.
THEFT Indicator flashes for one minute
No Key Code Received (Key damaged, Non-encoded key, Wiring or Transceiver concern)
THEFT Indicator flashes for 15 minutes
Key Code Received/Vehicle Disabled (Key not programmed). Refer to Key Initialization Procedure in Service Procedures.
Encoded Ignition Key
When the vehicle ignition switch is placed into either RUN or START, the control module initiates a key interrogation sequence. The control module starts an interrogation period by supplying both power and the carrier signal to the transceiver to energize the ignition key. After the energize period has expired, the key transmits its ID code to the transceiver module. This ignition key is much larger in size due to the electronics that are located in the head of the ignition key.
Transceiver
The transceiver module is used to interface the control module to the encoded ignition key. The transceiver sends a signal to power up the encoded key and receives the ignition key data signal and sends it to the control module.
Passive Anti-Theft System Module
The control module contains circuitry to interface to the vehicle electrical system, the transceiver module, the vehicle multiplex communications network and the vehicle theft indicator located in the instrument cluster. The control module uses a microprocessor to control the system functions. The control module microprocessor stores the ignition key codes in non-volatile memory. The control module can be diagnosed through the data link connector.
Powertrain Control Module (PCM)
The passive vehicle protection system utilizes the engine management capabilities of the powertrain control module to enable or disable the vehicle engine. The multiplex communications network is used to send and receive messages to and from the powertrain control module. At each engine start sequence, the powertrain control module allows fuel and spark until the engine is running.
Within one second after engine start, the powertrain control module must receive an enable signal or the engine is disabled before the vehicle can be moved.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

ford said:
Section 13-11B: Anti-Theft System, Passive 1996 Mustang Workshop Manual
SERVICE PROCEDURES Procedure revision date: 05/18/2000

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Spare Key Programming

NOTE: Service control modules require only one key to be programmed before allowing the vehicle to start. If a control module is changed, the technician must inform the customer to program any additional keys using the Spare Key Programming procedure detailed in the Owner Guide.

The system has capacity to store a maximum of 16 keys. After the initial key has been programmed or using any programmed key, follow the steps below:

NOTE: Encoded keys must have correct mechanical key cut for vehicle.

Cycle ignition switch from RUN to OFF with a programmed key.
Within 15 seconds after this cycle, insert a new encoded key into ignition switch and turn to RUN or START.
If programming is successful, the THEFT indicator will illuminate for two seconds and the control module will enable the vehicle to start.
Repeat until all chosen keys have been programmed, up to 16 keys total.
If programming is not successful, the THEFT indicator will:
Flash for one minute if no key code is received. The key is either damaged or is a non-encoded key. (Try a new key and start procedure over again.)
Flash for 15 minutes if key code is received yet vehicle is disabled. The key was not programmed successfully. Start procedure over again.
If programming is not successful, possibly the new key was not inserted within 15 seconds, all 16 key codes have been stored, or the key is a non-encoded key. If the key was not encoded or inserted within 15 seconds, repeat procedure.

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the reason I put the fuses in bold up top is because this is the most common cause of your concern, followed by the transciver and then module communication network and then the modules itself.

many things can cause this problem.. now you see why we charge what we charge, modern cars are very complex.

Digger · May 17, 2006

I know you don't want to hear this, but take it to Ford. The scanner for a 96 is about $180. You might be able to get it for a little less, but it would be worht it for them to have at it for 3 hours and get it fixed right.

DTNODYA · May 17, 2006

svttech76 said:
52 bucks a hour is DIRT cheap.. we get 98 dollars a hour at my dealer and we are thinking of going over 100 per hour soon.

But my dealer is in the middle of the richest area of eastern ma. many of the zip codes around my work is in the top income zipcodes in the nation.

Dayyyauuummm. That is a lot for labor. But that's good for you guys

When I worked at a dealership we charged $70 (still seems high to me but you're right, newer cars are mad complicated so I know that it can be worth it).

Are you paid based on SL? just curious ..

Mike97gt · May 17, 2006

DTNODYA said:
Dayyyauuummm. That is a lot for labor. But that's good for you guys

When I worked at a dealership we charged $70 (still seems high to me but you're right, newer cars are mad complicated so I know that it can be worth it).

Are you paid based on SL? just curious ..

I am paid on the flat rate system. the only problem with the SL system is when the writers discount the work it cost me money. this way I don't get hurt if they discount heavily to sell a job.

I wish we still got 40 percent like the techs in the 70's got.. the highest paid techs nowadays is lucky to see 30-35 percent for the labor that I said we get.

urban96 · May 17, 2006

i dislike fords PATS

Anti Theft Key Questions????

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