avereage HP from a 347?

walker95svt · Sep 12, 2005

I thought you've made a lot of relevant points, vibrant

5spd GT · Sep 12, 2005

Killercanary said:
5spd GT- dude, give it up. You know how much I drag raced my car and how concistent I am. I gained NOTHING by bypassing the smog pump. NOTHING, I lost ~10lbs with deleting the pump but I gained NOTHING at the track, hence there was NO power to be gained. I also run underdrive pulleys on my car which at the time I put them on took me from a 14.9 at 91.5mph to a 14.6 at 94.89, so they obviously free'd up some ponies. My buddy GMKILLR who also drag races as much if not more than I did at the time dyno's his car 94 cobra with a shortbelt, and the MAX he gained a 3-5hp, but he gained it EVERYWHERE. A 1.5mph gain DOES NOT necessarily mean a gain of 15hp. This is generally a good rule of thumb, UNLESS a few HP are gained throughout the entire RPM band as in the case of GMKILLR. I have run my car and with a shortbelt (bypassing the AC and PS, in addition to the smog pump which is always bypassed) and it is worth a consistent 1.5mph.

I put the whole 15 horsepower thing (as the rule of the thumb as you stated) to counter his 10hp "underestimate" to show a one-sidedness towards his point.

I said they gained it everywhere in the earlier post, no surprise there.

If the smog pump had nothing to be gained by being bypassed then why would one do it?

I just can't believe grn92lx said a the a/c is a free spinning pulley...he needs to go turn one with the belt off. Obviouisly it gets worse during the compressor cycles.

It is a simple point that you gain horsepower especially on a higher rev car. Less parasitic drag on the crank equals to more power/torque. Very easy concept.

I can't give up on a topic when someone puts very onesided and inaccurate info.

Claiming 2hp from a a/c and smog pump delete/bypass....come one

Grn92LX · Sep 12, 2005

Back to the TOPIC, kck6894, got your 347 dyno graph yet for us to see?

5spd GT · Sep 12, 2005

nmcgrawj said:
Dont worry Paul he wont. You can say all you want...Ed C. can even come in and say his piece and he still wants more.

Wrong...about Ed. I have dealt with him (look at sig.)...he gave me what I wanted I will argue points (takes two to argue right?) that need to be addressed. I hate bias info or misrepresented and misleading info. Pet peeve of mine...

Grn92LX said:
Don't forget 5spd gt too, he's got a job as well.

In fact, two of them. (65 hours a week). I get minimum sleep with my "activities"...

walker95svt - Good questions I don't worry about being "ganged up on". It doesn't slow my progress or points. I don't succumb just because of numbers. I'm an internet tough guy ...

Killercanary · Sep 12, 2005

walker95svt said:
why does everything have to turn into an argument? do you guys go around ganging up on people? Do you two have JOBS? You guys know who I'm talking about..... a one "perfect" convertible guy, and grn92lx......

I'm not perfect, but thanks!

JFYI- I do in fact have a full time job as a medical sales representative. I'm paid on 100% commission, which means if I'm not busy doing my job, I don't make any money... But I'm a hard worker and I do quite well for myself.

Killercanary · Sep 12, 2005

5spd GT said:
If the smog pump had nothing to be gained by being bypassed then why would one do it?

I just can't believe grn92lx said a the a/c is a free spinning pulley...he needs to go turn one with the belt off. Obviouisly it gets worse during the compressor cycles.

Claiming 2hp from a a/c and smog pump delete/bypass....come one

The reason I deleted mine was because I run an offroad X pipe and therefore the air pump was serving no purpose, and I wanted to drop any excess weight I could. Its location is a great place to lose weight as well, right out in front of the car. The AC has a very MINIMAL amount of drag on it when the AC is off... VERY minimal. I have seen people delete both an gain nothing other than some weight off the front end. You are right that the parasitic loses do tend to go up with RPM, but I was surprised at how low in the RPM range GMKILLR gained power with deleting the power steering pump. I know you know about "area under the curve," but its an example like this where 5rwhp or less equates to 1-1.5mph gain in the 1/4 that opens other people's eyes to the importance of it.

nmcgrawj · Sep 12, 2005

5spd GT said:
Wrong...about Ed. I have dealt with him (look at sig.)...he gave me what I wanted I will argue points (takes two to argue right?) that need to be addressed. I hate bias info or misrepresented and misleading info. Pet peeve of mine...

Never said you didnt deal with Ed. But Ed came into the other thread and stated the TRUTH about what can be done and what HAS been done at his shop. But you still ask US for graphs. Call Ed like i said before buddy.

And just for others, we all might argue, i cant count the times david(5spd), Mike(grn92lx), and myself have gotten into a little word battle. Its annoying. Yes it is but at the same time amusing. But at the end of the day we still all respect eachother(or atleast i hope ) and dont have any hard feelings

nmcgrawj · Sep 12, 2005

walker95svt said:
I thought you've made a lot of relevant points, vibrant

Both of the guys you were referring to have a lot of knowledge from experience. And paul is considered to be "perfect" because he has had his combo together the longest and has already made just about every mistake we could make. So he knows his stuff. Like Vib said, a lot of different personalities trying to get across the same idea(most of the time) but in a different way. Some people just have different theories they believe in. You can see it on hardcore50 too between some of the cam designers. They could go on all day but they HAVE to agree to disagree. But the arguements still come up.

95Vert · Sep 13, 2005

Redsnk95 said:
marc's new 347 is going to be impressive, now if his tranny will hold up to that 547rwhp 347 NA motor.

Troy

How did he manage that impressive amount of power?

95Vert · Sep 13, 2005

walker95svt said:
actually, I am the HEAD swing shift french fry maker at Mcdonalds.

Not making fun, just thought it was hilarious.

Redsnk95 · Sep 13, 2005

95Vert said:
How did he manage that impressive amount of power?

$3000+ invested in the cylinder heads, and giving Kuntz A LOT of money to build a trick motor. Those super stock guys have all kinds of tricks up their sleeves...from custom cam bearings and custom cam tunnels to trick piston designs. Every lil thing helps, but when you add up a bunch of lil tricks together you come up with a nice power numbers.

Put a lot of investment, time, and expertise and you'll get a lot of power from a little bit of work, that's why you see NMRA Pure Street motors putting down 475rwhp out of a 311ci motor with AFR 165s and a .500" lift camshaft and running 10.50s.

Troy

95Vert · Sep 13, 2005

I'm assuming he has to driveability issues, does he? Need more info on these guys since I'll be wanting a stroker pretty soon.
Thanks Troy

Are you familiar with Untamed Racing there in Houston?

5spd GT · Sep 13, 2005

Killercanary said:
The reason I deleted mine was because I run an offroad X pipe and therefore the air pump was serving no purpose, and I wanted to drop any excess weight I could. Its location is a great place to lose weight as well, right out in front of the car. The AC has a very MINIMAL amount of drag on it when the AC is off... VERY minimal. I have seen people delete both an gain nothing other than some weight off the front end. You are right that the parasitic loses do tend to go up with RPM, but I was surprised at how low in the RPM range GMKILLR gained power with deleting the power steering pump. I know you know about "area under the curve," but its an example like this where 5rwhp or less equates to 1-1.5mph gain in the 1/4 that opens other people's eyes to the importance of it.

Peak numbers are peak numbers. The whole "high numbers" when the accessories are deleted still go together. I'm sure you have seen in magazines where it says "gain 37+ horsepower with the Performer intake"...but we all know of course it is possible but it is at one particular rpm. Same goes with the accessories. It helps for sure.

Spin it over with your hand (the a/c) without the compressor 'kicked on' and see how "very minimal" it is...it is more to the engine than your making it out to be.

94GTLaserRC · Sep 13, 2005

Troy, that stuff you posted is just sick.

RC

kck6894 · Sep 13, 2005

Grn92LX said:
Back to the TOPIC, kck6894, got your 347 dyno graph yet for us to see?

No! I tried scanning the graph earlier and my computer/scanner is being super gay. I am still trying. As soon as I can get it scanned I will post it.

kck6894 · Sep 13, 2005

FINALLY!!!!

Sorry about the size. The website it's on is suspose to resize it, but it doesn't look like it did

Car Nut · Sep 13, 2005

Grn92LX said:
Car nut, 350+ rwhp will be cake walk if the cam is right. Don't use a cam from chp, use a custom. Use the 2.02 edelbrock rpm heads with good valve springs to match the cam. Shoot for at least 10.5:1 compression. The heads may need to be milled. 75mm tb with rpm II inlet opened up to match. 30lb injectors for this car. Go wity longtubes, but i'm guessing you wanna see that catted x pipe? If so, use 1 3/4" shortys, but the longtubes will make more. Deleting accessories like a/c and smog are done to reduce weight and clutter.

Sorry so late in responding. I'm in Ft. Luaderdale/Miami on business and finally got to the Net.

Good info above. About the CHP cam: I think that their cam is the key element that makes the 347-e emissions legal. If I go with another choice, it would need to be able to pass the sniffer (in Georgia, our tests are almost as bad as California).

Heads: I will be getting Edelbrock heads that are bare, so that my local shop can prep them properly. Dumb question, but do the Edelbrock heads come with springs? IF so, they must be pretty decent. If not, then that can be addressed easily.

Headers: Like you said, the 1 3/4" shortys are pretty much a must due to the need for the catted X.

Accessories: I agree with Vibe. Plus, I live in Georgia and need AC now and then. No deletes for now.

I understand that some HP will be lost because of my emissions delima, but I'll take the punishment anyway. In the end, I want to end up with a respectable 347 built with quality in mind. From what's been stated, it looks like I'm on the right track. Hopefully this didn't stray from the topic or interest too far.

Thanks for everyone who responded. This has been a good thread.....mostly.

Car Nut · Sep 13, 2005

Oh yeah.........nice graph above.

I guess the lower rpm range doesn't matter so much. Unreal how much power is gained between 3500 and 5000rpm. Very nice!

Grn92LX · Sep 13, 2005

Kck6894, I appriciate you posting the graph! Looks good. You never answered me when I asked who did the head porting? Great numbers, I still feel it should do more, but 420hp is nothing to shake your head at. What has it ran at the track? How is the driveability with that N-111?

Car nut, a good custom cam can still pass smog. Just let the grinder know it needs to pass. GA isn't like Cali where you need carb stickers for mods. NY too has strict emissions, but my car hasn't seen an inspection station in years hehehe! Edelbrock heads come with springs and they can be bought bare. I would buy them complete and swap springs as needed. Your car will still do alright given the strict emissions parts and bottlenecks. I can still see 350hp. If I can help anymore, just ask!

Mike

kck6894 · Sep 13, 2005

Grn92LX said:
Kck6894, I appriciate you posting the graph! Looks good. You never answered me when I asked who did the head porting? Great numbers, I still feel it should do more, but 420hp is nothing to shake your head at. What has it ran at the track? How is the driveability with that N-111?
Mike

I do all my own porting and engine work. They guy who does my machine work tells me how to port them and I do it. He's not a big mustang guy but he really knows his stuff. As far as the amount of power I am producing I am a little up in the air about it. Don't forget though I do run FULL street trim clear down to my ac still and it will get 20 MPG on the highway. The N-111 doesn't have any street problems at all. It want's to surge at low RPM sometimes but I think that also has a lot ot do with the 90 MM THB and the 42lb injectors. With the engine not make lots of low end torque and hp it actually makes it a very nice set up for the street. It is actually quite mild mannered untill it sees WOT. It has a nice idle at about 1500 rpm too. The comments random people on the street are priceless!!

avereage HP from a 347?

walker95svt

New Member

5spd GT

"the 5.0 owns all"

Grn92LX

Fidanza Man!

5spd GT

"the 5.0 owns all"

Killercanary

The car that set the bar.

Killercanary

The car that set the bar.

nmcgrawj

Advanced Member

nmcgrawj

Advanced Member

95Vert

New Member

95Vert

New Member

Redsnk95

95Vert

New Member

5spd GT

"the 5.0 owns all"

94GTLaserRC

Squint as you approach, lest you be blinded by my

kck6894

Advanced Member

kck6894

Advanced Member

Attachments

Car Nut

Car Nut

Grn92LX

Fidanza Man!

kck6894

Advanced Member

Similar threads

avereage HP from a 347?

New Member

"the 5.0 owns all"

Fidanza Man!

"the 5.0 owns all"

The car that set the bar.

The car that set the bar.

Advanced Member

Advanced Member

New Member

New Member

New Member

"the 5.0 owns all"

Squint as you approach, lest you be blinded by my

Advanced Member

Advanced Member

Attachments

Fidanza Man!

Advanced Member

Similar threads

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency