Build up ideas. 69 fastback, 390FE w/ T-5

FallujahMedic · Sep 12, 2005

Well, my baby is almost completely stripped. The only things left to be pulled are the front and rear suspension, brake lines and front and rear glass. As soon as thats complete it will go down to Orlando to be media blasted and to have the floorpans, battery tray, trunk extensions and both rear quarters welded in. Any primer/prep advice?
Then its off to the machine shop with the 390. I'm thinking a stock rebuild, but with an upgrade to forged pistons/rods, an aggressive cam and swapping the stock heads/intake for new Edelbrock Performer RPM. Unsure of what type carb to add , Thoughts/ideas?
Also I'd like to add a T-5, but am unsure what I will need in the way of modifications. The car started out as your basic 302 with a 3-speed, manual steering, manual 4 wheel drum. And that brings me to my last mod idea, brakes. i like the "mustang steve" disc brake solution, but what about the rears? also what will I need to change as far as the master cylinder, etc.

Any thoughts, ideas, or experiences with a similar setup will be appreciated.

thehueypilot · Sep 12, 2005

For rear disc brakes I recommend "Ford Explorer" from Currie Enterprises. The parking brake actually works good with no special parts needed. I reused my stock parking brake cables. Down the road you can get repair parts (calipers, pads, rotors) from any LOCAL parts store.

MitchGT · Sep 13, 2005

umm... a t-5 with a big block? You will break that in short order. Get a Tremec five speed.
With the really low first gear and all that torque you probably won't need to change the rear gears.

jerry S · Sep 13, 2005

FallujahMedic said:
Well, my baby is almost completely stripped. The only things left to be pulled are the front and rear suspension, brake lines and front and rear glass. As soon as thats complete it will go down to Orlando to be media blasted and to have the floorpans, battery tray, trunk extensions and both rear quarters welded in. Any primer/prep advice?
Then its off to the machine shop with the 390. I'm thinking a stock rebuild, but with an upgrade to forged pistons/rods, an aggressive cam and swapping the stock heads/intake for new Edelbrock Performer RPM. Unsure of what type carb to add , Thoughts/ideas?
Also I'd like to add a T-5, but am unsure what I will need in the way of modifications. The car started out as your basic 302 with a 3-speed, manual steering, manual 4 wheel drum. And that brings me to my last mod idea, brakes. i like the "mustang steve" disc brake solution, but what about the rears? also what will I need to change as far as the master cylinder, etc.

Any thoughts, ideas, or experiences with a similar setup will be appreciated.

What would be really bad ass to do is stroke it to 429 and then add a cougar eliminator scoop on the hood along with Boss 429 emblems. Since you have it apart, and are putting a new cam in there, now is a really good time to consider a hydraulic roller cam conversion too. I had my block hot tanked and passed on the chance and now I kick myself every time I think about it. As for the carb, you need to settle on your other components first like your heads and cam. Flow the heads and then settle on the carb based on the flow tests. The T-5 won't make it. You need a Tremec TKO 500 at least. I did a 4 wheel power disk conversion. You need as much "whoa!" as you got "Go!" If you go from manual drums to power disks, you need all new booster, master cylinder, and a new brake pedal. Your pedal mounts to a bracket. You have to pull the bracket off and drill through it about one inch or so higher from the original mounting point. The bracket will be scored where you need to drill.

BullittFB · Sep 13, 2005

Currie sells the rear cobra brakes.
http://www.currieenterprises.com/cestore/ProductsRE.aspx?id=2085

Also check this rear suspension.
http://www.ridetech.com/productinfo/airbarstang.asp

In that same page click on MAGAZINE ARTICLES, then click where it says:
Mustang Performance: Finally a complete performance air suspension for the 64-70 Mustang.

67FBSCODE · Sep 13, 2005

A T-5 will not last behind a 390. If your going 5 speed you need to get a TKO 500-600. If you do that, I can give you a few pointers. I am all but finished installing a TKO-600 in my S code 67.

FallujahMedic · Sep 13, 2005

Keep the ideas coming, it sure is helping.

On the Transmission side of things, where can I get a used TKO? My original thought was to part out a late model GT for the T5, but I think you all are right, I need stronger. I'm not looking to race the car, but I do want something thats going to hold up.

What about timing, should I go gear or chain? How noisy is a gear drive? anything like a cogged belt?

69Rcode_Mach1 · Sep 13, 2005

Just stick to a double roller timing chain. Gear drives can be bought in a noisy or quiet version; however, the block will require machining to get the gear drive to fit. Depends on your budget.

D.Hearne · Sep 14, 2005

Forged rods? All 390's had forged rods. Your main focus in the bottom end should be on oiling, not the rotating assembly. The stock cast crank and forged rods are plenty tough as is,they're plenty strong to survive 6500-7000 rpms. back in the early 60's in Nascar, Ford learned that the oiling system was the weak link there. I third the advice on the choice of a T-5, they don't even hold up well to built 302's, a 390 would shred one in short order. Hydraulic roller cam conversion? Yea, go for it, if you can afford it in a 390.

FallujahMedic · Sep 14, 2005

Whats needed to improve the oiling system? Engines are not my forte', so believe my the advice is appreciated. My budget for the rebuild is $2,000 - $2,500, not including new heads and intake. I'd love to walk into the machine shop with a laundry list of tasks to do. What would you suggest based on that kind of budget?

67FBSCODE · Sep 14, 2005

definitely go with ARP rod bolts, have the rods resized,and with some oiling mods it will be good for 6500 RPM which is as high as you will need to go. if your going with the RPM Heads and intake I would buy the heads bare and have them completed by a competent machine shop with the springs needed for your cam. I wouldn't go with the RPM cam , there are better choices, comp 282s or 294s would be a couple. Its hard to beat an original holley cj carb. As far as the TKO, you can buy used or new. I would not recommend dark horse performance. That is where I got mine. I wouldn't buy a bicycle from them.

1320stang · Sep 14, 2005

Engine-wise, you need to assess what parts you have by giving us some part numbers off the engine you have, Heads, intake if stock, if after market, which one, crank, rods, block. Better yet, with the block check the bottom end for extrat ribbing near the mains, external ribs, etc. Take pics and post iff necessary. There are some decent FE heads out there, you might be able to save some bucks on the heads and put the money in somewhere else if you're looking for a stock type rebuild. One of these days you'll want more power and you might be a cam change and a set of Stage 2 Edels away from... MORE POWER!!! BWAHAHAHA!!!!!!

D.Hearne · Sep 15, 2005

FallujahMedic said:
Whats needed to improve the oiling system? Engines are not my forte', so believe my the advice is appreciated. My budget for the rebuild is $2,000 - $2,500, not including new heads and intake. I'd love to walk into the machine shop with a laundry list of tasks to do. What would you suggest based on that kind of budget?

The weak link in the 390's oiling system is it's small block Chevy like system. The passages are small and have sharp bends and the oil goes up to the lifter valley, then down around the cam bearings to the crank. Anything you can do to open them up and smooth out the corners will help. Also helps to restrict the flow to the heads by placing restrictors in the heads, under the rocker stands ( Holley #90 jets work there) I prefer a good high pressure pump ( not high volume) for FE's. A stock 428 CJ windage tray is a good finishing touch as well, but make sure you check the dipstick fit before buttoning up the bottom end, they tend to overide the tray when stuck down the hole, this can be fixed by trimming the tray. To get a better handle on what's needed, get the book "Ford Performance" by Pat Ganahl for starters.

Timmy · Sep 15, 2005

You can spend money quick on an FE build. I ended up spending 6K but I replaced everything from the radiator to torque converter. I reused my block, rods, crank, headers and PS pump(which was new).

390 block .040 over decked to zero
oiling mods (chamfered oil feed holes)
Standard 390 crank with 10/10 grind
SpeedPro forged pistons
Rods reconditioned
Compression is just over 10:1
Crane cam (dual pattern) 801
Crane adjustable rockers
Crane pushrods and lifters
New rocker shafts
Ebrock RPM heads
Ebrock PRM intake
Ebrock water pump
Windage tray
HV oil pump
Carter fuel pump
ARP bolts through out
MSD 8595 distributor
MSD high vibration coil
MSD 6AL
Top off with a Holley 770 Street Avenger

Max Power · Sep 15, 2005

I realize you are inclined to use an engine you already have, but there are a lot of positives for a stroked 351w based motor, probably to 408. Lotsa speed parts, fitting that tranny would be easier, more space under the hood, and probably cheaper in the long run.

FallujahMedic · Sep 16, 2005

Well, I'm headed down to NPD in Ocala today, I'll definitely be picking up that book, thanks D. Hearne.

Now if I can only find what vehicles came with a TKO, i'd be in business.

5.0ina66 · Sep 16, 2005

FallujahMedic said:
Now if I can only find what vehicles came with a TKO, i'd be in business.

Simple: none! AFAIK, none of the TKO-series trannys have ever been used in a production application. I know the TKO500/600s haven't been.
HTH
--Kyle

FallujahMedic · Sep 16, 2005

5.0ina66 said:
Simple: none!

damn

well, I spent $340.00 + in sheetmetal today, not a bad haul.

Here are some pics of the 390 and casting numbers.

Intake

casting number

head casting number

Block casting number

I'm sure one of you gurus can tell me what I've got.

FallujahMedic · Sep 16, 2005

I really need to take more pics, but this is right before I pulled the 302.

ddonaca351 · Sep 16, 2005

FallujahMedic said:
Well, my baby is almost completely stripped. The only things left to be pulled are the front and rear suspension, brake lines and front and rear glass. As soon as thats complete it will go down to Orlando to be media blasted and to have the floorpans, battery tray, trunk extensions and both rear quarters welded in. Any primer/prep advice?
Then its off to the machine shop with the 390. I'm thinking a stock rebuild, but with an upgrade to forged pistons/rods, an aggressive cam and swapping the stock heads/intake for new Edelbrock Performer RPM. Unsure of what type carb to add , Thoughts/ideas?
Also I'd like to add a T-5, but am unsure what I will need in the way of modifications. The car started out as your basic 302 with a 3-speed, manual steering, manual 4 wheel drum. And that brings me to my last mod idea, brakes. i like the "mustang steve" disc brake solution, but what about the rears? also what will I need to change as far as the master cylinder, etc.

Any thoughts, ideas, or experiences with a similar setup will be appreciated.

Well if you are not going to run a power adder, there is no need to run forged pistons. Modern hypereutectic slugs will be fine, and will weigh much less (read more power)... the lighter the recip assy the quicker the motor will rpm.

If you are thinking of buying rods or crank etc... you might look up flatlanderracing.com they have very good prices on stroker kits, etc.. from SCAT. (good U.S. made parts not cheap overseas junk like brand E and some others....)

Just .02
Dave-

EDIT: Oh and the perf rpm heads and intake are real good choices... again imho. Do have your machinist check the valve seats, sometimes they need to be just touched lightly with a stone to get a good seal... perils of mass production. But they flow real nice, and save some weight. Good choice.

Build up ideas. 69 fastback, 390FE w/ T-5

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