Car Breaks Up And Has No Power Over 2k Rpm

Ill cut to the chase quick on this one guys. There was a honda behind me at a light. I booted it to about 5 grand in first gear. Like I have done time and time again. I shifted to second and caught a quick red light. Car ran fine. Drove half a block to the drive thru. Still running fine. When I was leaving I felt as though the car was hesitating and didnt want to go above two grand. I parked the car and let it cool down as I had a few tow truck calls to do. So when I got back I did a quick once over checked all the wires, cap, all the visible electrical connections. Fired it up and same thing runs fine at idle with the car not moving it will rev over two grand but at the 2k rpm mark it will backfire through the exhaust roughly every few seconds. While driving it starts to break up at 1800rpm. So to the garage I went in fear of a bent valve or something along those lines. From what I can tell its not making any valve train noise. So this is what I did.

First thing is I pulled every plug- all plugs are text book perfect (light brown,normal electrode wear) except cylinder 8 which is black.
Next I performed a compression test all cylinders are between 148 and 155 psi. (only cylinder 4 was 155 psi) all cylinders held their pressure for at least 5 minutes.
now Im not sure if that rules out any valve train issues or not. My fears are as follows....
Bent pushrod?
Broken valve spring?
Collapsed lifter?
Rounded off cam loeb?
Injector failure?
Something in the ignition system?

I recently replaced the TFI module with one from advanced because it was $30 rather than the motorcraft one at $200 and take a week to get. I broke off the old one which is why I replaced it so Im not sure of symptoms of bad TFI module. But the car has run fine for 3 weeks after this. Also the car had a junk aftermarket msd coil which I understand have been known to cause problems. But why on one cylinder? I doubt its the coil. What other tests can I run? And no I have not ran the KOER codes.
 
Sounds like an ignition problem. I guess I would start by looking under the hood in a dark (at night) garage to see if there's any arching. TFI (even though you've already replaced it) and PiP would be my next targets.
 
Be sure that you cleaned the mounting surfaces for the TFI and used new heat sink compound. No heat sink compound and the TFI overheats and causes problems. Dump the codes and look for code 14, which is a PIP sensor failure.

Dump the codes: Codes may be present even if the Check Engine Light (CEL) isn't on.

Dumping the computer diagnostic codes on 86-95 Mustangs

Revised 26-July-2011. Added need to make sure the clutch is pressed when dumping codes.

Codes may be present even if the check engine light hasn’t come on, so be sure to check for them.

Here's the way to dump the computer codes with only a jumper wire or paper clip and the check engine light, or test light or voltmeter. I’ve used it for years, and it works great. You watch the flashing test lamp or Check Engine Light and count the flashes.

Post the codes you get and I will post 86-93 model 5.0 Mustang specific code definitions and fixes. I do not have a complete listing for 94-95 model 5.0 Mustangs at this time.

Be sure to turn off the A/C, and put the transmission in neutral when dumping the codes. On a manual transmission car, be sure to press the clutch to the floor.
Fail to do this and you will generate a code 67 and not be able to dump the Engine Running codes.

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If your car is an 86-88 stang, you'll have to use the test lamp or voltmeter method. There is no functional check engine light on the 86-88's except possibly the Cali Mass Air cars.

computer-self-test-connector-with-test-lamp-01-65-gif.gif


The STI has a gray connector shell and a white/red wire. It comes from the same bundle of wires as the self test connector.

89 through 95 cars have a working Check Engine light. Watch it instead of using a test lamp.

computer-self-test-connector-with-check-engine-light-01-65-gif.gif


The STI has a gray connector shell and a white/red wire. It comes from the same bundle of wires as the self test connector.


WARNING!!! There is a single dark brown connector with a black/orange wire. It is the 12 volt power to the under the hood light. Do not jumper it to the computer test connector. If you do, you will damage the computer.

What to expect:
You should get a code 11 (two single flashes in succession). This says that the computer's internal workings are OK, and that the wiring to put the computer into diagnostic mode is good. No code 11 and you have some wiring problems. This is crucial: the same wire that provides the ground to dump the codes provides signal ground for the TPS, EGR, ACT and Map/Baro sensors. If it fails, you will have poor performance, economy and driveablity problems

Some codes have different answers if the engine is running from the answers that it has when the engine isn't running. It helps a lot to know if you had the engine running when you ran the test.

Dumping the Engine Running codes: The procedure is the same, you start the engine with the test jumper in place. Be sure the A/C is off, and clutch (if present) is pressed to the floor, and the transmission is in neutral. You'll get an 11, then a 4 and the engine will speed up to do the EGR test. After the engine speed decreases back to idle, it will dump the engine running codes.

Trouble codes are either 2 digit or 3 digit, there are no cars that use both 2 digit codes and 3 digit codes.

Your 86-88 5.0 won't have a working Check Engine Light, so you'll need a test light.
See AutoZone Part Number: 25886 , $10
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Alternate methods:
For those who are intimidated by all the wires & connections, see Actron® for what a typical hand scanner looks like. Normal retail price is about $30 or so at AutoZone or Wal-Mart.

Or for a nicer scanner see Equus - Digital Ford Code Reader (3145) – It has a 3 digit LCD display so that you don’t have to count flashes or beeps.. Cost is $30.
 
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would it throw a code 14 KOEO? because in order for me to run the running codes I have to jump pin 30 on the comp. to ground because I have no nss on my old school t5. If it was the TFI/PIP is it possible to only make one cylinder the problem? I did use the supplied di-electric grease for the tfi and I cleaned the surface on the dizzy with brake cleaner prior to install.
 
A single cylinder PIP problem is very uncommon, it would most likely be due to a problem with the shutter wheel being bent or damaged.

A bad PIP will not always set code 14. When it does, you know the PIP has problems.

Code 14 - Ignition pickup (PIP) was erratic – the hall effect sensor in the distributor is failing. Bad sensor, bad wiring, dirty contacts.

The PIP is a Hall Effect magnetic sensor that triggers the TFI and injectors. There is a shutter wheel alternately covers and uncovers a fixed magnet as it rotates. The change in the magnetic field triggers the sensor. They are often heat sensitive, increasing the failure rate as the temperature increases.

The PIP sensor is mounted in the bottom of the distributor under the shutter wheel. In stock Ford distributors, you have to press the gear off the distributor shaft to get access to it to replace it. Most guys just end up replacing the distributor with a reman unit for about $75 exchange
 
Im going to pull the codes. I went and bought a set of plugs. Waiting on a good set of ford racing wires an OEM cap and rotor as well. Even though I have no distinct noises coming from the valvetrain I still believe its the valve train. Other than a bad wire I cant forsee any ignition problems that only effect one single cylinder. And I feel as though a bad injector would drown the plug. not coat it in dry soot.
 
Do a search for cylinder balance test under my user name if you seriously think you have a single cylinder related problem. The cylinder balance test is the same as an engine running code dump with a few extra steps, so it isn't a lot of extra work to do.
 
Ok pulled the codes, ive got a code 67-no nss code 81,82 tad and tab missing and a code 85 no charcoal canister. I had all these codes before and theyre all there for exactly that reason. I pulled the valve cover to investigate the valve train and everything looks text book perfect. I used my in line spark plug tester for cylinder 8 and its getting spark. With the new plugs in the car does the same thing. Im stumped now, because I dont want to have to start guessing with parts. Im on vacation now but Im gonna try a cap, rotor, and wires next. I also have a spare set of injectors so I may try to swap out cylinder 8.
 
Sounds like you skipped the cylinder balance test...

The following is for 5 speed cars only.
The NSS code 67 can be bypassed for testing. You will need to temporarily ground computer pin 30 to the chassis. Computer pin 30 uses a Lt blue/yellow wire. Remove the passenger side kick panel and then remove the plastic cover from the computer wiring connector. Use a safety pin to probe the connector from the rear. Jumper the safety pin to the ground near the computer.
Be sure to remove the jumper BEFORE attempting to drive the car!!!

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Cylinder balance test: use this to find dead cylinders:

Revised 25 March 2012 to add necessity allowing the KOEO tests to finish before starting the engine and the need for a properly functioning IAB/IAC to run the cylinder balance test.

The computer has a cylinder balance test that helps locate cylinder with low power output. You’ll need to dump the codes out of the computer and make sure that you have the A/C off, clutch depressed to the floor and the transmission in neutral. Fail to do this and you can’t do the engine running dump codes test that allows you to do the cylinder balance test.

Here's the way to dump the computer codes with only a jumper wire or paper clip and the check engine light, or test light or voltmeter. I’ve used it for years, and it works great. You watch the flashing test lamp or Check Engine Light and count the flashes.

Be sure to turn off the A/C clutch depressed to the floor, and put the transmission in neutral when dumping the codes. Fail to do this and you will generate a code 67 and not be able to dump the Engine Running codes.


Here's how to dump the computer codes with only a jumper wire or paper clip and the check engine light, or test light or voltmeter. I’ve used it for years, and it works great. You watch the flashing test lamp or Check Engine Light and count the flashes.

Underhoodpictures007-01.jpg


Underhoodpictures010.jpg


If your car is an 86-88 stang, you'll have to use the test lamp or voltmeter method. There is no functional check engine light on the 86-88's except possibly the Cali Mass Air cars.

attachment.php


The STI has a gray connector shell and a white/red wire. It comes from the same bundle of wires as the self test connector.

89 through 95 cars have a working Check Engine light. Watch it instead of using a test lamp.

attachment.php


The STI has a gray connector shell and a white/red wire. It comes from the same bundle of wires as the self test connector.


WARNING!!! There is a single dark brown connector with a black/orange wire. It is the 12 volt power to the under the hood light. Do not jumper it to the computer test connector. If you do, you will damage the computer.

What to expect:
You should get a code 11 (two single flashes in succession). This says that the computer's internal workings are OK, and that the wiring to put the computer into diagnostic mode is good. No code 11 and you have some wiring problems. This is crucial: the same wire that provides the ground to dump the codes provides signal ground for the TPS, EGR, ACT and Map/Baro sensors. If it fails, you will have poor performance, economy and drivability problems

Some codes have different answers if the engine is running from the answers that it has when the engine isn't running. It helps a lot to know if you had the engine running when you ran the test.

Dumping the Engine Running codes: The procedure is the same, you start the engine with the test jumper in place. Be sure the A/C is off, clutch depressed to the floor and the transmission is in neutral. You'll get an 11, then a 4 and the engine will speed up to do the EGR test. After the engine speed decreases back to idle, it will dump the engine running codes.

Trouble codes are either 2 digit or 3 digit, there are no cars that use both 2 digit codes and 3 digit codes.

Cylinder balance test

If you have idle or IAC/IAB problems and the engine will not idle on its own without mechanically adjusting the base idle speed above 625-750 RPM, this test will fail with random cylinders pointed out every time it runs. The IAC/IAB must be capable of controlling the engine speed to run in the 1400-1600 RPM range. Playing with the base idle speed by adjusting it upwards will not work, the computer has to be able to control the engine speed using the IAC/IAB.

Warm the car's engine up to normal operating temperature. Use a jumper wire or paper clip to put the computer into test mode. Let it finish the Key On Engine Off (KOEO) code dump. Start the engine and let it go through the normal diagnostic tests, then quickly press the throttle to the floor. Remember to keep the clutch pedal (5 speed) depressed to the floor during the test. The engine RPM should exceed 2500 RPM's for a brief second. The engine RPM's will increase to about 1450-1600 RPM and hold steady. The engine will shut off power to each injector, one at a time. When it has sequenced through all 8 injectors, it will flash 9 for everything OK, or the number of the failing cylinder such as 2 for cylinder #2. Quickly pressing the throttle again up to 2500 RPM’s will cause the test to re-run with smaller qualifying figures.
Do it a third time, and if the same cylinder shows up, the cylinder is weak and isn’t putting out power like it should. See the Chilton’s Shop manual for the complete test procedure


Do a compression test on all the cylinders.
Take special note of any cylinder that shows up as weak in the cylinder balance test. Low compression on one of these cylinders rules out the injectors as being the most likely cause of the problem. Look at cylinders that fail the cylinder balance test but have good compression. These cylinders either have a bad injector, bad spark plug or spark plug wire. Move the wire and then the spark plug to another cylinder and run the cylinder balance test again. If it follows the moved wire or spark plug, you have found the problem. If the same cylinder fails the test again, the injector is bad. If different cylinders fail the cylinder balance test, you have ignition problems or wiring problems in the 10 pin black & white electrical connectors located by the EGR.

How to do a compression test:
Only use a compression tester with a screw in adapter for the spark plug hole. The other type leaks too much to get an accurate reading. Your local auto parts store may have a compression tester to rent. If you do mechanic work on your own car on a regular basis, it would be a good tool to add to your collection.

With the engine warmed up, remove all spark plugs and prop the throttle wide open, crank the engine until it the gage reading stops increasing. On a cold engine, it will be hard to tell what's good & what's not. Some of the recent posts have numbers ranging from 140-170 psi. If the compression is low, squirt some oil in the cylinder and do it again – if it comes up, the rings are worn. There should be no more than 10% difference between cylinders. Use a blow down leak test (puts compressed air inside cylinders) on cylinders that have more than 10% difference.

See the link to my site for details on how to build your own blow down type compression tester.
 
Your right, I skipped the cylinder balance test. I acctually went on vacation so I hadnt had the time before I left. Thanks though for the diagram on the comp. connector. When I ground pin 30 I just ground it to a body screw by the computer?
 
Your right, I skipped the cylinder balance test. I acctually went on vacation so I hadnt had the time before I left. Thanks though for the diagram on the comp. connector. When I ground pin 30 I just ground it to a body screw by the computer?

That will work OK.

Just be sure you don't use a rusty or corroded spot for the ground.
 
Ill cut to the chase quick on this one guys. There was a honda behind me at a light. I booted it to about 5 grand in first gear. Like I have done time and time again. I shifted to second and caught a quick red light. Car ran fine. Drove half a block to the drive thru. Still running fine. When I was leaving I felt as though the car was hesitating and didnt want to go above two grand. I parked the car and let it cool down as I had a few tow truck calls to do. So when I got back I did a quick once over checked all the wires, cap, all the visible electrical connections. Fired it up and same thing runs fine at idle with the car not moving it will rev over two grand but at the 2k rpm mark it will backfire through the exhaust roughly every few seconds. While driving it starts to break up at 1800rpm. So to the garage I went in fear of a bent valve or something along those lines. From what I can tell its not making any valve train noise. So this is what I did.

First thing is I pulled every plug- all plugs are text book perfect (light brown,normal electrode wear) except cylinder 8 which is black.
Next I performed a compression test all cylinders are between 148 and 155 psi. (only cylinder 4 was 155 psi) all cylinders held their pressure for at least 5 minutes.
now Im not sure if that rules out any valve train issues or not. My fears are as follows....
Bent pushrod?
Broken valve spring?
Collapsed lifter?
Rounded off cam loeb?
Injector failure?
Something in the ignition system?

I recently replaced the TFI module with one from advanced because it was $30 rather than the motorcraft one at $200 and take a week to get. I broke off the old one which is why I replaced it so Im not sure of symptoms of bad TFI module. But the car has run fine for 3 weeks after this. Also the car had a junk aftermarket msd coil which I understand have been known to cause problems. But why on one cylinder? I doubt its the coil. What other tests can I run? And no I have not ran the KOER codes.
I had this exact same problem with mine a while back. I found that the inside of the distributor was coming apart. I swapped distributors and problem solved.
 
yep fuel pressure was 38psi KOEO I primed it a few times and it went to 45psi. I believe thats in spec. and I just found it odd that the only plug that looked chitty was plug 8. When I get home from texas im going to change the normal tune up parts (cap,rotor,wires) and While im there Ill take a peek at the internals of the distributor. As it stands now my problem has got to be ignition based or possibly and injector. So thats where im going. pearlnotchback How did you figure out it was the dizzy and what brand did you go with?
 
UPDATE! While I was on vacation in texas my old man was gonna do my cobra intake swap on my car, against my wishes because Im trying to figure out why the damn thing wont run right. So now I have yet another major setback. He snapped off the two back lower manifold bolts I dont know how but he managed to get the manifold off. But now there is only about 1/4 of inch nubs sticking out of the heads for the two farthest back lower manifold bolts. Any suggestions? I was going to buy a noid light to test my injectors but now I have yet another obstacle before figuring out what the hell is wrong with my car.
 
There may be enough of the bolt left to remove it with Visegrips. Spray it with PB Blaster or WD-40, and let it soak for a while. Then grab on to the stub with the Visegrips and twist.