Car stalling

[Kiknads]

Recently my car has started stalling somewhat randomly, usually just at idle speeds like when i start the car, and they *usually* go away after i've been driving for a while, but sometimes i'll be cruising along at around 80 km/h and it'll just die for a second or 2 or die completely

I used the test light thing and got this output

koeo 1, 8, 2, 8, 2, 1, 1, 8, 1, 8

koer 4, 1, 2, 1, 9, 4, 4, 4, 2, 1, 9, 4, 4, 4

The car it was tested on was an 87 5.0 with an automatic transmission, i've recently replaced the ignition pickup, the o2 sensors, and the coil

 

[super302]

My car would die when i was just cruisin around, turned out to be a shtty alternator, take it to autozone to have it checked if you can't do it yourself.
If it isn't that, then i don't know

 

[Kiknads]

If it was a ****ty alternator, wouldnt it still run off battery power?

This stalling thing is really starting to piss me off. It was doing it before, then i changed my o2 sensors and it went away, for about a monthI had to be the happiest man alive, then it started again, slowly, stalling as i'm driving, then starting up again, and it's progressed rapidly into sitting on the side of the road trying to start my car for upwards of half an hour before it'll finally decide to run long enough to get anywhere, its getting to the point where all i wanna do is take the damm thing to the shredder (mind you i wont but i sure wish i knew what the damm problem was)

 

[HISSIN50]

If it was a ****ty alternator, wouldnt it still run off battery power?

This stalling thing is really starting to piss me off. It was doing it before, then i changed my o2 sensors and it went away, for about a monthI had to be the happiest man alive, then it started again, slowly, stalling as i'm driving, then starting up again, and it's progressed rapidly into sitting on the side of the road trying to start my car for upwards of half an hour before it'll finally decide to run long enough to get anywhere, its getting to the point where all i wanna do is take the damm thing to the shredder (mind you i wont but i sure wish i knew what the damm problem was)

alt is probably not the culprit.

i cant decipher your codes, but i would be lookin at the TFI module. when they are on the way out, they die when hot, come back once cooled off. also higher rpm's and heat kill them.
it could be fuel pump too, as the symptoms are the same. the former is probably more likely. when someone deciphers the codes, that will probably shed some light.

good luck.

 

[Kiknads]

welp, the problem is even worse now, work's over, I jump in my car to go home, and it starts only to stall like 30 seconds later (while i'm putting on my seatbelt and faceplate) and it wont start at all now... I gave it a couple tries but after a couple sessions of 10 seconds of cranking all i got was a gassy smell coming out of the tailpipes... Before this, it would at least sound like it was gonna start before sputtering out and dying now it wont give me any indication of spark at all, guess it'll have to wait till morning

 

[HISSIN50]

well, you are on the right track. you smell fuel, so that is probably ok. for future reference, if you floor the pedal while cranking, it clears the flooding (cuts injector pulse).

i would look at the TFI and coil. next time it wont start, jump all over it with a DMM.
good luck.

 

[blk92stangg]

Try running the codes again. The codes should cycle at least twice, so if you get them right your pattern will repeats itself, which it doesn't seem to be doing now on your KOEO. Your KOER codes seems to be 21, 91, 44 since they repeat. But that doesn't explain the other numbers, so try em again. BTW, the cycle will be separated by a single pulse. Also, try using a voltmeter, since the ECU first sends out "fastcodes" that you don't use/can't read, but may be lighting up the testlight and messing with your codes.

 

[HISSIN50]

Try running the codes again. The codes should cycle at least twice, so if you get them right your pattern will repeats itself, which it doesn't seem to be doing now on your KOEO. Your KOER codes seems to be 21, 91, 44 since they repeat. But that doesn't explain the other numbers, so try em again. BTW, the cycle will be separated by a single pulse. Also, try using a voltmeter, since the ECU first sends out "fastcodes" that you don't use/can't read, but may be lighting up the testlight and messing with your codes.

good advice!
for clarity, i would add that it is best to use an analog voltmeter - digital will be funky to follow. with analog, you can follow the needle sweeps.
the little code scanners are nice to, for us guys with no CEL (i can listen for beeps while writing, picking my nose, etc).

good luck.

 

[jrichker]

Code 21 – ECT sensor out of range. Broken or damaged wiring, bad ECT sensor. Note that that if the outside air temp is below 50 degrees F that the test for the ECT can be in error.

The ACT & ECT have the same thermistor, so the table values are the same

ACT & ECT test data:

Use Pin 46 on the computer for ground for both ECT & ACT to get most accurate readings.

Pin 7 on the computer - ECT signal in. at 176 degrees F it should be .80 volts

Pin 25 on the computer - ACT signal in. at 50 degrees F it should be 3.5 volts. It is a good number if the ACT is mounted in the inlet airbox. If it is mounted in the lower intake manifold, the voltage readings will be lower because of the heat transfer.

Voltages may be measured across the ECT/ACT by probing the connector from the rear. Use care in doing it so that you don't damage the wiring or connector.

Here's the table :

68 degrees F = 3.02 v
86 degrees F = 2.62 v
104 degrees F = 2.16 v
122 degrees F = 1.72 v
140 degrees F = 1.35 v
158 degrees F = 1.04 v
176 degrees F = .80 v
194 degrees F = .61

Ohms measures at the computer with the computer disconnected, or at the sensor with the sensor disconnected.
50 degrees F = 58.75 K ohms
68 degrees F = 37.30 K ohms
86 degrees F = 27.27 K ohms
104 degrees F = 16.15 K ohms
122 degrees F = 10.97 K ohms
140 degrees F = 7.60 K ohms
158 degrees F = 5.37 K ohms
176 degrees F = 3.84 K ohms
194 degrees F = 2.80 K ohms

Code 82 – Secondary Air Injection Diverter Solenoid failure AM1. The secondary air diverter valve isn’t working on the Thermactor Air System (smog pump). Look for broken or missing vacuum lines on the solenoid valve to the diverter valve. Look for +12 volts at the Red wire and look for the Lt Green/Black wire to switch from +12 volts to 1 volt or less. The computer controls the valve by providing a ground path on the LT Green/Black wire for the solenoid valve.

Codes 94 & 44 - Check vacuum lines for leaks, & cracks. Disconnect the big hose from smog pump: with the engine running you should feel air output. Reconnect the smog pump hose & apply vacuum to the first vacuum controlled valve: Its purpose is to either dump the pump's output to the atmosphere or pass it to the next valve. The next vacuum controlled valve directs the air to either the cylinder heads when the engine is cold or to the catalytic converter when the engine is warm. Disconnect the big hoses from the back side of the vacuum controlled valve and start the engine. Apply vacuum to the valve and see if the airflow changes from one hose to the next.
The two electrical controlled vacuum valves mounted on the rear of the passenger side wheelwell turn the vacuum on & off under computer control. Check to see that both valves have +12 volts on the red wire. Then ground the white/red wire and the first solenoid should open and pass vacuum. Do the same thing to the light green/black wire on the second solenoid and it should open and pass vacuum.

Remember that the computer does not source power for any actuator or relay, but provides the ground necessary to complete the circuit. That means one side of the circuit will always be hot, and the other side will go to ground or below 1 volt as the computer switches on that circuit.

See the following website for some help from Tmoss (diagram designer) & Stang&2Birds (website host)

http://www.veryuseful.com/mustang/tech/engine/images/fuel-alt-links-ign-ac.gif

http://www.veryuseful.com/mustang/tech/engine/images/88-91eecPinout.gif

 

[Kiknads]

well, I took your advice and grabbed a new ignition module (2 actually, 1 from the wrecker and one from partsource) and it's stopped the stalling, but now it seems like its missing but if I take the spout connector out, it runs perfectly, could my timing be way off or could it be something else?

 

[Kiknads]

now that i think about it, could the ECT create the same problem?

does the gauge on the cluster and the ECU use the same sensor? because the one on the cluster seems to get to the same temperature it always has.... the 2nd line up from the bottom

 

[sirr0bin]

bump, interested in finding out as well

 

[Kiknads]

well, I retarded the timing, and the missing went away, guess it was just the timing

 

[HISSIN50]

now that i think about it, could the ECT create the same problem?

does the gauge on the cluster and the ECU use the same sensor? because the one on the cluster seems to get to the same temperature it always has.... the 2nd line up from the bottom

ECT's do get out of calibration.
ditto for ACT's. hence JR's nice list of values.

the gauge and puter use different sensors. the gauge sender is behind the dizzy on the drivers side lower intake. one wire.

the ECT is two wires, IIRC. pass side in a line.

good luck.

 

[Kiknads]

cool, thanks

 

[trendkilllx]

I am having the same problem. I replaced the ignition module, coil, fuel pump, plugs, cap and rotor. It just randomly dies and wont start for about 1/2 hour. I haven't ran the codes yet, can i just rent a scanner from checkers? Also which scanner should i get?