Paint and Body Choosing A Shop To Paint Your Mustang

[Davedacarpainter]

Ok, like I mentioned in the exploratory thread, I want to cover with you some of the things to consider in choosing a shop to paint your mustang.

At this stage we will assume that you have several reasons for handing off your vehicle for this process. It might be that you have no place to paint it yourself, or you aren't confident enough to do it on your own. Maybe you know your spouse might be less than thrilled with the fresh scent of polyurethane wafting though the house on a cool Saturday morning. Whatever your reasons are, here's some things to think about before dropping your car off with the unknown.

First thing is to look realistically at your mustang......I mean it, REALISTICALLY! How bad off is it? You might think that it's good other than that rot at the back of the quarters, right? Got any idea how deep that rot is? Got any idea of parts availability for your car? How many paint jobs DOES that old girl have?

Then decide what you want it to look like. Do you want a Riddler Award? Do you want a really nice daily driver? Do you want a different color? Do you want your engine bay freshened? Smoothed? Wire tucked?

Everything you want to have done to your car can be done, as the saying goes, "All it takes is money".

Let's face it, a complete paint job (and we're talking about body damage here as well) takes serious work. It also takes craftsman that have worked hard at being good at what they do. So when you hear that it can cost $5k to make your car look beautiful, don't pucker up so hard. In addition to the actual hands on by the technicians that will remake your car, there are cost. Like paint materials, that alone will be a grand or more of your money. Then there's all those little things that get broken on a 30+ year old car in the disassembly. New ones, if they can be found have to be bought. It's not that the tech was clumsy, plastic that old is brittle. I need new wiring harness clips for my dash, they cost $8 each. Times the six i need, that's almost 50 bucks just to hold some wires in place. You'll get a LOT of $50 purchases that are required.

A true show car restoration can cost you over $50k easily. So if you're looking for that quality, you will need very deep pockets.

Let's try to hang on to a nice paint job for now. Depending where you live it can run 3.5k to 6k.

The first thing I will be covering is what type of shop you need to be looking at for your paint job.

This ends the first post. I have to finally file my taxes for last year. The IRS wants me more than you guys at the moment. I'll cover shop selection tomorrow night.

 

[Davedacarpainter]

Ok, i actually just got my taxes filed and donated an extra $2300 to the federal government. Bright side is that now i can reckon that this money will go to replacing a MOAB and not security at some baboons late night show so some elected official can play hollywood. Yes, that does make me feel better. Bombs, not "btchin' dude".

Anywho, It's too late tonight, sorry. These post take me roughly 45 minutes to type out, and this cone head needs his sleep. So off to France, I'll update for real tomorrow.

 

[Davedacarpainter]

Ok, you want a paint job and so you look up bodyshops. So, after looking, how's that for a list?

You'll find two main types of shops that can refinish your car. Collision Repair and Custom paint shops.

That said, some Collision Repair facilities will also do custom work. How will you know if they do? Call them.

Listen for recommendations from the local mustang clubs. Do a little more here too, LOOK at some of their completed work. What's really nice to one person may in reality be a substandard product to another. Do your research, we're talking about your baby here that you're getting ready to drop a load of cash on. Spend a couple weeks to a month finding the right shop for you. Don't just drop your vehicle off with the closest shop to your house. Don't be afraid of traveling a little, but be wary of a shop outside your area. Study, study, study.

I, in general, don't recommend collision repair facilities for your complete paint job. Not that they have substandard technicians (I work in a collision shop, right?!). The focus of a collision shop is of course collision repair. These are the quick turn around jobs that will be in the shop from anywhere between 3 days to possibly a couple months for the biggest jobs that have to wait on parts from god knows where. Their focus is to move vehicles through as quickly and efficiently as possible. Sure, we do complete paint jobs, especially after a good hail storm. That is not the norm though. Believe me, I have the capability of painting complete paint jobs.

What difference does that make? Taking a car in for a complete paint job involves a serious amount more work than just replacing a quarter panel and a door. Plus, face it, our cars are getting old. Try taking apart your car and not snap some connector, or not find rust. A collision repair facility generally deals with cars that are ten years old or newer. Dry rot, rust and real wear have not had a chance to set in a serious manner. So in general, you have a group of techs that don't deal with those problems regularly. They may know how to do it, but are out of practice.

Think about it in shooting sports, who will hit a target quickly and accurately? Is it the guy that pulls out his .45 once every couple months to shoot a couple hundred rounds, or the guy that every day has it out running it through its' paces?

Another issue with a collision shop is that these days we're kind of slaves to the insurance companies. Which car gets put on the back burner? Is it your one time paint job that might pay the shop $5k, or the $2k job if done quickly will insure another fifteen will be sent their way?

A custom shop generally will be a smaller shop owned by a family. Though there are many small collision shops too. A custom shop wants to get your vehicle completed quickly too, yet with a realistic outlook on the timeframe. They deal with the complexities of complete restorations on a daily basis. They are the guys that do the work you want every day. They're the daily shooters, so to speak.

Of course there are the giant custom chain shops that can really move your car through too. You kind of loose the personal feel that way though, like the feeling that your car really matters to them. Face another fact guys, our cars are more than cars to us.

Let's say you've done your duty and have shopped around and looked at the end product on other vehicles from the shop. What's the first thing you'll confront in getting your particular car painted? The estimator. This is the guy or gal that will determine the initial repair costs of your car.

That will be the next topic, the estimator, estimates and technicians. We'll also talk a little bit about owners of shops too.

Time for beer

 

[5.0 Coupe]

I have had several cars painted, Maaco was one of my first experience, it looked good from 50 feet, up close it wasn't so nice, but what do you expect for less then $1000. I have since learned how to paint engine compartments, trunks, trim, etc., and I am about ready to attempt painting an actual car.
Good information on Collision and actual Auto Paint Shops, I find the Collision shops are somewhat cheaper, but the quality of the work (using similar Paint and Materials) is not so great.
Custom Paint Shops generally take longer, are more expensive, but in the end you get a car that sometimes looks better then it did new. The custom shops also seem to give you "credit", or discount for removing, trim, interior, etc., Collision shops not so much.

 

[Davedacarpainter]

This time we'll start off with getting an estimate and follow up with estimators that write these important documents and talk a bit about technicians and shop owners.

What's an estimate? An estimate is an educated guess on what you want done and what the shop will do and charge you to provide the desired results. Sometimes estimates are free (particularly at a collision shop), other times you might be charged a fee. Remember, the estimator is working and needs to make money to feed his family just like you. Don't squeal about a small fee when the estimator is doing his trade to give you a realistic view of how much it will cost to refinish your vehicle.

An estimate is also just that, it's an ESTIMATE. It doesn't necessarily cover all of the surprises that may arise during the disassembly process. You have to understand that the estimator is basing his estimate of repairs on what he sees visually without your vehicle being tore down. Even on new vehicles there are the "surprises" that lurk below the surface. Inner damage from a collision, sensors that break due to age and just need a small wack to break them apart, torn torque boxes, floor pans.

I say all of this to make you aware there will almost always be a supplement to the original estimate (more money). As your vehicle is disassembled, issues will be found. With our older mustangs you probably should expect some sort of rust, broken clips, twisting of the body that might need to have the frame pulled straight, etc.... to be found.

Don't just drop your mustang off and expect wonders and for it to cost exactly what the initial estimate costs. You know your vehicle, you might have an idea wether or not it's been in a wreck before, or you might already be aware of the rusted out floor pan. Just because the initial estimate didn't cover that damage, it doesn't mean you're going to sneak it by the shop and get it repaired for free. What will happen is that the estimator will give you a call later after the damage is found and will tell you how much it costs to fix it properly. Don't try to get it for free! A technician that does this work for a living will have to spend time to repair it. They have a life that requires money to live. We're not trying to scam you so we can afford a better whiskey or some other bs. We have bills to pay just like you. If they are repairing your stuff for free instead of making money from their learned skills, they go hungry.

Enough whining about that.

As said before, collision repair facilities really aren't prepared for restorations. If you need to have your frame pulled to make it straight again, a collision shop will need to find the old measurements and proper hook up points for the frame machine. If you need parts replaced the shop will have to find a vendor for those parts, etc...etc.... All of this extends the time your car is in the shop.

Every shop has a person or persons that orders the parts for the vehicles in the shop. If they are used to just going through dealerships to order new parts for new cars, they may not have the contacts needed to come up with the correct parts for your car. This means they may just come up with something that will just meet what is necessary. Our cars can be a btch at times for little stuff.

So, once you've chosen your shop based on your research, you have an estimate in hand and have decided to go ahead with the repairs and refinish, what do you do now? How do you save a buck or two?

First, when you're talking to the estimator see if the shop will give you a discount for tearing down your vehicle yourself. They should since they aren't having to remove and install these items. You'll have to decide what type of refinish you'll want, a color change, do you want the jambs painted, etc.... Depending on what you want, it should guide you on what you might need to tear down. You might be going for the full monty and need to drop off a shell with them with all of the fenders, bumpers doors off, or it could be as simple as removing lights, mouldings, trim, door handles and lock cylinders.

Keep in mind also that you may decide to get extra stuff done while it's there. Replacing glass? Mini-tub? Smoothing the engine bay? Subframe connectors? Torque box reinforcements? It all takes money.

A note on the estimators and how they effect the initial estimate. A collision estimator can write a fairly accurate estimate on your car if it's been rear ended. But a restoration? Unless he has worked in restoration, he'll most likely miss gobs of stuff required to repair your vehicle. You'll get many more phone calls with supplement requests for things need to be done.

You will get supplement requests. Be aware of that. There is always something that arises that was not expected by the estimator. It won't matter if it's a custom shop or collision. No one sees everything on a superficial examination of your vehicle. You'll just get less from a custom shop. Higher initial estimate, but less supplements.

Also keep in mind a supplemental request is just that. You can say no to that repair. Talk to the estimator about the repair so you can decide if it is important enough for you to fork over more of your money.

I've glazed over the technicians in an earlier post. You'll get an idea about there work from your initial study of the work produced by your chosen shop. Talk to your estimator about the shops techs and their experience. A tech that has worked on a thousand fox bodies and produces ok work is still not as good as one that's done a dozen and produces outstanding work. Find out a little about the people that will be working on your car.

Shop owners, this is my personal experience concerning independent shop owners. Appearance can mean a lot. If the shop owner looks dirty and has been working on cars, that's good. If he appears clean and professional, that's good too. If he appears to look like a business man on wall street wearing a pair of socks that costs as much as the rebuild of your transmission, walk away from them. Seriously, I know of a few shop owners that like to look like a million dollars. They're spending money frivolously that also keeps them from getting dirty in the shop with their techs. Restoration is a labor of love in reality. A shop owner that doesn't know in detail what his shop is doing won't really give a red rats' bunionhole about the details of your car, he doesn't love the job, he loves the money earned from it.

In the end you will get what you pay for after you've made your decision on your shop. If you finagle a $1500 paint job out of a shop, don't expect it to look like a $5k paint job.

I'll do a brief covering of materials in the next post along with some shop details while your car is there.

 

[Davedacarpainter]

Paint is paint, right? No, says the finger!

Why does some paint cost so significantly more than others?

Sure, there will be some mark up just because of a name. But that doesn't explain why Spies Hecker will cost seven or eight times what you can pay for a "value line".

Companies like Spies Hecker and Sikkens cost more simply because they are a better product. The colors are cleaner, the pearls mica chips are made sharper, the aluminum flakes in their metallics reflect light clearer, clear coats are deeper and more durable.

So, when you hunt out your shop, check who they use. A warning, just because they use Sikkens, it doesn't make them a better facility. A knowledgeable painter can do wonders, a scab can't make for a nice, detailed paint job that makes you breathless.

Techs aside, apples to apples, a shop using a better product such as Spies Hecker, Sikkens, House of Kolor has at the very minimum a good understanding of quality products and the desire for a superior end product. You can still get quality from the like of Sherwin Williams, Dupont or PPG (in that order), but the tech applying the materials comes into play far more than one that has Sikkens to spray, for an example.

Expect for the paint materials to run close to $1000 to $1500 for the best products.