Cranks but no start, weird noise w/ video

[mob]

Hey guys need help, I know I need to go over the cranks but no start checklist but wondering if anyone has any ideas. Long story short I am trying to start the car after sitting for about 2 years. I know I have fuel pressure, I am not sure if I have spark. I also installed a MSD 6al box. When I crank it makes this weird pop sound. I have open long tube headers so it sounds almost like a poof out of the headers, I can feel the pop in the floorboards. It doesnt sound like it is trying to start. I attached a video of it cranking to see if you guys have any ideas. And the popping sound isnt internal, It only started making this pop sound while cranking when I connected the ignition system.

YouTube - ‪May 29, 2011 9:23 PM‬‏

 

[Rick 91GT]

Sounds like the timing is off to be honest....

 

[BlackGT89]

Sounds like you are hitting on one cylinder maybe? Trace your spark and see if all of the plugs are getting spark (using insulated pliers to hold the wires if needed). If not that, maybe the injectors are acting up ?

If it has sat for a long time the lifters have probably bled down and your not getting full compression in those cylinders. When you get oil pressure back they should pump up.

 

[jrichker]

Putting the distributor back in and setting the timing.
Putting the distributor back in is fairly simple. Pull #1 sparkplug, put your finger in the sparkplug hole,
crank the engine until you feel compression. Then line up the TDC mark on the balancer with the pointer on the engine block.

The distributor starts out with the #1 plug wire lined up at about 12:00 with you facing it. Align the rotor to about 11:00, since it will turn clockwise as it slides into place.

Align the distributor rotor up with the #1 position marked on the cap, slide the distributor down into the block, (you may have to wiggle the rotor slightly to get the gear to engage) and then note where the rotor is pointing.
If it still lines up with #1 position on the cap, install the clamp and bolt. If not, pull it out and turn 1 tooth forwards or backwards and try again. Put the #1 spark plug back in and tighten it down, put the clamp on the distributor, but don't tighten it too much, as you will have to move the distributor to set the timing. Note that there is no such thing as one tooth off on a 5.0 Mustang. If it doesn't align perfectly with #1 position, you can turn the distributor until it does. The only problem is that if you are too far one way or the other, you can't turn the distributor enough to get the 10-14 degree optimum timing range.


Setting the timing:
Paint the mark on the harmonic balancer with paint -choose 10 degrees BTC or 14 degrees BTC or something else if you have NO2 or other power adder. I try to paint TDC red, 10 degrees BTC white and 14 degrees BTC blue.

10 degrees BTC is towards the drivers side marks.

Simplified diagram of what it looks like. Not all the marks are shown for ease of viewing.

ATC ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' '!' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' BTC
---------------- > Direction of Rotation as viewed standing in front of the engine.

The ' is 2 degrees.
The ! is TDC
The ' is 10 degrees BTC
Set the timing 5 marks BTC. Or if you prefer, 5 marks towards the driver's side to get 10 degrees.

To get 14 degrees, set it 7 marks BTC. Or if you prefer, 7 marks towards the driver's side to get 14 degrees.

The paint marks you make are your friends if you do it correctly. They are much easier to see that the marks machined into the harmonic balancer hub.

At this point hook up all the wires, get out the timing light. Connect timing light up to battery & #1 spark plug. Then start the engine.

Remove the SPOUT connector (do a search if you want a picture of the SPOUT connector) It is the 2 pin rectangular plug on the distributor wiring harness. Only the EFI Mustang engines have a SPOUT. If yours is not EFI, check for a SPOUT: if you don’t find one, skip any instructions regarding the SPOUT
Warning: there are only two places the SPOUT should be when you time the engine. The first place is in your pocket while you are setting the timing and the second is back in the harness when you finish. The little bugger is too easy to lose and too hard to find a replacement.

Start engine, loosen distributor hold down with a 1/2" universal socket. Shine the timing light on the marks and turn the distributor until the mark lines up with the edge of the timing pointer. Tighten down the distributor hold down bolt, Replace the SPOUT connector and you are done.

The HO firing order is 1-3-7-2-6-5-4-8.
Non HO firing order is 1-5-4-2-6-3-7-8

 

[FoxRacer045]

Dose sound like timing!

 

[mob]

Alright guys I am seriously stumped. I need help. I was almost positive I did the timing right but I took the dizzy out again and made sure I got it right this time. I just turned the motor till the timing mark was on TDC on the balancer and lined up the rotor with the number one plug. Thats it right? I dont have to worry about it being on the compression stroke or whatever as long as the timing mark is at TDC right?

Second I know I have spark. I bought a spark plug tester and I have spark at the coil and the wires has spark as well. Joe does this eliminate the PIP sensor and TFI module?

I also have fuel, but I am not entirely sure the fuel is getting into the motor. The pump runs and I have 40psi at the lines. I guess I cant see anything past the regulator but it is not leaking or anything. The regulator is a holley unit that I bought used, could this be the culprit?

Also I do not have a noid light but I hooked up a test light to one of the injector connectors and while cranking the car, my test light comes on but the light is VERY VERY dim. I am not sure if my injectors are firing, maybe not getting enough voltage? What could cause that?

I also did a resistance check on all my grounds to the battery and they are all good grounds.

 

[mob]

Ok so I think my problem is I am not getting fuel into the motor. I got another video of me trying to crank it. This time I sprayed carb cleaner down the intake and tried to fire it up, I got one solid pop at the end, it was really loud, kind of scared me, the garage smelt like burnt brake cleaner, so it seems like I am not getting fuel.

YouTube - ‪Ch‬‏

I am scared of it being something related to the computer, I had changed the computer in this car while it was down. I also removed a viper alarm system that was installed by the previous owner, but I hooked up all the wires back where they were supposed to go.The only thing that I didnt know about was the alarm system connected to some wires that looked like they were tapped into a couple relays up in the dash board on the passenger side, they had pink wires coming out of them, not sure what they are for but I removed the system and connected the wires back together.

Also would like to note that I have 12v going to the red injector wires with key on.

 

[BlackGT89]

I'm not sure what that last pop was, but I don't hear it trying to hit like it was before. And you DO have to be on the compression stroke on #1 cylinder. A quick way to find that it to either hold your finger over the spark plug hole or plug the hole with a paper towel and wait for it to blow out. Otherwise you will be trying to fire on the exhaust stroke.

 

[mob]

That pop I think was it igniting the carb cleaner I sprayed in. It never made that pop sound before, only when I sprayed the carb cleaner down the intake. I hope that it's was because it sounded really loud and weird, but i do have open headers so I can imagine I am going to get all kinds of crazy sounds out of there.

Looks like I am going to have to take the dizzy out again and re-do the timing.

I still think my problem is my injectors not firing. When I hooked up my test light to the injector harness it would come on very dim, and stay on, I dont remember it flashing. Tomorrow I'm going to mess with the 10 pin connectors and check the resistance of the injector wires to the computer. I am starting to think something may be wrong with this computer.....?

 

[Black1987]

Man, this happened to me today. I was working on my 95 fobra today and sprayed starter fluid into the intake because the fuel wasn't to good from sitting 2 years. Got that loud pop, and it scared the crap out of me. I was told by a fellow mechanic the loud pop was the enigne was leaned out on crank (wasn't getting fuel). Check over your grounds and power at the fuel pump. You mentioned you are running open headers, are your O2s hooked up? Good Luck!

 

[mob]

Hey guy I still need help getting this thing running. I have figured out that my injectors are not firing. I am wondering if anyone has any suggestions. I have checked the wires going to the injectors to a 12v source and it is a strong connection, and also to the computer pins and also has a strong connection. I have replaced the distributor and also has a new pickup and tfi module.

It sounds like it may be firing one or two cylinders, and when I hook up a test light to the injector plugs some of them have no voltage at all and some will just barely light up the test light, looks like it is getting .5-1V, very very dim, and it does not flash, it stays lit. Does anyone have any suggestions? Any relays or anything that could have gone bad? Is the last thing to check the computer? I replaced the computer with a reman, could having the wrong computer cause the car to not start?

 

[jrichker]

Check the computer power ground...

The picture shows the common ground point for the battery , computer, & extra 3G alternator ground wire as described above in paragraph 2. A screwdriver points to the bolt that is the common ground point.

The battery common ground is a 10 gauge pigtail with the computer ground attached to it.
Picture courtesy timewarped1972

Correct negative battery ground cable.

3.) The computer has its own dedicated power ground that comes off the ground pigtail on the battery ground wire. Due to its proximity to the battery, it may become corroded by acid fumes from the battery.
In 86-90 model cars, it is a black cylinder about 2 1/2" long by 1" diameter with a black/lt green wire.
In 91-95 model cars it is a black cylinder about 2 1/2" long by 1" diameter with a black/white wire.
You'll find it up next to the starter solenoid where the wire goes into the wiring harness.

 

[slow87GT]

it sounds like the distributer is 180 off

if I remember right, the injectors get 12v all the time and the pulse comes on the ground side. get a noid light or 194bulb with some jumpers and check pulse while cranking

sounds like you are 180 off though

 

[mob]

The timing is not off. Like I said I hooked up a test light to the injector plugs and some of them will not light up at all and some will just barely light up the test light like it is getting .5-1V, just a very very dim light. I know my injectors are not getting power, and I know I have a good 12v source to th red wires, it seems like the computer is not grounding them. I am going to check the computer ground like Joe said, I really hope it is not the comptuer itself. Just seeing if there were any other relays or something that could cause the injectors not to fire.

 

[BlackGT89]

Clean your computer ground as mentioned above. If that doesn't do it have a look at your ten pin connectors. They relay a lot of messages to and from the computer, especially the injectors. Take them apart and clean them as mentioned in the link below. Don't break the connector clasps, I believe you have to squeeze or pinch them to get them to release.

Cleaning the 10 Pin connectors on a Mustang | The Mustang Stop

 

[mob]

I've "looked" at my 10-pin connectors, but they just look like 10-pin connectors, I am not sure what I am looking for...no wires are broken, the connectors look like they are making good contact...

I tested the grounds at the computer today and realized the ground I had for the computer had too much resistance, so I ran a wire straight from that point to the battery. I think I am one step closer but still will not start. The car sounds like it is ABOUT to start but just will not stay running by itself. At least I can for sure rule out the computer ground is bad. I checked resistance from the battery to the computer pin grounds and there is no resistance so the grounds are perfect.

I put a volt meter on the injector plugs while trying to crank the car. I was only able to reach cylinders, 1,2,4, and 6 but all four of those injector plugs had the same voltage readings. While trying to crank with throttle closed they would remain at a constant 2V, no flashing or anything, constant. When I opened the throttle the voltage would drop to around .18V. Not sure why voltage would drop while opening the throttle.

Not even sure what else to look at. Is the computer suspect? I'm gonna post some videos on a minute when they upload.

EDIT: Heres the video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4L8XPjNt3M

 

[mob]

I guess tomorrow I am going to take apart and clean the 10-pin connectors and try to spread them out a little like that site says to do, if that doesnt do it I think I am going to just swap out this computer.

EDIT: now that I think about it the injectors connect to the computer through the 10-pin connectors. I checked resistance from the injector plugs to the pins on the computer and they all had a solid connection so the connection at the 10-pins has to be good.

 

[jka]

Have you checked your fuel pressure / pump because it sounds like you have fire... but no fuel. That pop you hear could be a lean pop.

 

[jrichker]

The red wires on the injectors should have 12 volts on the anytime the ignition is in the Run position. Measuring the voltage on the computer side of the wiring isn't going to work using a voltmeter. The voltage is a pulse that goes from 12 volts to 1 volt or less. You can only accurately measure it using an oscilloscope or expensive graphing DVM.

 

[mob]

Ok thanks Joe, that makes sense, I know the red wires do have 12v in the run position.

Could a bad fuel pressure regulator cause this?

Joe should I try a noid light rather than my test light? Or would it be the same. Cause I got the same result when using the test light, it seems like there is very low voltage at the plug and the light stays lit, not flashing.