Daily Driver Insurance - Suggestions???

gevalia · Jul 5, 2005

Just bought a 66 Fastback (restored not modified) and I'm having trouble finding an insurance company that will insure it. Because I want to use it as a daily driver. My insurance company and Hagerty will not insure it if driven daily.

Now I know there are plenty of people driving these cars every day. Can someone suggest a decent company to me?

Thanks,
Ron

Pakrat · Jul 5, 2005

The only thing I can suggest is that you don't just settle for one since you are having trouble, be sure to find a company that will offer you an AGREED VALUE policy otherwise should you get in an accident you'll be screwed. Spend the money on an appraisal as well so you'll know exactly what that VALUE should be and remember to bump up the value a little each year when you renew so it stays current. Be prepared though, this type of policy isn't going to be cheap. I think State Farm used to offer an A-V policy at one time. All I know is in the long run it's a lot cheaper to buy a second POS beater and get a garage and stick with Hagerty, that's what I did.

5.0StangRacer · Jul 5, 2005

quite a few threads on this in Talk section (just FYI dont know if they'll help) good luck

Cobain03 · Jul 5, 2005

i've got a bud that uses his 66 coupe as a DD. i will ask him tonight for ya

Cobain03 · Jul 5, 2005

he said he uses allstate or statefarm. he forgot haha. it helps if you have another car listed too

DarkBuddha · Jul 5, 2005

There have been numerous threads on this, but I can't remember when the last one was and if the April lost back-up issue deleted the old threads. Do a search and you might have some luck.

Anyway, no "collector car" insurance company is gonna be able to help you. As Pakrat said, you definitely want an agreed value policy. AGREED VALUE ONLY!!! Do not accept anything less. Some insurance companies will do STATED VALUE, WHICH IS BASICALLY WORTHLESS IF THE CAR IS ACTUALLY DAMAGED because they still see the "actual cash value" of the car as being some 35+ year old car. Stated value only means that the cost of any repairs will not exceed that value. So AGREED VALUE OR NOTHING.

BTW, Statefarm did an agreed value policy for me in Seattle at a value of $12000 and it was something like $700/year, which seems reasonable considering my wife's '03 Corolla is closer to $840/year. We're clean as can be too... both over 30, married, not one ticket between us in over 8 years, no accidents, etc..., Seattle is just pricey.

Hope this helps...

bsedwebt70-5.0 · Jul 11, 2005

Insurance adjuster here - I have regular old "full coverage" (comprehensieve, collision, liability) on my 70 fully done car with 250 deductibles - it is very cheap to insure with the company I have been insured with for 15 years. I settle claims on a daily basis - sometimes on antique cars - If there is a total loss or repair question - insurance adjusters are not out to get you - we understand the value of older cars and a lot of us are hobbists too. I know pretty much when I see a car if it is totalled or not or basic value based on my experience - if it is questionable I will run it by the boss and we will send out an independant appraiser who will establish a fair market value - if the customer disagrees he will then hire his own independant appraiser for about 100-150.00 and then the tow independants fight it out - if neither can agree to meet in the middle a third independant appraiser is called in and the cost is split between the insurance company and the customer and that independant appraisal is final - he may say higher or lower or somewhere in the middle. This almost never happens - In VA (I don't know all state laws) we owe fair market value (what you should be able to replace the car for realistically - not what you paid or have put into it) I know I have put more money in my car than it is worth but if mine gets totalled I would expect closer to 20k vs. the 25-30k I have put into it. Those specialty "stated value" or "agreed value" policies have sticky little fine print things stuck in there that may tell you that there is no coverage if you have a loss while driving the car to the grocery store - If you intend to use the car you also have to think about liability for the other fellow you may hit. Bottom line - Insurance companies have to pay the right dollar for the car whether it be a 65 mustang or a 2003 corrolla.

DarkBuddha · Jul 12, 2005

bsedwebt70-5.0 said:
Insurance adjuster here - I have regular old "full coverage" (comprehensieve, collision, liability) on my 70 fully done car with 250 deductibles - it is very cheap to insure with the company I have been insured with for 15 years. I settle claims on a daily basis - sometimes on antique cars - If there is a total loss or repair question - insurance adjusters are not out to get you - we understand the value of older cars and a lot of us are hobbists too. I know pretty much when I see a car if it is totalled or not or basic value based on my experience - if it is questionable I will run it by the boss and we will send out an independant appraiser who will establish a fair market value - if the customer disagrees he will then hire his own independant appraiser for about 100-150.00 and then the tow independants fight it out - if neither can agree to meet in the middle a third independant appraiser is called in and the cost is split between the insurance company and the customer and that independant appraisal is final - he may say higher or lower or somewhere in the middle. This almost never happens - In VA (I don't know all state laws) we owe fair market value (what you should be able to replace the car for realistically - not what you paid or have put into it) I know I have put more money in my car than it is worth but if mine gets totalled I would expect closer to 20k vs. the 25-30k I have put into it. Those specialty "stated value" or "agreed value" policies have sticky little fine print things stuck in there that may tell you that there is no coverage if you have a loss while driving the car to the grocery store - If you intend to use the car you also have to think about liability for the other fellow you may hit. Bottom line - Insurance companies have to pay the right dollar for the car whether it be a 65 mustang or a 2003 corrolla.

I was told explicitly by both Allstate and USAA that the vehicle is considered a total loss (i.e. "totalled") if the damage exceeds whatever their "book" indicates for the vehicle and they don't consider whether it is a collectible or not, or if it has been modified/restored to an unusually high standard. Is this not true then? They also said they wouldn't pay a value beyond what their "book" said for the totalled vehicle, thus the reason for availability of agreed value policies.

Also, when I had my agreed value policy with Statefarm, I was completely explicit about using the car as a daily driver. They didn't blink. Simply asked the amount of value I'd like and gave me a premium amount. They did ask for pictures of the vehicle to keep on file and that I update the pics if I did further updates/restoration to the car.

Finally, why the hell isn't any of this insurance stuff clear??? I know they're out to make money, but does that mean they have to mislead us, or outright lie, just so we'll buy excessive amounts of insurance to pad their bottom line??? Correct me if I'm wrong here, but their only goal isn't simply to pay out less than they take in, but rather to actually not pay out anything at all. Sounds like a scam to me...

Pakrat · Jul 12, 2005

Yeah no personal offense bsedwebt70-5.0 as maybe you are the one exception to every rule but in my recent experience adjusters are just about slightly less scummy than the lawyer I had to hire to finally get what was right. They down right insulted me with what they thought it would cost to replace my car when they were so eager to take the easy route and total it on me. The so called "comparable" car they used for fair market value was nothing of the sort. There was no sympathy or understanding what so ever they just wanted to pay as little as possible plain and simple. Bottom line is they knew exactly how low they could short change me so that it would not be worth my while to sue them and proably net less than the offer. As I had no intention of settling thru my insurance for somone else's mistake I got a lawyer for the personal injury portion and am more than making up for the difference. Now that they know the other end will be paying out an extra 5 figures instead of the 4 from them, they have suddenly developed a conscience and it's too friggin late as I am the one without one now. Sadly the few times you might really need to cover your arse do not make up any where near for what you pay, it might as well be like the old days when you pay the mob for so called "protection".

DarkBuddha · Jul 12, 2005

Pakrat said:
Yeah no personal offense bsedwebt70-5.0 as maybe you are the one exception to every rule but in my recent experience adjusters are just about slightly less scummy than the lawyer I had to hire to finally get what was right. They down right insulted me with what they thought it would cost to replace my car when they were so eager to take the easy route and total it on me. The so called "comparable" car they used for fair market value was nothing of the sort. There was no sympathy or understanding what so ever they just wanted to pay as little as possible plain and simple. Bottom line is they knew exactly how low they could short change me so that it would not be worth my while to sue them and proably net less than the offer. As I had no intention of settling thru my insurance for somone else's mistake I got a lawyer for the personal injury portion and am more than making up for the difference. Now that they know the other end will be paying out an extra 5 figures instead of the 4 from them, they have suddenly developed a conscience and it's too friggin late as I am the one without one now. Sadly the few times you might really need to cover your arse do not make up any where near for what you pay, it might as well be like the old days when you pay the mob for so called "protection".

That's more like what I'm used to hearing in every real claim I've ever heard about when done with a normal insurance company (i.e. not a collector insurere like Haggerty or the like).

Pakrat · Jul 12, 2005

Yeah and that was the rub really, I have Hagerty and they were prepared to pay out with no question (or deductables) but I just could not see using them when I was the victim and the guilty party had his own insurance. They do not make it easy for you to stand on the side of just and right and not many have the will to stick to their principles even at a loss in the end.

bsedwebt70-5.0 · Jul 16, 2005

like I said earlier - I am in VA and we are required to give fair market value - I talked to other claims adjusters this week from Farm Bureau, Progressive, etc... and they said the same thing - I even talked to a manager - he stated if they have an older car he will search Hemmings, Trader, etc... and compare quality etc... and use that - if that does not work they will resort to the independant appraisal route exactly the way I said. I have been an insurance claims adjuster for 11 years and have always done it just this way and have the approval of management as do all the other adjusters I have talked to in my company and others. You may have been talking to an AGENT or AGENCY to get the stated value answer stuff - AGENCY people sell policies and do not SETTLE CLAIMS like the claims department does. It is true that insurance companies make money by taking in money and giving out less in return but they base rates on a risk/return relationship - not on "taking advantage" of people - If they did they would not be in business for very long as nobody would see them as being "FAIR" as REQUIRED BY LAW!!!! Insurance companies base rates on risk and invest the money and make most of their profit from investments - not payout ratios.

PoliceInterceptor · Jul 16, 2005

See, the thing is documentation, if you got the documentation to get the agreed value policy; you got the documentation to get the agreed value without the "agreed" policy. Also, nearly every "agreed value" policy I've ever seen has a clause in it that says to effect "if the vehicles overall condition isn't changed" so you need to keep that appraisal updated every 6 months to a year. (Most appraisal companies will update it for a smaller fee that the first one)

As a general rule, all a stated value (estimated value, settle on ACV) really does is allow the company to collect premium for the estimated value.

Biggest thing is people don't read and understand their coverage until something happens, and then the insurance company or the employee is "scummy" when in effect the policyholder is uneducated about their coverage. People will spend weeks researching a new manifold before purchase and inspect it closely to make sure it’s what they want before they use it, but they don't research insurance, and then read the policy and ask any questions after they receive it.

Daily Driver Insurance - Suggestions???

gevalia

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