Damn economy!

onlyme · Oct 8, 2008

"People like to talk about the greed and irresponsibility of the executives who are causing all of these problems . . . Here is a bit of proof backing up those sentiments. washingtonpost.com

For those of you who don't feel like reading it, here are the cliff notes:

The $85 billion you and I are paying for to rescue AIG is going toward supporting the executives' mega rich lifestyles and they aren't even trying to hide it. 70 of their top execs took a small piece of their bailout bonuses and funded a nice $440,000 week spa trip. They're even paying their used-to-be CEO $1 million per month just in case they need to ask him for advise."

That's messed up , especially when we are the ones have to bail them out. It's like that saying the rich get richer, yea at our costs to, that's backwards . My brother in law just lost his job also and he had a nice cushy job at some big factory that has to do with airplanes. The company is closing its doors and moving to Mexico.

kanicas · Oct 8, 2008

97speedster said:
Lost my job last Monday and this is the first time in 20 years that I am skeptical about finding something else. I also work in the housing industry as a Superintendent and it might mean I have to shed a few extra pounds and go back into the Army to support my family and I have been out for 13 years!

Very sorry to hear that.

Black95GTS · Oct 9, 2008

onlyme said:
"People like to talk about the greed and irresponsibility of the executives who are causing all of these problems . . . Here is a bit of proof backing up those sentiments. washingtonpost.com

For those of you who don't feel like reading it, here are the cliff notes:

The $85 billion you and I are paying for to rescue AIG is going toward supporting the executives' mega rich lifestyles and they aren't even trying to hide it. 70 of their top execs took a small piece of their bailout bonuses and funded a nice $440,000 week spa trip. They're even paying their used-to-be CEO $1 million per month just in case they need to ask him for advise."

That's messed up , especially when we are the ones have to bail them out. It's like that saying the rich get richer, yea at our costs to, that's backwards . My brother in law just lost his job also and he had a nice cushy job at some big factory that has to do with airplanes. The company is closing its doors and moving to Mexico.

I disagree with blaming executives in companies that make a lot of money. It would be easy; we should let them rot. The reason they are able to still do this is because our government subsidizes them. Supposedly we control that. If someone came up to you and asked if they could pay you 1 million dollars a month to hold you on retainer you would say no?

Its a capitalist society, in a free market. It only goes to crap when the government gets involved. In a true free market, all of these people would be out of jobs and the market would straighten itself out. But when you have a government that comes in and props up failing segments of a market, we are now acting like socialists. It's crap. The bail out plan is the biggest economic failure of our government I've seen during my lifetime.

In 1998, Bill Clinton FORCED Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, etc to make these mortgages that they KNEW were bad, but Mr. Clinton decided that its every American's right to own a home. And when Mr. Clinton used the GOVERNMENT to influence the FREE MARKET, it is now the GOVERNMENT'S responsibility to these companies.

To his credit, Bush tried three times in 2001, 2002, and 2003 to impose regulation but was shot down by both Democrats and Republicans. EVERYONE was getting fat and happy at this government created, but non-regulated monstrosity.

So when you have companies that are Capitalist when they make profit, but can act like Socialists when they run a deficit, you get these obscene profits. There is literally no risk! And now with the government propping this BS up, there is even less of a risk! I am kicking myself for not getting the 400K mortgage I was pre-approved for out of school and going into deficit, I would be free and clear. But I have been a sucker, have payed rent on time every month, and have been saving a down payment.

Adam

Zero Signal · Oct 9, 2008

I don't disagree with their pay, only their actions. If I knew how, I would make bazillions of dollars any way I could get away with, but I would do it knowing the resentment people have toward people like me. Would I buy a lavish mansion and a bunch of retardedly expensive cars? Probably. Would I go out and spend frivolously amidst widespread economic hardship and potentially serious recession knowing very well that my actions are being scrutinized and that I will be questioned but only slapped on the wrist WHEN they find out because? Probably not.

It's one thing to sucker people to get rich, I get that, I would do it if I knew how. It's another thing to show them that they're being suckered. They made poor decisions, too much risk, but they were already rich so it didn't matter. Now they get a nice huge chunk from the people because it's argued that them going down would hurt us more than everyone in the country handing them a few hundred bucks would. Meanwhile, most other companies are forced to sell assets and shrink far enough to become profitable in a matter of weeks/months.

As far as government interfering, I don't have much opinion on it since it WAS done before with success, but the free market ideals do hold. Economists with PHDs who do nothing but think and write about these things can't agree on it, so I have no basis for opinion over them. We just have to make some bets and cross our fingers.

I have a feeling that the people who could never afford their houses are still going to lose them. I'm pretty sure the people aren't getting bailed out, they're only going to be given the tools to make more reasonable financing possible. So when they get that financing and still can't afford it, it's back to the apartments with them and the responsible and safe borrowers will step back in once they can get the credit.

Zero_chance · Oct 9, 2008

My full time job is a Ford tech and business is definitely a lot slower now than when I started 5 years ago but were a very small dealership so we trimmed the little fat there was to be trimmed and we kind of get by. Im flat rate with a 30 hour guarantee. Usually do pretty good in the summer spring and fall but when winter comes, all of our customers go to Florida so its 30 hours a week pay for me. Luckily Ive been at Advance since this February and moved up to a part time assistant manager. Do pretty good only working part time there and the good thing is that when dealerships slow down for repairs, most people are starting to do the work themselves, which means by other job gets busy. Still a little wary but Ill just go back to school if I have to. Hopefully I can keep both jobs going for one more year. By then my car will be paid off, my TV will be paid off and I can get basic insurance. Thatll be 600 extra dollars a month in my pocket.

ProKiller · Oct 9, 2008

theres been a lot of corporate mails going around lately. the company has clenched its wallet tighter than a dolphins butt hole. no spending, no new hires, no travel, no new contracts. and just an hour ago another one went out saying that all third party contracts won't be renewed, which makes me scared as hell being a contractor. i'm getting my resume ready tomorrow and out there...

Mustang5L5 · Oct 9, 2008

We were told today to not expect any raises when our reviews come up this December. I kinda figured i'd be hearing that.

All things considered...as long as they still give me a paycheck..i'll be fine

blksn955.o · Oct 9, 2008

I am not a fan of the gov. bailout...I see the reason on a LARGE scale but my core ideals say the the failures happen to cut the fat and give the world the meaning of bad deal making. The fine line is what is for the greater good and what is rewarding the ones who really caused this?

That said, in the end everyone is to blame. The companies for providing a product at such volume no one knew what the quality is/was. The middle men LO/brokers/FA's and even companies that sought to make money by investing in the mortgages because all they saw was the interest %. Making a commission was more important that doing the job correctly.

The borrowers who chose to not pay attention and live beyond the means they had because the "Jones"s" have that...because well I want, I want...oh I can get.

To the gov. for having already to much influence to have put things in place to punish those of the nation that "get it" for those that just went and "got it" with out thinking.

Not everyone is a 400 credit score, $15hr job, $350k mortgage having poster child. There are those that simply have had bad luck, illness, poor timing and are suffering...that is the tragedy.

Everyone is to blame...it sucks but in the end. Even if by the very long and damn near impossible chance we do have a "depression"...come on I do not equate that to anything happening now...just shows how weak willed, childish, and really stuck on ourselves we have become. Those that made it through the great depression did not burst into flames or explode...they lost items that could and did get replaced. That lesson is lost on far to many people.

No one ever seems to ask the question...maybe the "Jones's" are not happy and the biggest reason they are not happy is the things they own...OWN them.

Zero_chance · Oct 9, 2008

This post jinxed me! My service manager and a salesmen both got laid off and a meeting today revealed things are worst than we were lead to believe.

95&03GT · Oct 9, 2008

I work for the GOVERNMENT to its the Air Force, Right now Im getting ready to return home after 7 months of Iraq. We were attached to the Army let me tell you thats a different world. I was here in 05, 06, 07, and almost all of 08. And I will be back in 09. SUCKS. But I it means I have a job.

fasterthanthem said:
My job really isn't hurting at all. I work 15 days a month, 12 hour shifts.

OH YEAH.. that's right.. I work for the government.. :-( BOO ME.

Mustang5L5 · Oct 10, 2008

Just have that resume ready to go on Monster or Careerbuilder.com that's all.

I wonder if i should get a second job?

On the other hand...i have $5K ready to throw at the market when we finally see a bottom....and hopefully not at 0

I don't think we'll see a Depression. The Depression was more of a result of bad policy by the Hoover administration. When the market's crashed, the gov't hoarded money, raised taxes and made cuts. Now the gov't is throwing billions of money into the system. Does it suck? yes, but we already know what happened when the gov't just let the banks fail.

Also, 9000 banks failed in the depressio. We've only had 13 go and 117 on the watch list. Plus we also have FDIC which wasn't around then and our GDP has only decreased by 1% and expected to go as far as 2%

So yes, this ride is gonna suck for a lot of people and credit won't be like it was before with 0% down mortgages and being able to finance anything you can imagine...but let be realistic here. Did you think it was going to last? The Housing market just got out of control. The average HOUSEHOLD income in the US is 45K or something like that. How can 45K/year purchase a $500K house and drive two $50K automobiles??

The ones will will really hurt are those with champaign dreams with soda pop paychecks.

Adam95GT · Oct 10, 2008

TBH im highly worried about this situation im $70k in dept so far from school and have one more year... im scared that i will not find a job... But i guess people do need chemists... there are not many of them

blksn955.o · Oct 10, 2008

Mustang5L5 said:
So yes, this ride is gonna suck for a lot of people and credit won't be like it was before with 0% down mortgages and being able to finance anything you can imagine...but let be realistic here. Did you think it was going to last? The Housing market just got out of control. The average HOUSEHOLD income in the US is 45K or something like that. How can 45K/year purchase a $500K house and drive two $50K automobiles??

The ones will will really hurt are those with champaign dreams with soda pop paychecks.

The math is a little off but not much. You are exactly correct either way with the point you are making.

The avg. income is around 45k but the avg. US house is around 214k and got as high IIRC as around 250k. Either way those avg. are not supportive of one another. If your income is 45k your looking at about 3.3 *'s that as the max you would be able to afford so say 148 almost 150k. That leaves a large sum to make up the diff. of...outside of a large profit from increased value of a home you just sold and put down as a down payment your going to have an issue.

I saw it all the time. LO's, Brokers, Processors and sales worried about a commission rather than quality work and products. I don't just blame the banks though WE all are responsible.

RIO5.0 · Oct 10, 2008

I work for Pratt & Whitney, building aircraft engines.. business is in the crapper and getting worse. We got told Wednesday the everyone in the plant is being furloughed this Monday.. No pay for anyone... was that or lay off 30 more people due to loss of orders in the last quarter...

aar0s · Oct 10, 2008

I work at a lumber yard and this "should" be our busy month but its slow as ****. On a side note i was talking to the boss this morning and he told me that the walk in business has been great. High gas prices are forcing people to shop localy and not drive 20 or so miles to the closest chain (menards, H.D. 84 lumber ect). people bitch about our prices but we're as cheep as they are and 4 gallons of gas closer.

Mustang5L5 · Oct 10, 2008

RIO5.0 said:
I work for Pratt & Whitney, building aircraft engines.. business is in the crapper and getting worse. We got told Wednesday the everyone in the plant is being furloughed this Monday.. No pay for anyone... was that or lay off 30 more people due to loss of orders in the last quarter...

Furlough sucks, but given the alternative..i'd take it.

I don't know why more companies resort to that first before layoffs. Having pending layoffs over your is demoralizing and makes you less productive.

I have a feeling my company will ask us to do a furlough week around Xmas time. I don't mind it as i don't live paycheck to paycheck, however the amount of Americans that do is astounding.

I heard once that each person should have 6 months pay in savings. I told this to a few friends and asked what they had and they each said "Maybe $400 tops in savings"

I just could never do that. I have a full years salary almost saved up...and I'm still worried

Zero Signal · Oct 10, 2008

My biggest gripe about around company is that our corporate accounting puts an amount of overhead on each person. Right now it's about $13k/mo. If each person doesn't work that much in project fees, we're considered not making profit. We (as in, some people in the office) determined that with an ultra-low overhead, if the company shut down our location, we'd fire up a new one with little up front cost.

We almost kind of wish it would go under so we can just run it ourselves and take the clients. Even now with how little work we're getting, we're still on track to make $20-30K in fees this month. This is something that could be run by 3 people. We thought we had a bad month in August at $70k in fees. Three of us could go through enough workload to bring in $80-$100k/mo in fees if the work was there. This business is a cash cow when the market is right.

Damn economy!

onlyme

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kanicas

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Black95GTS

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Zero Signal

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Zero_chance

ProKiller

Mustang5L5

That is…until I whipped out my Bissell

blksn955.o

Zero_chance

95&03GT

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Mustang5L5

That is…until I whipped out my Bissell

Adam95GT

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blksn955.o

RIO5.0

aar0s

Mustang5L5

That is…until I whipped out my Bissell

Zero Signal

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