DIY gear installers, rear end guys... chime in.

[BurningRubber]

I planned on ordering the RPM/BBK plenum and tb combo today, but I didnt. Since I didnt, I started thinking if there was anything else I might want to do instead of that. I read some stuff that really made me want to do gears and feel a real difference.

My question is... if its feasable for me to do this myself, I will be able to order gears and install them asap (I think). Local shop quoted 250, might be able to get a better rate from a freind... not 100% sure.

I read a few writeups (which helped alot), and heres what im wondering...

Right now, the rear has a little whine coming from it. It has 100k on it. My question is, could this just be a problem with the ring and pinion, or is it likely that all (or some) bearings are toast and need replacing?

What is the difference in difficulty from just swapping out the R&P as opposed to swapping the R&P and replacing the bearings at the same time? I read that alot of people using FRPP gears can get away with a less-involved install and have the gears set up correctly due to their design.

So is it possible to just buy the gear set (crush sleeve and pinion bearing come with most...?) and swap them if the other bearings are in decent shape?

I really want to do something that will make a difference in the car, not just spend $ on something that wont do a whole bunch on its own. Im thinking of going with 4.10's.

So anyone that knows of good writeup's, or has done this themselves chime in... trying to figure out if its worth doing myself (have another vehicle, so down time is OK, have basic hand tools... I know a dial indicator and tourqe wrench at least are needed) or paying a shop to do it. I love wrenching on cars... ive done a small lift kit on my 4x4, x pipe and shifter on the stang, intakes... I know gear istallations are involved, but are they do-able for the average wrencher?

Trac-lok DEFINATLY needs a rebuild aswell, 1 wheel peel pretty bad if im not in a dead straight line. I imagine this is very straight forward during a gear install?

 

[G.I.Slow]

I will say that if you are mechanically inclined with good instructions and all the right tools, that it is definatly "do-able". I did my own gears on the '91 I used to have, and it was pretty easy. I did have a friend who had done gears before helping me out a little though.

 

[merc123]

I had the local ford dealer do my 3.73's for $300. They had to get a shim kit and a new bearing kit because when they removed some of the old bearings they couldn't get them off so they were ruined.

If you don't know what you're doing with a gear install, you really need to leave it to a pro. Some shops won't even touch them because of the problems with them such as gear whine or something messing up in the "pumpkin".

 

[Disturbed One]

I ended up taking my rear end outta the car, was doing other stuff, and down to a shop that specializes in drive lines for all types of vehicles. I carried in the gears, trac loc rebuild kit, and all new bearings and such for a new gear install. it cost me $165 to get it all done there and haven't had a problem at all. A couple people I know and another shop in town quoted $250 to do it in the car with everything I listed above.

If you have the time and you think you can do it then save the money and go for it... otherwise if you get half way through and decide you can't do it you'll end up with a tow bill or taking the rear end out to take it somewhere to be finished up possibly.

 

[csledd]

Usually with a higher mileage car like yours, you want to go ahead and put new bearings in. As far as if you can do the install yourself, you just have to be exact when shimming the new gears, or it'll whine and the gears will not wear properly.

 

[BooWFO]

hate to be a prick but messing with diff's is one of those things if you have to ask if you can do it odds are you can't.



NOW that been a prick is over. Items I suggest you look at.
Tloc rebuild.
master bearing kit ( most come with all the stuff you need for the carrier bearings, my guess as to your noise, and the parts to install gears)
a press to press off new bearings ( check you may have a local machine shop that will quote you good prices or not)
gears
2 bottles of gear lube ( I like the mobil 1 synt cheap and easy to get)
1 bottle of friction modifier/ posi additive
1 tube of rtv ( black) for the diff cover
catch pan
good assortment of handtools
mechanical inclined
good jackstands
thinking through the steps before you do it.


If it is your first gear swap. I suggest giving yourself the whole weekend. as you take it apart either place the parts on the ground where they should go back ( ie right shim on right side left shim on left side) or tag and bag everything.
Now as for the frpp gears alot of times the original shims will either get the gears setup right or at least get you in the ballpark for what shims you need. Hence why alot of shops will only install frpp gears.

 

[Dusstbuster]

I'd just have it professionally done. I had a guy that did it as a sidejob at a local dealership, cost me $120 for the install. I supplied the gears, rebuild kit (bearings etc), and lube, he installed it all in about 2-3 hours. I also told him before he did the install that I didn't want any gear whine or anything like that...they've been awesome thus far. Just make sure that if you have someone do it that you make sure they know that you do NOT want gear whine and that you know what it is, that way they will know that you'll come back and make them fix it if even the slightest thing is wrong.

 

[MBDiagMan]

It is not rocket science, although compared to changing oil it could be considered so.

You do indeed need to know EXACTLY what you are doing and exactly what to check and don't take a chance and not check things. Make SURE that you check backlash and pattern before putting everything back together. If you don't feel comfortable doing these things then find someone to do it for you.

To do it, you really need to have a dial indicator and it is best to have a bearing press available. If the bearings are in REALLY good shape you can reuse them. If you are not used to inspecting bearings, replace them. If they are good you will set up with less preload and will have less heat generated during breakin, a good thing.

If you have any specific questions about the process, post them and we will help.

You need to make the decision whether or not to tackle the job yourself, based on YOUR capabilities and desire to do the job, NOT based on the fact that others on this forum say you should not do it.

Good luck.

 

[BurningRubber]

Thanks for the advice so far guys...

Seems like ive found a couple of guys from the Mustang club im in that are willing to help out aswell. So with them helping out im sure it wouldnt be a tough project. Pretty sure between all of us we have the right tools and knowlege.

Heres the kit I was looking at... http://www.latemodelrestoration.com/iwwida.pvx?;item?item_no=LRS-4209A-IT 1&comp=LRS

Edit: after adding up the costs its probaly gonna be a little over $400 for parts alone. Gears, install/bearing kit, t-lok rebuild, and speedcal... So I may go ahead and order the tb and plenum and start a gear fund immediatly after.

But keep feeding me info...!

 

[MBDiagMan]

Using FRPP gears is a VERY wise choice. With these, it is VERY possible that by simply changing them out and keeping the same shims in the same locations, you will check the pattern and backlash and they will be very close or more likely, spot on.

Good luck and be safe.

 

[Black1987Stang]

Using FRPP gears is a VERY wise choice. With these, it is VERY possible that by simply changing them out and keeping the same shims in the same locations, you will check the pattern and backlash and they will be very close or more likely, spot on.

Good luck and be safe.

Whats the big difference from FRPP gears and other normal aftermarket gears?

 

[mity2]

When you remove ring and pinion, not doing bering is bit stupid. its all right there.
I recently rebuilt rear end on my transam.
Actual steps involves to do all that your asking is very imple steps. Its just that there are several specialized tool that you'll need.
Such as micrometer, and tool that reads pinion pre-load(forgot whats it called - it looks like torque wrench), and you'll need have an access to press. when i removed ring and pinion, i changed bearings on carrier, change bearing on pinion gear(u'll h ave to remove it to shim it anyway), and since axles are out, changed axle bearings as well.
I did not changed lace, as it looked BN still(axle only had 43000 miles on it)

Its just time consuming to do all that. I installed, and removed carrier assembry 5 times before i got perfect 6thousands of an inch backrash, and 25ft-lb pinion bearing. In T/A, carrier is pressed in, and there are this tool that spreads housing just hair so that it pops out, but that i didn't have, so remove carrier took me 10 min each time(is mustang carrier pressed in? i haven't took it apart yet. So i don't know).
I went through 3 crush sleeves while i was doing it.

It took all and all 5 days to get it right(i removed axle housing out of the car to do some work on fuel pump, and sender unit, and new aluminum driveshaft, new trans bush, LS1 brake conversion along with it. took me a while) actual gear part took me 2 days

one of my good friend own mechanic shop. So i have access to all the tools I needed. made it little easier. and fact axle is out of the car made world of difference IMO

So if you do it your self, good luck. Its certainly doable. Just be sure to study what your planning to do, get all you need first(i'll get couple o f crush sleeve(they are like 2 bucks each), take your time, and don't get frustrated. it'll eventurally work

Oh and as far as FRPP gears and other goes, i think richmond being noisier is a BS. gear is only as noisy as installer. If anyone was told that richmond is noisier, thats because installer DO NOT want to re-shimm it(which is reason why I did the job myself. this way, i have noone but myself to blame if iit s screwed up)
If its not shimmed right, FRPP or Richmond or anyother gears will whinne. And if its shimmed right, FRPP or richmond, or some chinese made no name brand gear will be quite. its all up to installers IMO

 

[MBDiagMan]

The reason for using FRPP gears is that they are machined as a match for the dimensions of the original gears. In most cases you will be able to simply install the FRPP gears using the shims that you remove from the old set up and it will have correct backlash and pattern. Do NOT ASSUME that you will have correct backlash and pattern and skip these steps unless you are a risk taker. It is BAD PRACTICE to NOT check backlash and pattern ANY TIME that the carrier or pinion are removed for any reason. If you do it will catch up with you sooner or later, and I would bet on sooner.


It really amazes me how some people feel that setting up a rear axle is on the difficulty scale right up there with flying to the moon or brain surgery. To do it right you will need a dial indicator, some pattern goop and maybe a bearing press, but it does NOT require a PHD in Nuclear Physics.

If you have even a little bit of mechanical ability you will be able to do a little reading or maybe get a video and learn how to do it.

 

[BurningRubber]

Well I havnt gotten around to getting them yet, but its still an option.

I cannot make up my damn mind of what I want to do next with this car. Then, when I do decide on gears, I want 4.10's but 3.73's DEFINATLY suit my DD needs better, so thats another problem... hahaha.

Thanks for all the info so far. Between myself and some other guys in our local Mustang group weve got the tools to get the job done right.

 

[Black1987Stang]

Another question, how can i figure out what gears I have without taking the diff cover off?

 

[mity2]

Another question, how can i figure out what gears I have without taking the diff cover off?

? u really can't. If its stock, should be 3.23:1.
Or pop the cover off, count teeth on ring, and pinion. Divide number of teeth on ring by number of pinion, u get the ratio

oh wait. Donno about 87 tho. Did they have anything other then 3.23 back then?

 

[BurningRubber]

? u really can't. If its stock, should be 3.23:1.
Or pop the cover off, count teeth on ring, and pinion. Divide number of teeth on ring by number of pinion, u get the ratio

oh wait. Donno about 87 tho. Did they have anything other then 3.23 back then?

Stock for 5 speeds on a 99+ was 3.27's, dont know if it was the same for autos or not.

There were more ratio options for pre-99 years, so it could be several for an 87. I know non-pi 4.6's you could get 2.73's, 3.08's... so on.

 

[03ghoststang]

Another question, how can i figure out what gears I have without taking the diff cover off?

mark teh drive shaft at a certain point and turn the wheel one full revolution and count the number of times you see the mark pass and how much further it went past it when you finish turning the wheel...cause for a 87 you can have 2.73-3.08

 

[mity2]

Stock for 5 speeds on a 99+ was 3.27's, dont know if it was the same for autos or not.

There were more ratio options for pre-99 years, so it could be several for an 87. I know non-pi 4.6's you could get 2.73's, 3.08's... so on.

My mistake. 3.23 was my transam rearend. lol

 

[BurningRubber]

My mistake. 3.23 was my transam rearend. lol

Its all good man...