Exchange Mach1 For S197?

[jranaudo]

So after many years of wanting a mustang I have owned a Mach1 for 3 years. Even with sports spring the handling is horrible. So much so I don't feel very confident driving it at the limit. I currently do HPDE events so one screw up could be the end.

So do these later mustang handle any better or would I just be swapping out one bad handling car for another?

Right now my Mach1 handles like a fat lady on roller skates!

I fear I may have to move away from Mustang onto something else.

 

[Gearbanger 101]

Althought power and straight line performance is about the same between the two, the S197 is a better car, accross the board. More rigid chassis, better suspension geometry, better build quality, better put together interior, etc, etc. If I were you, I'd take for for a good test drive before making your decision, since we have no idea what degree of "better handling car" you're looking for?

 

[Noobz347]

You may require the Driver Mod. Check with your local Ford dealer to see if they still offer it for your year.

 

[Bojingles]

Could go get a '03 Cobra that has IRS if you want that.

 

[Noobz347]

Could go get a '03 Cobra that has IRS if you want that.

I'd probably do a three link before I did IRS. Griggs or MM.

 

[jranaudo]

No driver mod required. I've driven numerous cars and have plenty of track experience. I know what I am doing. The car simply handles like .

What I at least need right now is a car that can hug the corners WITHOUT the rear end breaking loose. I have a major loose rear end to the point where I fear a sweeper at 60mph and a little too much it breaks loose Im done.

Also, I almost killed it because the shifter is a bit inaccurate. Went from 3rd to 2nd!!! at 100mph and came within 6" of the wall.

Here is the thing. I could upgrade the suspension to a Griggs or MM but it's like 4-6k for just the kit without install. I could just get a better platform.

I am currently running MM street springs with eibach sway bars. It's possible that with a stiffer spring and stiffer sway bar this is causing the loose rear end.

Now with that said...I like the look of the S197 better.

 

[Noobz347]

No driver mod required. I've driven numerous cars and have plenty of track experience. I know what I am doing. The car simply handles like ****.

What I at least need right now is a car that can hug the corners WITHOUT the rear end breaking loose. I have a major loose rear end to the point where I fear a sweeper at 60mph and a little too much it breaks loose Im done.

Also, I almost killed it because the shifter is a bit inaccurate. Went from 3rd to 2nd!!! at 100mph and came within 6" of the wall.

Here is the thing. I could upgrade the suspension to a Griggs or MM but **** it's like 4-6k for just the kit without install. I could just get a better platform.

I am currently running MM street springs with eibach sway bars. It's possible that with a stiffer spring and stiffer sway bar this is causing the loose rear end.

Now with that said...I like the look of the S197 better.

You don't need to go to that extreme though... if you get the 3rd link from MM and a panhard bar, it will become a whole new animal.

Don't sweat the Driver Mod crack... Just poking you in the ribs.

MFE92 is my 'go to' guy for suspension. He might be able to help you out with something more specific.

 

[Gearbanger 101]

Now with that said...I like the look of the S197 better.

That being the case, I think you've already made your decision then. Because really...the only subjective part about the car is it's looks. If you like the look of the S197 better, then there's really nothing your old Mach 1 has to offer you from a functionality or cosmetic standpoint. I say sell it off and buy something you’ll be happy with.

 

[MFE92]

When was the last time you looked at the UCA bushings?

 

[jranaudo]

first thanks for all the replys. No I never looked at bushings.

I bought the Mach1 over a 2005 for one reason. Simply because it felt like a damn race car. Everything shook. Scary to most people just idling. Figured I could live with the looks. Just blah. S197 while not perfect is much cleaner IMHO.

So I know I could mod it but it just seems SO far off that I getting a better platform is both cheaper and easier.

 

[ChuckStyles]

What makes the S197 so much better than the Mach 1?

 

[Gearbanger 101]

What makes the S197 so much better than the Mach 1?

Not so much S197 vs Mach 1, but S197 vs SN95 as a whole. The S197 is a much sturdier, dedicated platform.....not built around a compromise and mish mash of parts belong to a platform that was already 25-years-old. The suspension geometry is better, the wheel base is longer and tracks wider, the driving and seating positions are both more comfortable and more ergonomic, the body panels and interior pieces actually "fit together" with one and other. Quite frankly the S197 uses higher quality components and is built as a whole to a higher standard than any Mustang before it.

 

[ChuckStyles]

Help me understand why they're sturdier and better engineered. I thought SRAs all sucked with regard to handling.

 

[Gearbanger 101]

Help me understand why they're sturdier and better engineered. I thought SRAs all sucked with regard to handling.

Ask me again in 4-months N8.....or not at all if you pull this stunt again.

 

[TheShabz]

If you want a race car, and have the money, get the Boss 302 LS.

 

[MFE92]

I didn't say have you looked at bushings, I asked if you looked at THOSE bushings. It sounds like they're shot to , because when they are, that's how the car will behave, and if you simply replaced them, you'd feel like you had a whole new car.

 

[MFE92]

As for what makes an S197 so much better, it's not that SRA's are categorically , it's that SRA's controlled by the 79-03 4-link quadra-bind are. Ford solved A LOT of problems by going to a 3-link with the S197, and it performs damn near as well as an IRS would. They also solved some problems with revised, much better front end geometry, with infinitely stiffer structure overall, etc. That is not to say that a Mach 1 (or a little old foxbody with the right equipment and driver) can't keep up with or even flat dust an S197 (see videos below), but the S197 driver doesn't have to work as hard.

 

[Husky44]

OP,

Sounds like you have a strong preference for the looks of the S197; if that's the case, then nothing you do is going to fix your Mach to your liking.

I've driven the Mach (my daughter's fiance has one), and the 05-09 S197. I own a 95 GT and a 13 GT500. I don't have the luxury of participating in HPDE, because I live in AK, and because I haven't put roll bars in my verts. So I have a little to talk from when I try to answer your questions about the comparative handling, but just remember this is my opinion, meaning your best bet would be to drive an S197 to form your own.

1) The SN95 can handle VERY well. My 95 GT corners like it's on rails; and the rear end will kick out when I tell it to, and only when I tell it to, and will do so in a very predictable manner. My suspension mods are pretty mild: Eibach Pro Kit (springs and struts/shocks), MM LCAs, subframe connectors, and CC kit with a good alignment, and good tires. If your Mach is that squirrely, I'd start by looking at the condition of what you had. Before the LCAs and subframes, my car was a lot looser, but now it is tight, predictable, and a joy to drive.

2) Shifter: Get an MGW. I've also used a Pro 5.0, nothing wrong with them, but the MGW is my preference of the two. An aftermarket shifter will make a huge difference in your shifting.

3) Overall driver feel: The SN95 platform feels smaller and more manueverable to me. Given two cars with equal acceleration and handling characteristics, I'd take an SN95 over an S197 because in my experience, the platform feels more nimble. All of that is SOTP, I don't have empirical data to back it up, but you don't seem to be doubting your Mach because of empirical data, but SOTP.

In the end it's up to you, and if you're issue is looks, then the decision is easy.

Not sure what you're looking at in the S197 as far as year/options, which will influence price, but Machs are going for around 12K in Alaska, S197 GTs start around 15k for the early models. You could do the mods listed above on your Mach for $1000-1500, and be in a great performing car for less than a used GT that will likely need some money spent on it to improve performance to an acceptable level for your road course expectations.