fan/cooling questions

[Cobain03]

i currently have a flex fan,homemade fan shroud, and a pusher electric fan. i just put the shroud on so i dont know what its gonna do. would it be better to remove my electric fan now since im running a proper setup? how abuot a orginal style steel fan?

other question...

going all electric. getting rid of the engine fan and mounting dual electric fans on the inside of the radiator (pullers). better or worse then the above setup?



just a little side note. today it was about 80/85 degrees and im VERY hesistant to take it out. as long as im not in traffic im ok. but if i start to get into heavy traffic, the engine slows down and it starts getting hotter (200/210)

 

[65ShelbyClone]

1.)would it be better to remove my electric fan now since im running a proper setup? how abuot a orginal style steel fan?

2.)going all electric. getting rid of the engine fan and mounting dual electric fans on the inside of the radiator (pullers). better or worse then the above setup?

1.) You don't know how it is going to cool with the mechanical fan so I can't say one way or the other. I'm a proponent of flex fans on cars that have stock alternators and small radiators....like '65-66 Mustangs.

2.) If you don't get a 130A+ alternator and some good electric fans(nothing from a parts store is "good"), then I would say worse. The fans will drain the battery at idle and they won't cool the engine. I don't know how you'd fit two pullers on the early radiator anyway.

EDIT: My car has all the mods in my sig, a 19" 3-row brass Modine, the stock 5-blade flex fan, no shroud(I have one in case I need it, though), and last but not least, no cooling problems.

 

[Cobain03]

i dont have a stock radiator. the previous owner notched out my battery tray to fit one in.

i think i will take the elec. fan off and run the shroud. see how it goes, then put the fan back on and see the differences.

 

[65ShelbyClone]

If it's on a toggle switch, you might leave it there in case you actually do still have cooling problems. If the non-funtional pusher is blocking enough to cause overheating by itself, you still have a cooling problem.

One of things that lots of people seem to complain about when running just electrics is overheating at idle. Usually they have a Hayden/parts store garbage fan that doesn't draw enough air. I had the same setup/problem on my previous '65 notch. A flex fan, shroud, and high-efficiency 3-row made it cool like nuts, even in 95+ weather. I'm amazed that people with milder engines than mine, yet bigger radiators and fans can't keep their cars cool.

 

[dennis112]

i dont have a stock radiator. the previous owner notched out my battery tray to fit one in.

i think i will take the elec. fan off and run the shroud. see how it goes, then put the fan back on and see the differences.

Since you are running a wider radiator, you really shouldn't have cooling problems if it is in good condition internally and externally.

I run a reasonably stout 393 with a 24" wide copper radiator (4 row-I am sure a 3 row would work fine), a clutch fan, and no shroud. I am also running the supposedly detrimental poor flow early type radiator arrangement that has both the radiator hoses on the passenger side.

Yesterday it was 90 degrees and I cruised all day (hammering it hard at times ) running 3.70 gears and the temperature on the stock gauge never gets up to the "E" in T-E-M-P. I did some serious stop and go in town too. No puking on the roadway/driveway either. 180 degree stock type thermostat, 289 waterpump, 289 crank and waterpump pulleys.

Your wide radiator, shrouded, .030 over 289 should have no problems with cooling if the parts are indeed serviceable. Personally, I would seriously consider replacing your thermostat and radiator and be done with it. (I know, it is only $ )

By the way, electric fans don't work as well with copper radiators as they do with an aluminum one and a good copper radiator has better cooling properties than an average aluminum one. Besides, as pointed out above, the flex fan adds addition restriction to the cooling air, especially if it is not running.

 

[67Dylan]

My last 89 notch had a 342, running 10.5:1CR, very stout cam, and ran high 11's NA on street tires. It had a Pep Boys 3 core brass radiator, 190* t-stat,130A alternator, a Mark VIII fan and they kept that puppy under 195* all the time; sitting in 115* Phoenix traffic or driving at highway speeds. My last car, in my garage, had a Ron Davis alum rad, 180 t-stat and kept the car less than 185* all the time. I felt the rads (3 row brass v. 2 row alum) competed very well w/each other and the real winner was the Mark VIII. Sucking in 3500CFM is no joke IMO. IF space is at a premium you can get by w/a smaller alum than a larger brass. Just make sure the fan is of a quality piece; Mark VIII will require a 75A relay, the fan, 130A alt so it is an expensive fix, but the best IMO. BTW, some may suggest the Taurus fan and this is a comparable fan, but pulls in less air due to the blade design since they use the same fan motor.

Alum/copper/brass radiators have very similar heat transfer/speicific power ratings that it shouldn't even be an argument IMO. It basically boils down to cost for the manufacturer and weight: For better cooling you need wider tubes, this increases tube to fin contact area, thus determining the radiator efficiency. Copper/Brass radiators usually have 3/8" tubing; this is determined by the weight of the copper and w/thicker tubing size you need thicker tubing wall. Any wider/thicker and the weight of copper will make the radiator too heavy. Alum on the other hand have tubes 1" - 1 1/4" and still weight LESS than copper.
As for man costs: $/W = ($/kg)/(W/kg) = (Material+Production cost per mass)/(heat-transfer per unit mass).

OK... enough of my .02!

 

[65ShelbyClone]

and the real winner was the Mark VIII. Sucking in 3500CFM is no joke IMO.

That is why your electric setup worked; you had one of the best Ford junkyard electrics out there next to the Taurus and SN95 fans. I've also heard many reports that the Mark-VIII flows at least 4500CFM. Something else about the Fox radiator is that it is considerably larger than a pre-'71. I think stock is 19x29". I had a Summit 19x31 aluminum and a flex in my '89 GT and it would never budge off 185* with the A/C on and going up a hill in 5th in 100* weather . That's on the same engine in my '68.

 

[jdowen2]

If you go electric you might want to upgrade your alternator to keep up with the demand. I put an electric fan on my 94 Blazer and gas mileage went from 18 to 20mpg. Seat of the pants feel was better, also. Not to mention the load you are taking off the water pump. If your temp gauge doesn't move past the "E" you may need a new sending unit.

 

[brianj5600]

Is it possible that it is a racing radiator. I can't verify, but I've read they have more fins per inch and need more speed to allow enough air through to cool. A belt driven fan with a shroud should move plenty of air. My belt fan at 2000rpm's moves enough air to turn an unplugged box fan I had in place just in front of the bumper just in case it got hot while breaking in a cam.

 

[65ShelbyClone]

Thats weird, I've read that racing radiators have fewer fins per inch beacuse they are used are high speed. I know my '65 notch had a "high efficiency" brass one with more fins....

 

[mustangman1974]

I know my previouse setup worked great. Stock modine radiator shroud mechanical fan then it was supplemented with 14in push on those hot days. Durring route 66 in san bernardino I never got over 210 and thats worse then stop and go. Thats stop, rev, rol, stop; rinse and repeat.

 

[67Dylan]

That is why your electric setup worked; you had one of the best Ford junkyard electrics out there next to the Taurus and SN95 fans. I've also heard many reports that the Mark-VIII flows at least 4500CFM. Something else about the Fox radiator is that it is considerably larger than a pre-'71. I think stock is 19x29". I had a Summit 19x31 aluminum and a flex in my '89 GT and it would never budge off 185* with the A/C on and going up a hill in 5th in 100* weather . That's on the same engine in my '68.

I am suggesting the best set up and we agree it works for a reason. I'm going to run the same set up in my 65. I test installed a fox radiator in my 65 to see how it would fit and only requires a little cutting in the lower mount area, new mounts installed, and of course the front radiator flow area increased. Should keep my 378 motor happy.

 

[65ShelbyClone]

test installed a fox radiator in my 65 to see how it would fit and only requires a little cutting in the lower mount area, new mounts installed, and of course the front radiator flow area increased.

You can actually fit it in there, huh? Maybe I'll have to buy my old Fox3 19x31 aluminum back from my pops.....he was going to put it in his '57 Custom 300.