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First time Advancing Timing!

  • Thread starter Thread starter Slo5Oh89
  • Start date Start date May 14, 2011

Slo5Oh89

Member
Oct 8, 2009
226
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19
Washington, IL
May 14, 2011
#1
  • May 14, 2011
  • #1
I am looking to advance my timing in my pretty stock 5.0. I understand the genral idea of how to do it from what I have read on here. I just wanted to make sure should I unplug my MSD while doing this? I know stock is 10 and I should set it around 14? I know I will need to run a higher octane. Also I know this a dumb question but how can I identify pinging? Just not sure what it is engine misfire or what? Also any tips from everyone who had done so would be great.
 

jrichker

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#2
  • May 14, 2011
  • #2
Leave the MSD system connected.


Setting the timing:
Paint the mark on the harmonic balancer with paint -choose 10 degrees BTC or 14 degrees BTC or something else if you have NO2 or other power adder. I try to paint TDC red, 10 degrees BTC white and 14 degrees BTC blue.

10 degrees BTC is towards the drivers side marks.

Simplified diagram of what it looks like. Not all the marks are shown for ease of viewing.

ATC ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' '!' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' ' BTC
---------------- > Direction of Rotation as viewed standing in front of the engine.

The ' is 2 degrees.
The ! is TDC
The ' is 10 degrees BTC
Set the timing 5 marks BTC. Or if you prefer, 5 marks towards the driver's side to get 10 degrees.

To get 14 degrees, set it 7 marks BTC. Or if you prefer, 7 marks towards the driver's side to get 14 degrees.

The paint marks you make are your friends if you do it correctly. They are much easier to see that the marks machined into the harmonic balancer hub.

At this point hook up all the wires, get out the timing light. Connect timing light up to battery & #1 spark plug. Then start the engine.

Remove the SPOUT connector (do a search if you want a picture of the SPOUT connector) It is the 2 pin rectangular plug on the distributor wiring harness. Only the EFI Mustang engines have a SPOUT. If yours is not EFI, check for a SPOUT: if you don’t find one, skip any instructions regarding the SPOUT
Warning: there are only two places the SPOUT should be when you time the engine. The first place is in your pocket while you are setting the timing and the second is back in the harness when you finish. The little bugger is too easy to lose and too hard to find a replacement.

Start engine, loosen distributor hold down with a 1/2" universal socket. Shine the timing light on the marks and turn the distributor until the mark lines up with the edge of the timing pointer. Tighten down the distributor hold down bolt, Replace the SPOUT connector and you are done.

Pinging
Pinging or spark knock is not the same as detonation.

Pinging is preignition of the fuel air charge by some source of ignition other than the spark plug. The source of the ignition can be a hot spot in the combustion chamber such as carbon, a spark plug insulator, side electrode, or a sharp edge on a valve. It occurs before the spark plug can fire and while the piston is still on its upward movement towards TDC. That is the cause of the characteristic ping or ringing sound, much like shaking a coffee can full of BB’s.

Detonation is the uncontrolled explosion of the fuel air charge after the spark plug fires and starts to burn. In a properly running engine, the spark plug ignites the fuel air charge and it burns slowly and evenly across the combustion chamber, much like a fire as it burns its way across a grassy field. When detonation occurs, the ignited fuel air charge causes an increase in the combustion chamber pressure and temperature. The remaining fuel air charge that has not been burned self–ignites explosively causing tremendous heat and pressure. The source of secondary ignition can be the same as preignition, or can be simply due to the heat and pressure. Detonation is what damages engine parts because of the excessive heat and pressure.

Pinging can lead to detonation, and the results are the same: engine damage because of the excessive heat and pressure
 

HISSIN50

"How long does it take to get help in here?
15 Year Member
Nov 29, 1999
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May 14, 2011
#3
  • May 14, 2011
  • #3
The multiple sparking might make it tough to time with the box connected. Also, some timing lights are more finicky than others with aftermarket ignitions.
 

Slo5Oh89

Member
Oct 8, 2009
226
3
19
Washington, IL
May 14, 2011
#4
  • May 14, 2011
  • #4
Should I put a higher grade fuel in it before I advance it has less than a half tank of 87
 

HISSIN50

"How long does it take to get help in here?
15 Year Member
Nov 29, 1999
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May 15, 2011
#5
  • May 15, 2011
  • #5
No one can tell you. Every car is different and each reacts differently. You will want to time it when you have a tank of the fuel you're going to run. You might be ok with 87 octane anyhow.
 

Slo5Oh89

Member
Oct 8, 2009
226
3
19
Washington, IL
May 15, 2011
#6
  • May 15, 2011
  • #6
Ok! So I advanced the timing to right about 14 engine sounded and ran fine. Put the spout connector back and it changed but I seen another post say thats normal when the computer takes back over. I took it for a drive and gotta say the engine LOVED it. I do think I heard a ping or detionation at one point under load. I did not hear it again and could not make it happen again It has 87 octane in it right now. Should I run 89 just to be sure? Also had no codes from the 15 min drive. Ideas?
 
9

93STVCobra

New Member
Sep 18, 2010
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Madison, Virginia
May 18, 2011
#7
  • May 18, 2011
  • #7
I have mine set to 16 I think? I use 93. it's only 3 more bucks a tank to use better gas... and better safe then sorry no? I would always run 93 in a stock performance car anyways. I might be dumb! I understand the RAF or whatever diffrence between gas and what it does... But 93 gas make you look like a high roller also!
 

4rdnut

Member
Dec 14, 2010
188
1
16
May 19, 2011
#8
  • May 19, 2011
  • #8
Keep the timing at 10 degrees, advancing the timing to 14 degrees is a waste of time and running 93 octane is a waste of money, your not going to gain all this magical horsepower. A stock 5.0 has 9:1 compression, with 87 octane you will get better gas mileage and make more power than with high octane fuel. A supercharged 5.0 has the timing retarded down to 4 degrees and runs higher octane because of the heat produced by compressing the air causing detonation and get a special tune for the boost and higher octane fuel.
 

Slo5Oh89

Member
Oct 8, 2009
226
3
19
Washington, IL
May 22, 2011
#9
  • May 22, 2011
  • #9
I bumped the timing to 14 and it made a world of difference in the acceleration. Next to gears best thing I have done to it. I have been running 89 no problem. Wish I would of done that a LONG time ago!
 

Mustang5L5

That is…until I whipped out my Bissell
Mod Dude
Feb 18, 2001
43,154
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Massachusetts
May 22, 2011
#10
  • May 22, 2011
  • #10
Run 91-93 to be safe.

Weather condition can play a role in detonation. So While it doesn't detonate on one day...it could on a hot humid day.

Typically, 14-16 degrees is what most cars get away it, but there are factors that make every car different
 

strattoc

Member
Jan 8, 2011
188
0
16
Cali
May 22, 2011
#11
  • May 22, 2011
  • #11
stupid california only has 91 as they're highest octane at most gas stations.....

I ran 91 in my last tank and I feel like I'm getting better mileage but then again I havent been romping as much as usual.
 

Slo5Oh89

Member
Oct 8, 2009
226
3
19
Washington, IL
May 22, 2011
#12
  • May 22, 2011
  • #12
I think I will try 93 thought I heard some ping under heavy load when I launched it though second
 

Mustang5L5

That is…until I whipped out my Bissell
Mod Dude
Feb 18, 2001
43,154
17,847
224
Massachusetts
May 22, 2011
#13
  • May 22, 2011
  • #13
strattoc said:
stupid california only has 91 as they're highest octane at most gas stations.....

I ran 91 in my last tank and I feel like I'm getting better mileage but then again I havent been romping as much as usual.
Click to expand...


91 is considered premium fuel and all manufactures tune their "premium fuel recommended/required" to 91 octane since 93 is not readily available.

In terms of which fuel is more potent? The 87 octane burns more easily/complete.

Switching to 91+ alone won't change anything...except when a tune/boost/compression/timing requires it.....but in that case, it's not the fuel that makes the power...it just allows the engine to perform to potential.

Cant tell you how many arguments I get into over misconceptions of 87 and 93 octane.
 
K

Kenpohunter17

New Member
Oct 1, 2016
3
0
1
Oct 1, 2016
#14
  • Oct 1, 2016
  • #14
I have a few questions regarding this... there's so much to learn about all of this and I'm trying to piece it together..
BUT.. How does octane affect the timing, with that advancing the timing can increase the temp. and my spark plugs by NGK were 5 on the "heat range", but if you change the air/fuel ratio it can either lower or raise temp. My real question I guess is what are some ways to ensure the life of the spark plugs and my engine while increasing performance.
 

89gtsleeper

Member
May 20, 2016
66
6
18
Oct 2, 2016
#15
  • Oct 2, 2016
  • #15
In my experience, there isn't much magic to keeping spark plugs alive longer. Assuming your engine is healthy and you have a good seal on your piston rings, it's pretty much just a matter of keeping proper air/fuel ratios and using the correct plug for your application. I run a blower, so I use a plug that is one or two heat ranges below stock. Keep my AFR normalized, and the plugs live for a really long time. On a naturally aspirated motor, bumping your timing a few degrees should not necessitate a plug change.
 
K

Kenpohunter17

New Member
Oct 1, 2016
3
0
1
Oct 2, 2016
#16
  • Oct 2, 2016
  • #16
Thank you, with updating my X4 last night it downloaded 80 files and then encountered an error. Disregarding it i tried to adjust the timing and now the device won't let me advance it... only "retard" the timing. Chatting with sct support over email to hopefully get this resolved.
 
K

Kenpohunter17

New Member
Oct 1, 2016
3
0
1
Oct 3, 2016
#17
  • Oct 3, 2016
  • #17
Well apparently with the new update they got rid of the option to advance timing for liability issues.
 
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