The biggest problem with our country is people have been spending money they do not have. Latest generations have a false sense of entitlement. You get what you put into. cfc does get people into new cars, but who needs a new car? You would be better off driving your clunker which happens to be paid for than getting a fresh new car payment every month. The auto industry is handing out money like the banks were and what happened to them? Cfc should not last any longer than labor day, Obama passed another billion to the program, but will be exhausted sooner than later. People should start tow truck companies right now...there will be a lot of money to be made considering all the new vehicles that will be hauled off due to people not being able to afford their car payments.
Foxes victims of Cash for Clunkers?
- Thread starter 90mustangGT
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Unfortunately we will continue to have this sense of entitlement as long as people with $25K/year jobs feel they need to drive around in Escalades and other expensive cars.
I could rattle of a list of people I know who feel the need to devote half their monthly income to their car payment and insurance because they think they are too good for a VW or Mazda or something and yet don't have the income to justify buying a benz or lexus.
I could rattle of a list of people I know who feel the need to devote half their monthly income to their car payment and insurance because they think they are too good for a VW or Mazda or something and yet don't have the income to justify buying a benz or lexus.
Aint that the truth! I do business with a guy who just began financing a Mercedes cl550 and he settled for a monthly payment of $575/month. His trade in value was $3500 on a honda civic that his parents bought for him new in 2000. He owned that car! Now he pays all that money on a $65,000 car that will be worth a fraction of that tomorrow, or even today! "It's bad a** though" he says.. I guess that's why I do business with him, he's an idiot and he makes me money!
After 10 years, that's as much as his $65000 car will be worth.
By then he might have just paid off the loan, except that he'll need another new loan when the time comes to replace that car so the whole cycle just repeats itself.
$900 a month?.....that's unbelievable. That's mortgage territory. I guess its all relavent. some people put their car at the top of the priority list which isn't a bad thing at certain ages. The older I get, the lower a car is on the priority list, ESPECIALLY after you get married! Have kids etc... I would probably drive a nicer vehicle if I was in my car a lot during the day, but I'm only 5 minutes from where I work so it never made too much sense to break the bank for an expensive car. Plus, I'm not out burning a tank of gas on friday nights anymore chasing chicks around. Oh how things change......
Didnt think of it that way, my mortgage is 900 a month, Im paying 300 a month right now for my car payments, and once its paid off im never getting another car loan again. Owning a house really put things into perspective for me. Wish i never bought the car and drove a beater to work
Its called protection genius.....something EVERY president must have in the past and future. lol
That comment was about as dumb as someone trading in a nice mustang.
But unfortunately, hotrodders are a very small fraction of people who matter in the automotive world. LOL VERY FEW people give a damn about that fox. It aint nothin special to me
You could still up armor a Fusion and Prius. If you read up before Obama became Resident he drove a Chrysler 300c. Hence a hemi. And how many people are going to default on payments? Smart Idea obama. I made it through 3 tours in Iraq. Not as a paper pusher but as a rifleman in un armored humvees and made it out just fine. People are entitled to there opinions. If my opinion made you mad or upset then take some Midol and get over it.
As my buddy tells me.....theres alot more waste and hazardous crap produced to make a new car than there is by just letting an old car run.
Has anyone fathomed how bad its going to be for the environment when everyone is swapping in Hybrid batteries??? Matter of fact the old air cooled VW beetles are more efficient than alot of newer 2 door 4 cyl cars and they don't even need antifreeze!!!!
Also that Video about computers being government property....Hahaa Does anyone remember why everyone left England?? So you don't have the govt. hand up your @$$ like a puppet. Guess we all better start reading the fine print nowadays!!!
Chris
Has anyone fathomed how bad its going to be for the environment when everyone is swapping in Hybrid batteries??? Matter of fact the old air cooled VW beetles are more efficient than alot of newer 2 door 4 cyl cars and they don't even need antifreeze!!!!
Also that Video about computers being government property....Hahaa Does anyone remember why everyone left England?? So you don't have the govt. hand up your @$$ like a puppet. Guess we all better start reading the fine print nowadays!!!
Chris
Something y'all might find worth reading:
`Cash for clunkers' effect on pollution? A blip - Yahoo! News
As far as being an economic stimulus, this is a pretty effective bill, as it has already been shown to have significantly boosted automotive sales, and it's largely benefitted domestic automakers and American jobs. If there was some way they could keep doing something like this, but instead make it to where the dealerships will offering generous $3,500 to $4,500 trade-in amounts for "clunker" cars (rather than making taxpayers foot the bill), AND as long as the vehicles being traded in weren't getting crushed (still breaks my heart to know all those GT-40 motors are being destroyed), then it would be an awesome trend to keep going.
As far as being something to help the environment, it's a frickin' joke. As stated, the amount of pollution created in manufacturing new vehicles MORE than outweighs the amount of pollution created in maintaining and driving old ones. Only if they come out with a universal or easily-adaptable plug-in or hybrid electric powerplant that could be retrofitted onto virtually any existing vehicle, and if everyone could afford to switch to THAT kind of a setup, THEN there would be a significant savings. But presenting this whole program as being some kind of an environmental godsend is just laughable. There'd be more of an air quality benefit to encouraging people to stop eating beans and thus farting less than there would be to the end result of this program.
`Cash for clunkers' effect on pollution? A blip - Yahoo! News
As far as being an economic stimulus, this is a pretty effective bill, as it has already been shown to have significantly boosted automotive sales, and it's largely benefitted domestic automakers and American jobs. If there was some way they could keep doing something like this, but instead make it to where the dealerships will offering generous $3,500 to $4,500 trade-in amounts for "clunker" cars (rather than making taxpayers foot the bill), AND as long as the vehicles being traded in weren't getting crushed (still breaks my heart to know all those GT-40 motors are being destroyed), then it would be an awesome trend to keep going.
As far as being something to help the environment, it's a frickin' joke. As stated, the amount of pollution created in manufacturing new vehicles MORE than outweighs the amount of pollution created in maintaining and driving old ones. Only if they come out with a universal or easily-adaptable plug-in or hybrid electric powerplant that could be retrofitted onto virtually any existing vehicle, and if everyone could afford to switch to THAT kind of a setup, THEN there would be a significant savings. But presenting this whole program as being some kind of an environmental godsend is just laughable. There'd be more of an air quality benefit to encouraging people to stop eating beans and thus farting less than there would be to the end result of this program.
My opinion is that your comment is retarded.
And my opinion is most in this country are fat or stupid or both and will vote for the biggest liar.
C4C sucks and when its done detroit can lay off again.
And my opinion is most in this country are fat or stupid or both and will vote for the biggest liar.
C4C sucks and when its done detroit can lay off again.
Not even worth going back and forth with people like you.
Why am I paying tax dollars for this program? Do I really want to bail out a failing industry? Do I really want to encourage those without the means to repair their clunkers to take 10-20k loans? Who is going to bail out the U.S. Government when they can no longer afford the interest on their loan (the national debt (click for more facts))? Who is going to bail the rest of us out when gov't policy causes staggering inflation and the value of our monthly wages can't buy a loaf of bread? Our government has decided to spend its way out of a debt crisis when it has never been able to save money itself.... Amazing!
This program sucks, flat out
A ton more people driving cars they cant afford, will default on loans and have the cars repossessed, leaving us in a worse situation than we started.
OK that wont be what happens across the board, but you know more than a few of those loans are not going to see maturity!
The idea of destroying these older cars instead of AT LEAST allowing them to be used for parts is completely ridiculous. It is currently too early in the morning for me to elaborate coherently, but the fact is that this program really hurts...ESPECIALLY enthusiasts like us.
By the way I want to strangle half the douche bags on the corral forum who pretty much dont give a F about that 4-eye because its a 4-eye. Even a guy with an aero fox commented who cares. Thats why I dont post over there, a bunch of stuck up jerks. Got that vibe since day one. :SNSign:
A ton more people driving cars they cant afford, will default on loans and have the cars repossessed, leaving us in a worse situation than we started.
OK that wont be what happens across the board, but you know more than a few of those loans are not going to see maturity!
The idea of destroying these older cars instead of AT LEAST allowing them to be used for parts is completely ridiculous. It is currently too early in the morning for me to elaborate coherently, but the fact is that this program really hurts...ESPECIALLY enthusiasts like us.
By the way I want to strangle half the douche bags on the corral forum who pretty much dont give a F about that 4-eye because its a 4-eye. Even a guy with an aero fox commented who cares. Thats why I dont post over there, a bunch of stuck up jerks. Got that vibe since day one. :SNSign:
Yea, I was really surprised about that. I may be biased, but I thought the general consensus these days was that clean 4-eyes are MORE desirable. Oh well.
I found this on another site..
Link to the rules of the CFC program..
http://www.cars.gov/files/TheRule.pdf
g. Disposal of Trade-In Vehicles (§§ 599.400-403)
Quote:
In addressing the trade-in vehicle disposal process (Section III.b., Identification of Disposal Facilities), the agency decided to include disposal facilities participating in the ELVS program (currently numbering approximately 7,700) on the list of facilities that may participate in the disposal process, subject to certain conditions and certifications. As a condition of accepting transfer of the trade-in vehicle, the disposal facility must certify that it meets all applicable State and Federal laws and has a currently active State license to operate as a disposal facility in that State. The disposal facility must also certify that it will not sell, lease, exchange, or otherwise dispose of the vehicle for use as an automobile in the United States or any other country, that the vehicle will be crushed or shredded onsite within six months after the date of its transfer from the dealer, and that the vehicle will not be transferred to another disposal facility prior to being crushed or shredded. Finally, it must certify that it will update NMVTIS, within 7 days after receiving the trade-in vehicle and again within 7 days after crushing or shredding the vehicle. During the six-month period prior to the required crushing or shredding of the trade-in vehicle, the disposal facility may sell any parts of the vehicle other than the engine block or drive train (unless the drive train is dismantled and sold in parts). These requirements for disposal facilities are implemented in sections 599.400(b) and 401 and Appendix E.
The agency also has determined that, in lieu of direct transfer to a disposal facility that appears on the agency’s list, the dealer may opt to transfer the trade-in vehicle to a salvage auction, subject to certain conditions and certifications. As a condition of accepting transfer of the trade-in vehicle, the salvage auction must certify that it meets all applicable State and Federal laws and has a currently active State license to conduct business as a salvage auction in that State. The salvage auction must also certify that it will not sell, lease, exchange, or otherwise dispose of the vehicle for use as an automobile in the United States or any other country. It must certify that it will limit participation in the auction of a trade-in vehicle under the CARS program to a disposal facility that currently appears on the agency’s CARS list of disposal facilities and will obtain from the disposal facility the same certification the disposal facility would have provided upon direct transfer of a trade-in vehicle from the dealer, and provide that certification to NHTSA. Finally, the salvage auction must certify that it will update NMVTIS, within 3 days after receipt of the trade-in vehicle from the dealer, or prior to auction, which ever is earlier. These requirements for salvage auctions are implemented in sections 599.400(c) and 402 and Appendix F. Finally, a dealer receiving certifications from a disposal facility or a salvage auction under these procedures is required to send them to the agency within 7 days of receipt. Section 599.403 sets forth this requirement.
It is important to note that the requirement under the CARS Act and its implementing regulations for disposal facilities and salvage auctions participating in the CARS program to update NMVTIS are distinct from the monthly reporting requirement 53 imposed on junk and salvage yards pursuant to 49 U.S.C. 30504. In accordance with regulations implemented by the Department of Justice at 28 CFR 25.56, any individual or entity engaged in the business of operating a junk yard or salvage yard within the United States shall provide, or cause to be provided on its behalf, to the operator of NMVTIS and in a format acceptable to the operator, an inventory of all junk automobiles or salvage automobiles obtained in whole or in part by that entity in the prior month. Updates by junk and salvage yards to NMVTIS under the CARS Act and its implementing regulations, however, may fulfill this separate NMVTIS monthly reporting requirement regarding such vehicles, provided the updates contain all of the information required by the Department of Justice under 28 CFR Part 25.
The procedures described above allow a trade-in vehicle to be transferred no more than two times subsequent to the dealer taking title and prior to its crushing or shredding, either directly to an entity currently appearing on the list of eligible disposal facilities, where the vehicle must remain until it is crushed or shredded, or to a salvage auction that subsequently transfers the vehicle to that entity. This approach for the vehicle disposal process is adopted in Subpart D and the required certifications appear in Appendices E and F. Nothing in the rule proscribes further transfer of a crushed vehicle to another disposal facility, including a shredder.
So going by this they can be parted out.
Link to the rules of the CFC program..
http://www.cars.gov/files/TheRule.pdf
g. Disposal of Trade-In Vehicles (§§ 599.400-403)
Quote:
In addressing the trade-in vehicle disposal process (Section III.b., Identification of Disposal Facilities), the agency decided to include disposal facilities participating in the ELVS program (currently numbering approximately 7,700) on the list of facilities that may participate in the disposal process, subject to certain conditions and certifications. As a condition of accepting transfer of the trade-in vehicle, the disposal facility must certify that it meets all applicable State and Federal laws and has a currently active State license to operate as a disposal facility in that State. The disposal facility must also certify that it will not sell, lease, exchange, or otherwise dispose of the vehicle for use as an automobile in the United States or any other country, that the vehicle will be crushed or shredded onsite within six months after the date of its transfer from the dealer, and that the vehicle will not be transferred to another disposal facility prior to being crushed or shredded. Finally, it must certify that it will update NMVTIS, within 7 days after receiving the trade-in vehicle and again within 7 days after crushing or shredding the vehicle. During the six-month period prior to the required crushing or shredding of the trade-in vehicle, the disposal facility may sell any parts of the vehicle other than the engine block or drive train (unless the drive train is dismantled and sold in parts). These requirements for disposal facilities are implemented in sections 599.400(b) and 401 and Appendix E.
The agency also has determined that, in lieu of direct transfer to a disposal facility that appears on the agency’s list, the dealer may opt to transfer the trade-in vehicle to a salvage auction, subject to certain conditions and certifications. As a condition of accepting transfer of the trade-in vehicle, the salvage auction must certify that it meets all applicable State and Federal laws and has a currently active State license to conduct business as a salvage auction in that State. The salvage auction must also certify that it will not sell, lease, exchange, or otherwise dispose of the vehicle for use as an automobile in the United States or any other country. It must certify that it will limit participation in the auction of a trade-in vehicle under the CARS program to a disposal facility that currently appears on the agency’s CARS list of disposal facilities and will obtain from the disposal facility the same certification the disposal facility would have provided upon direct transfer of a trade-in vehicle from the dealer, and provide that certification to NHTSA. Finally, the salvage auction must certify that it will update NMVTIS, within 3 days after receipt of the trade-in vehicle from the dealer, or prior to auction, which ever is earlier. These requirements for salvage auctions are implemented in sections 599.400(c) and 402 and Appendix F. Finally, a dealer receiving certifications from a disposal facility or a salvage auction under these procedures is required to send them to the agency within 7 days of receipt. Section 599.403 sets forth this requirement.
It is important to note that the requirement under the CARS Act and its implementing regulations for disposal facilities and salvage auctions participating in the CARS program to update NMVTIS are distinct from the monthly reporting requirement 53 imposed on junk and salvage yards pursuant to 49 U.S.C. 30504. In accordance with regulations implemented by the Department of Justice at 28 CFR 25.56, any individual or entity engaged in the business of operating a junk yard or salvage yard within the United States shall provide, or cause to be provided on its behalf, to the operator of NMVTIS and in a format acceptable to the operator, an inventory of all junk automobiles or salvage automobiles obtained in whole or in part by that entity in the prior month. Updates by junk and salvage yards to NMVTIS under the CARS Act and its implementing regulations, however, may fulfill this separate NMVTIS monthly reporting requirement regarding such vehicles, provided the updates contain all of the information required by the Department of Justice under 28 CFR Part 25.
The procedures described above allow a trade-in vehicle to be transferred no more than two times subsequent to the dealer taking title and prior to its crushing or shredding, either directly to an entity currently appearing on the list of eligible disposal facilities, where the vehicle must remain until it is crushed or shredded, or to a salvage auction that subsequently transfers the vehicle to that entity. This approach for the vehicle disposal process is adopted in Subpart D and the required certifications appear in Appendices E and F. Nothing in the rule proscribes further transfer of a crushed vehicle to another disposal facility, including a shredder.
So going by this they can be parted out.
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