Getting an S-Trim soon, is a tune necessary?

Absolutely positively get the thing tuned. No ifs ands or buts. Its SUCH a waste to spend all that money getting the thing blown and not get it tuned. As far as a shop not being able to get it right, if thats the case that shop should be closed down. Any good tuner can tune a Vortech car to run great. But yes, get the thing tuned without a doubt. You will be much happier you did.

Yes.

The_Mustang said:

Getting an S-Trim soon, is a tune necessary?

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Absolutely. You're pissing in the wind otherwise.

The_Mustang said:

Like the title says, I'm going to take the plunge and get myself an S trim kit at the begining of the year. My car is pretty stock save for the 75mm MAF and the Edel. intake.

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First thing that comes to my mind is you are gonna peg that 19lb caled maf

Not totally sure but seems like you would

I've read countless horror stories about tuners not being able to get these cars right, ever!

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I've come to these thoughts based upon being on these boards for a good time and what little self tuning experience I've been able to gather

There are tuners
and
There are good tuners

Not all tuners are the same

I gotta believe when you hear or see those horror stories .............
you don't get the complete story

I think in a good bit of those stories ............

A guy may not have had parts that would work together efficiently

Or maybe even something like ..........

He kinda forgot tell the part about how the Pro Tuner told him he had some issues which made it impossible for him to tune it to the maximum

You gotta be so careful about taking a lot of stuff you hear goin around and some of the things you see on these boards to heart

I just called a local shop in the Jacksonville FL area and asked the lady about tuning my car. First mistake she made was recommend an SCT tuning device for my car. I then told her that it won't work on my car because those are made for 96 up with obd II. See, this is the kind of ignorance that leads to a disappointed customer.

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Before I say anything ................

I wanna say the following info is what I THINK I have seen so you will have to check it out for yourself

IIRC, I've seen Don say on our site ...............
the SCT package works on our cars

Is there anyone who installed an S trim on their car without a tune and had no problems? I don't want to grenade the engine on my first blast down the street! I'd be willing to drive a little ways to get this thing tuned by a reputable shop. Recommendations appreciated!

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I have to say .. I think you're wise to have caution here

I've seen several who built a pa combos pop hg's on their very first test drive and they stressed several times they did not go past mid throttle on that shake down run.

With a new pa setup ... you wanna kinda ease into it
so
BLAST is not the kinda attitude to start out with ............
if you see what I was trying to get across here.

Yes, you can find some who did the blower starter kit with the fmu thing with no tune and did not have probs.

however ... generally speaking ..............

You gotta know that method is based upon the boost not being all that high and the tune is gonna be most likely fat ... really fat due to the fuel system that was built for around 250rwhp maximum is now being asked to support WAY more power so it has to be really fat with too much fuel to be safe ... which in turn ... is gonna leave power on the table.

Hey ...That method works ... just not nearly efficient as a good tune

If you wanna have a Pro Tune it ... get good references

Tweecer is an option too, but then comes the added expense of the laptop.

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Cutting your self tuning teeth on a blown combo
Well .......... its just not all that wise IMHO
That kind of combo is just not all that forgiving
and
will require a good bit of knowledge right from the get go

I got bad news about that ... added expense

You will not only need a laptop
but
With a blown combo

You really don't have the option to .......
just get a wide band later
like you could if you were na

I know you don't wanna hear it
but
Just ain't ... No cheap way to tune a pa combo
that is ...... if you wanna do it right

Other expenses to consider ..........
Hotter spark to deal with spark blow out at higher rpm's
Larger fuel pump
Larger inj's
Larger maf

Just a thought or two from my direction

Grady

there's also the Anderson PMS. then you don't need to buy a laptop.

You need a tune, but you dont need computer tuning. Call a shop with someone, hopefully not a girl, that knows cars. There are a ton of them here in FL. You simply need to adjust the timing and fuel pressure in order to keep the engine safe and perform to its full potential. I am running the bone stock computer with no chip and my car runs great. Im sure with computer tuning my car would have a lot more to offer throughout the power curve, but it is not needed because I have NO driveability issues whatsoever.

I had a Procharger P600B kit on my car running 9 pounds when it was basically stock without a tune. I just used the FMU that came in the kit. It definitely had power but it always ran very inconsistent. It loved to backfire. I eventually blew a head gasket while lighting up the tires and I learned my lesson.

ALWAYS GET A TUNE WITH POWER ADDER COMBOS!

Call that lady back & apologize, lol. There are plenty of guys like us running SCT.


And that sounds about like the average price. I'll dig a little & post back if I find something better.

Cutting your self tuning teeth on a blown combo
Well .......... its just not all that wise IMHO
That kind of combo is just not all that forgiving
and
will require a good bit of knowledge right from the get go

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I could not agree with Grady more.....all it takes is ONE little messup on your spark tables and BOOM!!!........new headgaskets. Luckily I did a good bit of research to get a baseline tune and learned the things NOT to do and I haven't had a problem with pinging...at all. I still have a lot to learn..but I can say thing. If you go self-tuning....start with your fuel nice and fat..and keep the timing wayyy down. Then slowly work your way up to more spark (for wot)

I don't know about the sct thing

not that it matters but i say no.

there are some who run ok with no tune at all...and in all honesty, you should be good driving to a tuner....as long as you don't hammer it.

I wouldn't keep it with no tune....the last thing I'd want is to spend 2 grand only to have it blow my headgaskets or completely screwthe bottom end when I floor it. Sure you might be good at first, but for one you'll leave power on the table..and two, it may just randomly decided to detonate on you

I'll pitch in here - just bought the MAF and injectors that I need to put an S-trim on my car.

If you read nothing else in my post read this next line...

IF YOU WANT IT TO LAST AND ARE NEW TO TUNING CARS, GET IT TUNED PROFESSIONALLY!

I'll be tuning mine w/ my twEECer but I've had the tuner for a while and have learned the system w/ my naturally aspirated combo. Even at that I am going to have to be crazy cautions with the tune and really creep up on the tune.

Have fun!

Wes

Definately get it tuned by a pro. Before I bought my S-Trim I spoke to a local tuner (Powertrain Dynamics) to get his recommendations of what else to install with the sc.

Steve (the tuner) doesn't like the FMU that comes with the Vortech kit so he told me what else to buy including part numbers and he burnt me a chip so that I could drive the car to him without melting the engine. He's tuned hundreds of cars so he has tons of profiles already set up in his database and burns the chip according to your mods.

After the install I took the car to him to be tuned. All engines are different so even with the chip burnt for a car that had similar mods the first pull was still lean and ended. After three pulls my car made 433rwhp and this is my daily driver.

Spend the extra money and have it tuned.

I've had luck with autolight 23s

I was cruising through some threads on the Self Tuner forum

I ran across one where a self tuner had a blown combo and I was immediately reminded about this thread.

He asked if lower af ratio numbers described a more rich mixture
You would kinda think he was just getting started here.

anyway

It seems he learned ... the hard way
you can get in trouble pretty quick with a forced combo

I'll say no more so as not to spoil the outcome of the story

If you care to look

http://eectuning.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=6768&sid=bab87378ad8557f6d7e91e63acb1bdb9

Grady