Help Me HISSIN!! +other cooling gurus

91lxttrim · Jun 21, 2006

Hey Hissin -or any other cooling gurus-

I just installed an ebay alum rad last weekend, already have a edelbrock water pump, and a Black magic extreme e-fan. So today on the way home at about 5:30 it's still 110* out, and after sitting in traffic then some 65 mph driving on the 60, then another 15 minutes of stop and go traffic, I get home just as my autometer temp gauge reaches about 245. This is with trick flow heads which makes me nervous. This is all without even turning the a/c on. I knew if I turned it on it would just be too much and overheat.

Why? so tonight I installed a 180 t-stat. It's just an autozone special, so it might not be balanced like I read in your other posts like the Mr. Gasket unit.

Well tomorrow will be the ultimate test. If it still gets just as hot as today I will get the pressure tester and test the cooling system.

Do you think I might have a head gasket leak? Should I look into the Taurus fan and dump the Flexalite? (haven't been impressed with it).

What exactly is your cooling set-up? Sounds like you have it dialed in and this is my daily driver which is driving me nuts 'cause I can't use the a/c I just shelled out over $300 to get charged!

all the goods are in my sig

Thanks

Roland69 · Jun 21, 2006

sounds like you have a air in the system

HISSIN50 · Jun 21, 2006

You have the blower and other stuff I dont, and that definately matters.

At speed, your fan isnt the culprit. Another reminder about the air dam is appropriate. Or did the car not get hot till you hit the stop-and-go?

I have never used that fan and dont want to. On the fox, I run a metal replacement fan blade and HD clutch - I ran at 185-190* earlier today (we were probably 5* cooler than you).
On the '94, I run the SN95 fan and Dc Controller. Comparable operating temps to the fox.

If you only got hot once slowed down: like you noted, the fan is the place to look (make sure it's coming on everytime it should, and that it's staying on). Other things like making sure it's sealed against the radiator can help (I use weather stripping and stuff - you need air to be pulled through the radiator and not from around the shroud). I find with cooling systems that lots of little stuff adds up (5* here and 5* there).

Testing the system pressure is a good idea if you have access to a tester.

I wont spout all the specs again as I think you know them. This time of year, you can run 25/75 coolant/water, respectively, to help out (compared to 50/50, that can drop temps about 20-25*F). I only bring that up because I think there was some confusion on your friend's thread (people thinking coolant helps with cooling - it doesnt).

Post more about exactly what temps you saw while at over 40 mph versus temps at 20 mph or under............... that'll help.

Good luck bud.

91lxttrim · Jun 21, 2006

Thanks guys,

I lifted the front driver's side and let it idle until the t-stat opened and watched for bubbles and made sure the jiggle valve is at the top when installing t-stat. I also have the air dam.

I am running about that (25/75 maybe even 20/80 coolant/water). It takes me about 15 min stop and go to get to the 60 where it climbs to 215*. While on the 60 it lowered to 209* while going about 65 mph (I try to baby it). Then I get off the 60 and have another 15 min of stop and go where it climbs to 230*+.

I have to admit it ran cooler with the clutch fan. This fan takes up most of the real estate on the radiator, is pressed very tight against it, and it is always on it seems. It has the adjustable dial on the module, and it is wired to the come on with the a/c. BTW when I turn the key back to acc, the fan clicks on and off with the a/c relay, even when the car is cold. Funky Flexalite.

If I don't see an improvement tomorrow I'll also look into the Taurus fan. There's not much left.

HISSIN50 · Jun 21, 2006

Nice work with the burping. So really it sounds like at slower speeds is when the issue arises (when it's 110*F, you dont have much to work with as far as temp deltas between ambient temps and coolant temps).

I even wonder if you want more than a Taurus fan. You have forced induction in about as hot a climate as you will find. It's said that the taurus fan and SN95 fans flow similar CFMs. Well, my SN95 fan barely cuts it sometimes and I dont have the blower. I agree that a well maintained stock clutch fan is hard to beat. Mine (on the fox) sounds like a 747 but works very well (a mechanical fan has to be a little parasitic to work well).

Just something to consider: I'd hate to see you spend money on a taurus fan and have it not be enough. But you could probably unload it for what you paid since everyone loves the fan. If I had space on the 94, I'd run a Viper fan (check out ponyboy19's install. Nice lookin unit and it doesnt look too big. A mark VIII fan is kinda big as I recall. Dual Spals would probably do well and they are super thin.

And that's pretty normal for the fan relay to energize with the AC, even if the car is cold. Only some OEM systems (which are computer controlled) monitor the ECT and VSS and turn off the fan when AC is on but the car is cold or at considerable speed.

Random thoughts.

91lxttrim · Jun 21, 2006

Wow that Viper fan looks pretty serious. I would need a lesson in wiring just to get that hooked up.

Last night I installed the 180* t-stat and took it for a little test drive with the a/c cranked the whole time. It was 10:30 so things were pretty cool as far as ground temperatures but I was kind of hammering it too and trying to simulate stop and go conditions. I looked pretty suspicious. Anyway, it got up to 209 when I pulled in the driveway. Not too bad.

Today on my way to work it stayed pegged at 180*! Never stayed that low. Then this afternoon on my way to school (100* outside), I ran the a/c while going through the Del Taco drive thru and the whole way to school and the highest it got was 215. Not bad but I wonder if there's more room for improvement.

It seems like the worst part of the day is yet to come on my drive home from school... If it doesn't go above 215* I will be ecstatic!

Thanks again HISSIN, I'll keep you posted about the drive home.

Mustang5L5 · Jun 21, 2006

My cooling setup is pretty simply, but it works VERY well.

All i have is a Pep Boys 3-core radiator, a 95 V6 electric fan, a Bosch water pump, 180* stat and some water wetter added to the coolant/water mix.

My temp stays at 188* no matter what with the fan running. If i shut the fan off it will slowly climb past 200, but if i am moving or on the highway it will come down on it's own. Even with the A/C on (when i had it) it wouldn't pass 190 degrees in 100 degree heat as long as i had the fan running.

91lxttrim · Jun 21, 2006

Yeah the 180* t-stat made a huge difference IMO. When I changed it there was a Ford Motorcraft stat in there. I tried looking up the part # but couldn't find anything. I'm assuming since it's a ford part that it's a 192*.

The fan I have is supposed to move 3300 cfm of air. The only thing better than that I've seen so far is the Viper fan. I have to look into how to install that and sell my Flexalite Extreme and I think I will go with the Viper fan.

HISSIN50 · Jun 21, 2006

Glad to hear it's running cooler. WHen we get over 100* around here for a few days, it feels like it makes cooling the car exponentially harder. The difference from 105-110* in terms of operating temps is like that of 70 to 100* (a tiny temp delta at high temps really has an impact in other words). The roads are radiating some serious heat (which is what your radiator is sucking up) after a few days/weeks/months of this stuff (for folks elsewhere, our lows are in the 80's so the ground just becomes heat-saturated).

The Viper fan would not be hard to wire up, should you go that route. Let's hope that some more tweaks/observation allow the car to run cooler yet.

04sleeper · Jun 21, 2006

I'll try to jump in here late in the game and add a little.

This is my friends setup with a 331 and with a YSI.

He runs a SN-95 fan with a MR. Gasket 180 thermostat and has the Summit 31X19 radiator.

Currently is is wired up with 2 relays and runs on the low side of the fan and the car sees between 180-190. It will get to 195 if the A/C is on and this is in South Florida. Not quite as hot as AZ but still hot.

I talked him into a DCC and he is going to put that in soon.

Not sure if this helps you or not, but just giving you a similar combo with success.

91lxttrim · Jun 21, 2006

Thanks 04sleeper, That is good to know. It's got to be the fan. Last night I thought maybe this whole time I had the fan control set to kick in at too high of a temp but only got a little adjustment out of it. So today I get out of class and the car is dead. I use a battery disconnect when I park the car so nothing has power except the fan and the radio (memory). The fan must have been running almost non-stop while I was in class. Started right up after work and between classes though.

I REALLY dislike this fan more and more evreryday. I wonder if my clutch fan would fit in there...

Btw, what kind of numbers is he runnin'? Is it his DD?

Woodrow · Jun 21, 2006

Built a shroud around the black magic fan and you will be fine, other wise get a s/n, tarus, or volvo (same as the ones d/c sells) that have a built on shroud and ur problem should be solved.

91lxttrim · Jun 21, 2006

Well I figured out my problem! I have the wrong car!! This is out of control. So not only was it DEAD after school, but the temp reached 245* on my way home!!

I figure I could sell it, buy a Toyota Yaris and live a slow, ice cold, stress free life.

Curse · Jun 21, 2006

91lxttrim said:
I figure I could sell it, buy a Toyota Yaris and live a slow, ice cold, stress free life.

Yeah but a Yaris would not be fun at all. I had nothing but problems with AZ t-stats. Start with the basics to see what affects temp the most. Run more water than coolant for now and add some water wetter. Good luck.

91lxttrim · Jun 21, 2006

My car hasn't been fun at all either. I nailed it just a little bit today to see how much power loss there really is and OMG! It is sooo slow! So what's the point of driving around this high performance vehicle when if I run the a/c it's slower than a truck.

I added half a bottle of water wetter to my 80/20 water/coolant mixture. The heat is so extreme hear that I can't notice a difference with that stuff.

HISSIN50 · Jun 22, 2006

Based upon what was said (running hot and power loss), I'd still pressure test the system if you can do so cheap/for free. It'll take just a couple minutes to do. The water level isnt changing (you arent losing any coolant)?

If applicable: it sounds like you might want to switch the controller-input around so it wont spin after the ignition is turned off. The dead battery thing sucks.

The AM gauge is mechanical? Any chance it isnt reading accurately? I got a turkey thermometer from Wallymart and I use it sometimes to compare to gauges.

That's all I can think of right now.

Curse · Jun 22, 2006

Could the Eddy water pump be at fault? I've heard a few people complain about that pump. Just relax and I'm sure the problem will show up soon. Good luck

91lxttrim · Jun 22, 2006

Sorry I was fed up when I said those bad things. Don't worry I'm not going to sell it. In fact this is probably the last one for a long time, so I have to make it work.

Well tonight I yanked that Black Tragic fan out and put my stock clutch fan in. Screw messin with that e. fan for now.

I'll pick up the tester tomorrow after school and check it tomorrow night.

The gauge I have is a short sweep electrical w/ new sending unit.

If the clutch fan doesn't do it, then I move on to the Viper fan. After the pressure test of course.

I'll check some posts about the edelbrock pump...

Curse · Jun 22, 2006

Well that sucks about the new BM extreme fan, I was going to pick one up. Guess I will be using the Spal dual fan unit.

Roland69 · Jun 22, 2006

My stock setup works just fine for me...I think I have a 180* stat

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