Honesty, dumb question? RX8 or new Stang?

Mr_Q said:

RX8 with it's "can flood" engine or the new Stang?

One is a road course car, the other a 1/4 mile eater. Although the Stang can be made to run with the best of them on a track. The new one most likely even more so. Still the RX8 handles like it's on rails...bigtime.

Whatcha think?

Click to expand...

If you are considering Japanese cars. Why don't you test drive the Lancer Evo and WRX STi?

If you think that RX8 handles like on rail, the Evo is gonna blow all of your expectations .

Personally I would choose the RX8 over the other mentioned Japanese cars...reason being the design alone. I think the RX8 is a bolder and more sophisticated statement. Even the last generation RX7 was am amazing performer when setup correctly. One of my good friends had one and it was amazing.

Back to your original question.....RX8 or Mustang(GT), thats a hard one to answer. Thats really a personal decision, but I will say this much, it doesn't always come straight down to 1/4 mile numbers on paper. I would say test drive them both and see what you like. Good luck.

Mustang GT has twice the torque of the RX8, I doubt the RX8 can even spin the tires.

RX8 is not that fast. I test drove it and wasn't impressed. Styling is very subjective. However, you must be crazy not test driving those 2 aforementioned cars if you are really into performance.

Coming on a mustang forum and asking that question is going to get you some pretty predictable answers. And asking that question before anyone has any real data on the 05's handling. Is not going to give you any real facts. The 05 has a redesigned suspension that noone has test driven. I'd say wait until you can drive it. Then make a decision.

It's actually a great question, if you're an open-minded enthusiast...

I've previously owned a first gen RX7 and an '88 LX 5.0. I currently drive a BMW 325is that needs replacing. The current Mustang, to me, has too much NVH and is a little too unsophisticated in its design. Don't flame - I know many of you drive a Mustang FOR its NVH and crudeness! Day in and day out, the ergonomics, noise, and jouncy suspension would be too much for me. That's too bad, because I can get a brand new GT coupe for pretty cheep these days. But I wouldn't be happy in the end.

I've been debating between a Lexus IS300 and the RX8 for a few months. I may be buying in Feb/March, so I need to make a decision soon. I knew Ford was developing the '05 and it seemed to be a giant leap forward..then the Ford press release comes out, and except the live axle being retained (for the time being, and I'm not interested in waiting for the new Cobra), the new Mustang looks to be a fantastic car. I may reconsider and wait for the new Mustang.

What I'll say about the RX8 is that it's hands down one of the most enjoyable cars to drive that I've ever been in. It's easy to drive fast but you can also short shift it if and take it easy if you want. It's well built and comfortable, and fairly quiet.

The engine makes incredibly cool sounds, is smoother than a V8, maybe even smoother than a inline 6, and though it doesn't have a lot off the line, it's a blast to run up through the gears. It will definitely smoke the tires with the traction control switched off. It's not like a little four banger, it feels more like a straight six cuz it's so smooth. The handling is one of the best compromises between a tolerable ride and high limits of grip. The car is very hard to get unsettled. The low overall height allows the car to make very quick changes in direction.

On my first test drive I got it in a beautiful four wheel drift around a medium sweeper in third gear at about 50mph. It was so easy to control, both with the steering and the throttle. No, it's not a drag mobile, and some of you won't like it because of that. But if you don't want to race Mustangs or boosted imports in a straight line, if you just drive for yourself, I'd say it's one of the best cars in the world. On another test drive I took an already broken-in demo up to redline in the first three gears. The car was quick and made ungodly cool sounds. Rotaries are like nothing else and this new Renesis engine has more a more bassy sound than the old rotary 12A and 13B engines.

On the other hand, what I like about the new Mustang is this:
You will be able to get in and out of it easily - without crouching down low.
It will have gobs of low end torque - if I want to kiss goodbye the backwards facing baseball cap wearing slammed Civic with 20"'s B-Boys , I can dig in to some monster off the line punch and do it. But that would be immature, wouldn't it?
It has a new platform with much better weight distribution - 54F/46R, I believe. The car will be able to get more of its power down on the pavement. It will handle with more balance, and therefore, be more fun to drive.
The car will be quieter than the current Mustang, and in general,the NVH will be greatly improved. This will make the car more enjoyable everyday and especially on long trips.
It will benefit from Ford's recent upgrading of interiors in both design, fit, and materials.
It will be available in GT trim for somewhere near $25k..unless the dealers mark it up. Maybe they won't - there are a lot of performance cars out there these days.

Basically, the '05 will appeal to a lot of people who can't accept the shortcomings of the current design. People who drive Bimmers or Nissan VQ RWD coupes but would love to have an American V8 coupe that is modern enough so they don't have to make compromises. I'm that kind of person. And, Ford needs people like me to buy the Mustang. They'll always have the diehards with undying loyalty who would never consider any other car. But that's a small niche. Sure, they killed the F-Bodies, at least for a while but the GTO is an nice vehicle. In fact, I'd check out a GTO but it's a little pricey. So, yeah, considering between an RX8 and the '05 Mustang isn't as weird as it seems.

I just wish the '05 was out now so I could compare it to the RX8. That being said, I'll probably go with the RX8. That doesn't mean I won't admire the '05 Mustang when it arrives.

Oh yeah, I've been gone for a while - when is the '05 going to show up at the dealers' lots?

Really good post but I have to say something about a few comments.

Bad on the live rear-axle? Absolutely not. One of the best decisions by far. Straight throwback. This car IS more than a car, it is heritage, and Ford is making that statement.

Quieter? Less rattles and such, cool. Anything else...not a good thing. Why? Because although women may flock to them, the Mustang is still a man's car, period. I prefer mine loud and in charge. Does it get annoying sometimes? Yes, sometimes. But most of the time it is just right, and on Sunday, it's perfect. Stock, it was much less than loud.

Yes, Lexus definetely has it's place and purpose, but Mustang is Mustang.

I finally got to get a good look at a RX8 yesterday (you see, Dunn isn't exactly known for itssports car population, but if you want a jacked up pickup truck, you're in heaven) and I was pleasantly surprised. It looked better than I thought it would with those suic, er, make that reverse-opening doors. Must be PC, you know. Even the lights look cooler than I expected. A lot more interesting than everyday, run-of-the-mill Altezzas that are everywhere now.

162Lb of Spine Compressing TQ sounds thrilling to me!

Yeah that's what? Half the mustang gt's torque.

Maybe it was another car but I could have sworn I read an article somewhere saying Mazda was bending over in "buy backs" for people who were unsatisfied and giving gift certificates to people who were keeping their RX8's. From what I can remember from the article Mazda had overrated their RX8's by about 40hp on the auto trans versions in their initial power ratings due to the fact that their auto tranny couldn't rev high enough to fully utilize it's full potential. However like I said I could be mistaking this one for another car, I don't keep up on my import homework due to lack of interest.

Nope, that was the RX-8.

the best RPM to launch and RX8 at is something liek 7k RPM,dumping the clutch. breathtakingly fast..........hahahaah, i do liek that car a lot though

Good points as well but I hear the flooding issue is greatly exaggerated..

I've been hanging out at RX8Club for awhile and while yes, some people are reporting flooding, it doesn't seem to be a deal killer for the car, and though I don't know about the numbers on your poll, the consensus at the site seems to be that the flooding issue is over reported.

BTW, I had an 13B RX7 for three years/50k miles and it never flooded. Not once. The new car's engine isn't fundamentally different except for its side exhaust ports. Some people even flood their modern piston powered cars. I don't know how, but they do it.

I'm actually more concerned about gas mileage with the the RX8. Some people are experiencing city mileage in the low teens and highway in the high teens. This seems to be somewhat isolated and there's talk that the ECU runs rich thru the first few thousand miles and then leans out a bit, improving mileage. Funny, but the Mustang might actually get better mileage than the RX...

The last consideration,and I didn't mention it in my post, is depreciation values. I would anticipate the Mustang losing its value faster than the RX. That's due to nothing other than the perception of American cars not being as durable as Japanese - i.e., not necessarily true, but potentially an economic issue.

IMO, you should take another look at the Lancer EVO. It doesn't share many body panels with a Lancer, actually... the rear fender (the actual sheetmetal) is different, the rear doors are different, front fenders -- different, hood -- different, and of course bumpers, side skirts, and spoiler (obvious)... The fenders are different to house MUCH bigger wheels/tires than a stock EVO body could hold.... On top of that, they provide a nice "wide track" stance, where the rear wheels are actually wider than the front.....

Personally, if I was into any kind of racing other than drag racing, I'd go buy me an EVO. Come on, it will blow the doors off the RX8 in every category -- and you can actually hold 4 adults in an EVO.... Those rear doors on the RX8 are insulting.

I think you'd be doing yourself a disservice if you didn't at least go drive an EVO.

Good luck,

Michael

Mr_Q said:

Oh yeah said:

That was very well said. And I feel exactly the same.

The cars [2005 stangs] are supposed to show up around Sept.

I drove the RX8 twice and yes it is a dream car for the curves. I wouldn't buy an Sti or EVO because they look like import econo-sedans with tacky scoops and wings bolted on. The RX8 actually LOOKS cool. The interior is spot on and seating and driver position are perfect.

But I think the best thing to do is wait for the new Stang. I have heard too many horror stories about the rotory motor's flooding. In a poll on an RX8 forum 35% said they had a flood within the first 6 months of ownership! That was out of 334 people.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Thanks for the non-flamey response.

But, I really think the live axle, despite what Ford sez about the focus groups demanding it, is back because its cheeper to make. Maybe the car is better at drags if it has a live axle, but I really don't think enough everyday drivers would prefer the live axle to an native IRS set up for the street.

What's also questionable is that many enthusiast cars with IRS have no trouble getting great launches with IRS set ups. Maybe it has something to do with weight distrobution. I know the Vette, with its IRS launches pretty well.

Anyway, the solid axle won't be better going around corners, especially if the corners have bumps, and the ride quality won't be as good either. Drivers moving up from entry level and straight line types won't or don't care, but folks moving laterally or down market will. I can live with it if the rest of the car is as good as it seems to be. I think the most important "heritage" components of the car are the V8, RWD, and a long hood /short deck configuration.

With respect to NVH, the bad stuff that I hope is gone would be low frequency vibration from the flexible flyer Fox derived platform, unnecessary exhaust drone, road noise and drivetrain roar, and annoying ride motions from the cheesy old 4 link rear suspension. The press release sez they've done a lot to improve the '05 car in these areas. In terms of manly-man noise, if the bothersome NVH is eliminated, a little exhaust rumble, intake roar, and mechanical music from the engine internals is fine. The cool sounds aren't necessarily about volume level - it's the character of the sound that does a lot to impart a sporty feel to the car. If folks want to be noticed, offer optional exhaust and or intake option packages like Porsche does with its MotorSound options. The stocker doesn't have to be that loud.

Funny, but I'm much more impressed with a fast, powerful car that's relatively quiet rather than loud. Take a ride in a NorthStar equipped Caddy. Those cars are pretty fast for their size and all you hear is an awesome subdued multivalve V8 roar when you open them up. No, I'm not saying make the '05 Mustang as quiet as a Caddy, but it doesn't need to be rip roaring loud in stock form - a mild dual set up with good rasp but not too much droning resonance will be fine. If people want more noise, that's what Borla and the rest of them there muffler boys are for...

I would agree that it was likely brought in more for expense. But I would also have to argue that many everyday drivers don't get into the throotle far enough for IRS to make it that much of a factor. With the bulk of mustangs being V6. And between v6 and drag racers. It just doesn't seem there are enough people to appreciate the IRS difference. We also have yet to get any real world tests on an 05 stang. So we don't know how well it will handle.

Mr Q:
Do you want a 1/4 mile car or a track car. Maybe I should put it this way: do you want a car that is fast off the line or a car that handles extremely well?