Intake?

Grn92LX · Sep 18, 2004

We butt heads when we have disagreements, which is cool. Your math is flawed. 300 fly IS 245-255rwhp like I said using a 15-18% loss. Not sure what kinda loss % your using???

Sounds like your friends car wasn't a 347 huh? When he did the LT swap, did he change his tune? I'm not gonna argue, LT's are proven to be better so I dont even have to argue

Maybe you should talk to ed c since you seem to use his advice a lot. I'm willing to bet he says LT's would be good for you as would a 70-75mm TB Find someone to buy my 65mm tb and 80mm 24lb pro m

Also, if your looking for et gain, you need a baseline pass first to see where your at. Garantee LT's and a 75mm TB port matched to your inlet get you an et drop

final5-0 · Sep 19, 2004

iowabowhunter said:
I have a 95 vert.
What is the bottle neck in these cars? Is it the upper plenum or the lower intake? The reason I ask is cause I'm shooting for 300 N/A flywheel hp which I've been told is obtainable even without a cam swap. I was thinking about going with a Cobra or aftermarket setup, but I have read on here about a guy named Tom Moss that does porting of the lower intake real cheap. Will a ported lower work as well as a Cobra?

Let me tell you something from experience

300 flywheel hp is not as much fun as 300 to the wheels

You will want, no, NEED more hp

Pick the parts for your combo that will really make you happy or you will be buying them twice

We don't want to talk about how I know that kind of thing happens

Later
Grady

5spd GT · Sep 19, 2004

Grn92LX said:
We butt heads when we have disagreements, which is cool. Your math is flawed. 300 fly IS 245-255rwhp like I said using a 15-18% loss. Not sure what kinda loss % your using???

Sounds like your friends car wasn't a 347 huh? When he did the LT swap, did he change his tune? I'm not gonna argue, LT's are proven to be better so I dont even have to argue

Maybe you should talk to ed c since you seem to use his advice a lot. I'm willing to bet he says LT's would be good for you as would a 70-75mm TB Find someone to buy my 65mm tb and 80mm 24lb pro m

Also, if your looking for et gain, you need a baseline pass first to see where your at. Garantee LT's and a 75mm TB port matched to your inlet get you an et drop

Hmm...well my friend had a bigger TB, longtubes, and 373's...and the previous owner told him it was a 347 (I know it had a cam in it)...but stock heads and intake and he would run with my full bolt-on car, gears, an full exhaust...and I was a better driver...he is selling it now because it gives him to many problems...

No, my statement was there is nothing wrong with shorty's...sure longtubes are better for a higher breathing car...but there is nothing wrong with shorty's..and calling them "gay" is just that...

Yes I take Ed's advice...but again I have no problems with going with longtubes...but again there is nothing wrong with shorty's...

Bigger is not always better....

Nothing wrong with going with shorties...no need to change to longtubes over shorties with anything less than with an aftermarket h/c/i...

Yes 255rwhp would be 300flywheel...but you said orginally 245rwhp...forgot to mention that huh

Grn92LX · Sep 19, 2004

5spd GT said:
Hmm...well my friend had a bigger TB, longtubes, and 373's...and the previous owner told him it was a 347 (I know it had a cam in it)...but stock heads and intake and he would run with my full bolt-on car, gears, an full exhaust...and I was a better driver...he is selling it now because it gives him to many problems...

No, my statement was there is nothing wrong with shorty's...sure longtubes are better for a higher breathing car...but there is nothing wrong with shorty's..and calling them "gay" is just that...

Yes I take Ed's advice...but again I have no problems with going with longtubes...but again there is nothing wrong with shorty's...

Bigger is not always better....

Nothing wrong with going with shorties...no need to change to longtubes over shorties with anything less than with an aftermarket h/c/i...

Yes 255rwhp would be 300flywheel...but you said orginally 245rwhp...forgot to mention that huh

What math are you using, dude? 300 FLY is 245-255rwhp depending what loss % you use. I use 15-18%. What are you talking about with 'bigger is not always better'? We're talking the same 1 5/8" primaries. LT's are the way to go and i'm sticking with it. Im speaking with EXPERIENCE, not internet hearsay. I'm bored, so maybe i'll PM a few bolt on guys to come in here and post their GAINS from shortys to LT's

When are you going to the track? What do you think it'll do?

5spd GT · Sep 19, 2004

Grn92LX said:
What math are you using, dude? 300 FLY is 245-255rwhp depending what loss % you use. I use 15-18%. What are you talking about with 'bigger is not always better'? We're talking the same 1 5/8" primaries. LT's are the way to go and i'm sticking with it. Im speaking with EXPERIENCE, not internet hearsay. I'm bored, so maybe i'll PM a few bolt on guys to come in here and post their GAINS from shortys to LT's

When are you going to the track? What do you think it'll do?

I'm using the "5spd" math (15%)...yes that is 255rwhp...because I'm assuming the oringinal poster has a 5spd...

Bigger is better - That is a general statement and can be referred to TB's, MAF's, exhaust diameter, heads, intakes, cams, etc...etc...

Internet hearsay...lol...I'm "speaking" from experience to...friend had longtubes...but I do know that the 4.6L loves the longtubes but not as much as the ls1...have a couple friends with a 96 and 98 Cobra...

Pm them...I want to see E.T. gains...I never denied that...no need to switch from aftermarket shorties to the same size primary longtubes...money could be spent elsewhere...like a tune? gears? etc...

Well I'm getting the clutch put in this coming weekend...hope it goes smoothly...and then the next week I'm going to get new valve covers on there and set up my valve train a little better (the guideplates)...readjust the valves...and then I just got to get to the track...I haven't gotten on it through multiple gears...but I know it is much quicker and drives fine...but I am on some low treaded radials and will get some DR's after a while...hopefully before the track closes down here...(end of October normally)...

Grn92LX · Sep 19, 2004

Here are shorty to longtube results I found doing a search on corral. Read CleanLX's response. Thats on a stock car too http://www.corral.net/forums/showthread.php?t=513321

I PM'd another dude who did the swap o a bolt on car. He gained 3mph at the track but im hoping he'll chime in to add more. Do you have AIM? I have another graph i'd like to show you but on a h/c/i car. This has a nice gain in the mid range and I do mean nice!! Give me your AIM name if possible.

EDIT, sorry, thats stock headers/off road H to longtubes. My bad. But we all know shortys do nothing on a stock 5.0. Hopefully the other dude will chime in.

5spd GT · Sep 19, 2004

Grn92LX said:
Here are shorty to longtube results I found doing a search on corral. Read CleanLX's response. Thats on a stock car too http://www.corral.net/forums/showthread.php?t=513321

I PM'd another dude who did the swap o a bolt on car. He gained 3mph at the track but im hoping he'll chime in to add more. Do you have AIM? I have another graph i'd like to show you but on a h/c/i car. This has a nice gain in the mid range and I do mean nice!! Give me your AIM name if possible.

EDIT, sorry, thats stock headers/off road H to longtubes. My bad. But we all know shortys do nothing on a stock 5.0. Hopefully the other dude will chime in.

That is some very nice gains...but I was talking about (like in my previous post) from AFTERMARKET shorty's to longtubes...not from stock headers to longtubes...

Sorry man...no AIM...how would I go about setting that up anyways...

Just now noticed your Edit: Shorties do help...there are dyno numbers to prove that...know if I could only be "not lazy" enough and find them...and no we don't all know

Grn92LX · Sep 19, 2004

Go to www.aim.com When you set the screename up, let me know

Shortys do next to nothing on a stock 5.0 mang. The guy I PM'd went from aftermarket shortys to LT's fwiw.

5spd GT · Sep 19, 2004

Grn92LX said:
Go to www.aim.com When you set the screename up, let me know

Shortys do next to nothing on a stock 5.0 mang. The guy I PM'd went from aftermarket shortys to LT's fwiw.

They do something

Do you got MSN messenger?...I do...or would that acheive the same affect?

Grn92LX · Sep 19, 2004

No I only have AIM. Its a free DL fwiw. This was we can instant message each other w/o taking over this dudes thread anymore than we have haha. I had a dyno graph I wanted to show you.

Stock Ford 'headers' are awesome from the factory and installing a 1 5/8" shorty on a stock or near stock car will do next to nothing and certainly wont get you $200+ worth of benefit. Fwiw, I consider 2-3hp next to nothing

5spd GT · Sep 19, 2004

Grn92LX said:
No I only have AIM. Its a free DL fwiw. This was we can instant message each other w/o taking over this dudes thread anymore than we have haha. I had a dyno graph I wanted to show you.

Stock Ford 'headers' are awesome from the factory and installing a 1 5/8" shorty on a stock or near stock car will do next to nothing and certainly wont get you $200+ worth of benefit. Fwiw, I consider 2-3hp next to nothing

Okay this is the last "offtopic" response I'll put in this guy's thread...

You can get shorty headers for $130 bucks new...you'll make more than 2-3 horse...

My computer is having fits right now...I might download it one of these days...I get pop-ups gallore...and a couple viruses that aid to that...

Grn92LX · Sep 19, 2004

Heres a virus scan and if anything comes up, just delete it http://housecall.trendmicro.com/

No, on a stock/bolt on car, you wont see much more than 2-3hp

zenboy99 · Sep 19, 2004

zenboy99 said:
Long tubes help with scavenging, its not about how much they flow. My roomate gained 8hp switching to long tubes, and he gained alot in the midrange.

Check out the 5L Ford dyno tests book, it says pretty much the same thing.

Did you guys fail to see this post from me? I will post the dyno numbers from the book later on tonight.

5spd GT · Sep 19, 2004

zenboy99 said:
Did you guys fail to see this post from me? I will post the dyno numbers from the book later on tonight.

We seen it...now back to the intake?

Grn92LX · Sep 19, 2004

I want to get a holley systemax Intake and a jay allen custom grind and get rid of my fti cam and TFS street intake. Hows that for back to the topic?

Zen, I KNOW longtubes are better and your frends car is yet another example of that

25thmustang · Sep 19, 2004

Ok I didnt read all these posts but I will share my Long Tube experience and tell you exactly what i did and what difference it made...

My original combo was Mac 1 5/8" shorties into a Mac 2 1/2" H-pipe with cats, and a 2 1/2" Flowmaster catback. With this set up the car pulled an unimpressive 13.89 @ 97.99.

I switched to Mac 1 5/8" Long Tubes, Mac 2 1/2" Prochamber, same catback, and added pulleys. With this combo I ended up running 13.05 @ 103.45.

My car LOVED long tubes and no cats. Not all cars will react the same, but mine sure did well with them. I am a strong believer in them!

5spd GT · Sep 19, 2004

Very nice gains

tmoss · Sep 19, 2004

RIO5.0 said:
I re-dyno'd here recently swapping from a tmoss stock lower to his Cobra lower...I netted 10 ponies in the deal...Im at 302FWHP...as said...the stock lower is pretty damn good for the power range your shooting for...I run a Steeda 19 cam though...

Andy has been kind enough to give me his dyno sheets. I have attached the results of two of his dynos, one with my lower and one with the Cobra, so this is a comparison of the two on the SAME car. If you look at the graphs you will note that average HP over the rpm band was virtually the SAME, with the differences being in the shape of the torque curves - mine has more low-mid range torque and the Cobra made more from 4,400 up. Also notice that the graph starts at 3,000 rpm - my lower would have shown substantially more torque from 2,000-3,000 rpm.........

Edit: YOu can find more info on dyno numbers and generally helpful info by (c)licking on the "My Garage" link below my avatar.

wytstang · Sep 19, 2004

tmoss said:
Edit: YOu can find more info on dyno numbers and generally helpful info by licking on the "My Garage" link below my avatar.

Don't listen to him it doesn't work

loud 95 · Sep 20, 2004

To get back to the original question, I would recommend you spend the money and buy a good aftermarket upper and lower (TFS, Holley, Edelbrock), as part of an intake swap. These intakes outflow cobra/explorer units quite easily. The question, of course, is money. If you have enough for a decent aftermarket unit, you should purchase one. This will allow your intake to grow with your combo. My friend started out like you, then built an engine similar to mine. Now, he has a sportsman block, forged internals, ported to hell victor Jr.'s, and his cobra intake. The cobra is ported, but still does not provide enough air to maximize his heads and cam, so he is looking at a Victor Jr. upper and lower. My stang has not yet been dino tuned, but makes easily over 300 flywheel hp. I am a college student, so my money was tight. I put my engine combo together for about a grand (not including exhaust), and have just purchased mass-air and injectors. Look around for deals on good parts, and start with the basic bolt-ons.

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